Subject: Mir bug importance

From: Daniel van Vugt <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 10:07:22 +0800

All,

As we focus on the most severe bugs, it's worth discussing what bug 
severity actually is. I don't want to confuse everyone with a detailed 
examination/discussion/argument. But to start with, I think we need to 
agree on what "Critical" means...

Normally critical means that the system is unusable [1]. Good examples 
of definitely critical bugs are:

"Mir/unity-system-compositor fails to start: Error opening DRM device"
https://bugs.launchpad.net/mir/+bug/1206633

"[radeon] Graphic glitches and screen corruption (vertical lines) on 
XMir surfaces only"
https://bugs.launchpad.net/mir/+bug/1218815

These are bugs which prevent the machine from being usable. But if it's 
not that bad, then please consider marking bugs as High or Medium.

- Daniel

[1] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Importance

---

From: Robert Ancell <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 14:31:34 +1200

Kevin Gunn, correct me if I'm wrong, but the way we were using bugs was
Critical = Needs to be fixed for 13.10 release.

[1] refers to the Ubuntu bug importances, not project bug importances. The
reason for that page is there was inconsistency between different Ubuntu
packages. As an upstream project, I don't think we have to follow these
definitions.

When you change the importance, Launchpad has the following description for
each value:

Undecided - Not decided yet. Maybe needs more discussion.
Critical - Fix now or as soon as possible.
High - Schedule to be fixed soon.
Medium - Fix when convenient, or schedule to fix later.
Low - Fix when convenient.
Wishlist - Not a bug. It's an enhancement/new feature.

Which I think are good guides for how we should use them. i.e. Critical =
fix now, regardless of how much damage the actual bug causes. A missing
feature that needs to be done before release could be critical, or a
feature that's blocking other teams.

Note, I really don't understand the above definition for Medium, especially
how it compares to Low :)

--Robert

On Tue, Sep 10, 2013 at 2:07 PM, Daniel van Vugt <
[email-masked]> wrote:

> examination/discussion/**argument. But to start with, I think we need to
> Normally critical means that the system is unusable [1]. Good examples of
> definitely critical bugs are:
>
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/**mir/+bug/1206633<https://bugs.launchpad.net/mir/+bug/1206633>
>
> "[radeon] Graphic glitches and screen corruption (vertical lines) on XMir
> surfaces only"
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/**mir/+bug/1218815<https://bugs.launchpad.net/mir/+bug/1218815>
>
> [1] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/**Importance<https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Importance>
>
> --
> Mir-devel mailing list
> [email-masked]
> Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/**
> mailman/listinfo/mir-devel<https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/mir-devel>
>

---

From: Robert Ancell <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 14:35:32 +1200

Also worth mentioning about bugs:

I've been moving all the Ubuntu bugs against Mir to Mir project bugs. This
is what the software center team did as it makes it simpler to just have
one bug list.

--Robert

---

From: Daniel van Vugt <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 10:38:22 +0800

I suspected that was the case, and I think that approach is flawed. By 
your rules, you're giving equal weighting to:

"The system is broken and cannot start"
vs
"Power management is not implemented yet"

If you mark everything as "critical" you lose sight of the fact that the 
first one is actually much more important than the second.

- Daniel

On 10/09/13 10:31, Robert Ancell wrote:
> [1] refers to the Ubuntu bug importances, not project bug importances.
> The reason for that page is there was inconsistency between different
> Ubuntu packages. As an upstream project, I don't think we have to follow
> these definitions.
>
> When you change the importance, Launchpad has the following description
> for each value:
>
> Which I think are good guides for how we should use them. i.e. Critical
> = fix now, regardless of how much damage the actual bug causes. A
> missing feature that needs to be done before release could be critical,
> or a feature that's blocking other teams.
>
> Note, I really don't understand the above definition for Medium,
> especially how it compares to Low :)
>
> --Robert
>
>
> On Tue, Sep 10, 2013 at 2:07 PM, Daniel van Vugt
> <[email-masked] <mailto:[email-masked]>>
> wrote:
>
>     All,
>
>     severity actually is. I don't want to confuse everyone with a
>     detailed examination/discussion/__argument. But to start with, I
>     think we need to agree on what "Critical" means...
>
>     Normally critical means that the system is unusable [1]. Good
>     examples of definitely critical bugs are:
>
>     https://bugs.launchpad.net/__mir/+bug/1206633
>     <https://bugs.launchpad.net/mir/+bug/1206633>
>
>     https://bugs.launchpad.net/__mir/+bug/1218815
>     <https://bugs.launchpad.net/mir/+bug/1218815>
>
>     These are bugs which prevent the machine from being usable. But if
>     it's not that bad, then please consider marking bugs as High or Medium.
>
>     - Daniel
>
>     [1] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/__Importance
>     <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Importance>
>
>     --
>     Mir-devel mailing list
>     [email-masked] <mailto:[email-masked]>
>     Modify settings or unsubscribe at:
>     https://lists.ubuntu.com/__mailman/listinfo/mir-devel
>     <https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/mir-devel>
>
>

---

From: Daniel van Vugt <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 10:40:13 +0800

That's also not accurate. If a bug has crept into distro then it  should 
have a distro task: "mir (ubuntu)"

This is necessary to distinguish between a fix that has landed in 
upstream Mir, but not yet landed in Ubuntu distro.

