Musings around environments, cloud credentials, and the new Juju Controllers

[Rick Harding]

The goal is to get the user onto 'best practices' out of the box and
deploying into the controller environment isn't best practice since it's no
longer as easily transient. If you bootstrap, deploy something to try it
out, then realize you want to try something else you can't just destroy
that single environment. The whole controller has to go down and get
restarted. The goal is that as soon as you start working it's light weight
and easy to destroy/restart without a new bootstrap. I think that trade off
is worth the change for existing users that machine 0 doesn't appear there
out of the box.

Rick

On Fri, Nov 13, 2015 at 6:45 AM roger peppe <roger.peppe at canonical.com>
wrote:

> On 13 November 2015 at 11:27, John Meinel <john at arbash-meinel.com> wrote:
> > But does machine-0 show up in environments outside of the controller
> > environment? I thought we were intentionally hiding it to help keep your
> > environments cleaner.
>
> No, it doesn't, and that's correct, because no-one outside the initial
> environment
> should be able to deploy to state server machines.
>
> The question here is whether you should see the controller environment
> after bootstrap.
>
> Personally I had no problem with the idea that the initial environment
> (the bootstrapped environment) was the admin-level envirionment
> that could be used to start admin-level services
> and in which the machines used by the controller are visible.
>
> As a naive user, if I did juju bootstrap followed by juju status and
> saw no machines
> (when it is actually using an instance) I think I'd be confused.
>
>   cheers,
>     rog.
>
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