- Daniel

On 10/09/13 10:35, Robert Ancell wrote:
> I've been moving all the Ubuntu bugs against Mir to Mir project bugs.
> This is what the software center team did as it makes it simpler to just
> have one bug list.
>
> --Robert
>
>

---

From: Robert Ancell <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 15:30:14 +1200

Note the field is actually "importance" not "severity" - thus is makes
sense for "Power management is not implemented yet" to be more important
than "The system is broken and cannot start" in certain cases, e.g. if the
second only affects a small number of people and the former needs to be
done by feature freeze.

--Robert

On Tue, Sep 10, 2013 at 2:38 PM, Daniel van Vugt <
[email-masked]> wrote:

>> <[email-masked] <mailto:daniel.van.vugt@**canonical.com<[email-masked]>
>> >>
>>
>> wrote:
>>
>>     All,
>>
>>     detailed examination/discussion/__**argument. But to start with, I
>>
>>     https://bugs.launchpad.net/__**mir/+bug/1206633<https://bugs.launchpad.net/__mir/+bug/1206633>
>>
>>     <https://bugs.launchpad.net/**mir/+bug/1206633<https://bugs.launchpad.net/mir/+bug/1206633>
>> >
>>
>>     https://bugs.launchpad.net/__**mir/+bug/1218815<https://bugs.launchpad.net/__mir/+bug/1218815>
>>
>>     <https://bugs.launchpad.net/**mir/+bug/1218815<https://bugs.launchpad.net/mir/+bug/1218815>
>> >
>>
>>     [1] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/_**_Importance<https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/__Importance>
>>
>>     <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/**Importance<https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Importance>
>> >
>>
>>     --
>>     Mir-devel mailing list
>>     [email-masked] <mailto:Mir-devel@lists.**ubuntu.com<[email-masked]>
>> >
>>
>>     https://lists.ubuntu.com/__**mailman/listinfo/mir-devel<https://lists.ubuntu.com/__mailman/listinfo/mir-devel>
>>     <https://lists.ubuntu.com/**mailman/listinfo/mir-devel<https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/mir-devel>
>> >
>>
>>
>>

---

From: Robert Ancell <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 15:33:14 +1200

It is more accurate, but it takes a lot more work.
- Not all bugs will be correctly marked when they affect both the project
and the distro which means you need to look at two (overlapping) bug lists
to find all the Mir bugs
- Since Mir is autolanded into the distro the Mir list == the distro list.

--Robert

On Tue, Sep 10, 2013 at 2:40 PM, Daniel van Vugt <
[email-masked]> wrote:

> This is necessary to distinguish between a fix that has landed in upstream
> Mir, but not yet landed in Ubuntu distro.
>
> - Daniel
>
>
>

---

From: Daniel van Vugt <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 11:37:20 +0800

To assert that any Mir bug only affects a small number of people is 
dangerous. As Mir is not enabled by default, and the audience is 
presently opt-in experimenters, the Mir user base is still microscopic 
compared to that of Ubuntu in general.

We probably have to assume that a bug "affecting" one person now could 
affect hundreds of thousands of people later. Some might say "millions"...

On 10/09/13 11:30, Robert Ancell wrote:
> than "The system is broken and cannot start" in certain cases, e.g. if
> the second only affects a small number of people and the former needs to
> be done by feature freeze.
>
> --Robert
>
>
> On Tue, Sep 10, 2013 at 2:38 PM, Daniel van Vugt
>     I suspected that was the case, and I think that approach is flawed.
>     By your rules, you're giving equal weighting to:
>
>     If you mark everything as "critical" you lose sight of the fact that
>     the first one is actually much more important than the second.
>
>     - Daniel
>
>
>
>         <[email-masked]
>         <mailto:[email-masked]>
>         <mailto:[email-masked]
>         <mailto:[email-masked]>>>
>
>         wrote:
>
>              All,
>
>              detailed examination/discussion/____argument. But to start
>         with, I
>
>         https://bugs.launchpad.net/____mir/+bug/1206633
>         <https://bugs.launchpad.net/__mir/+bug/1206633>
>
>              <https://bugs.launchpad.net/__mir/+bug/1206633
>         <https://bugs.launchpad.net/mir/+bug/1206633>>
>
>         https://bugs.launchpad.net/____mir/+bug/1218815
>         <https://bugs.launchpad.net/__mir/+bug/1218815>
>
>              <https://bugs.launchpad.net/__mir/+bug/1218815
>         <https://bugs.launchpad.net/mir/+bug/1218815>>
>
>              [1] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/____Importance
>         <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/__Importance>
>
>              <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/__Importance
>         <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/Importance>>
>
>              --
>              Mir-devel mailing list
>         <mailto:[email-masked]
>         <mailto:[email-masked]>>
>
>         https://lists.ubuntu.com/____mailman/listinfo/mir-devel
>         <https://lists.ubuntu.com/__mailman/listinfo/mir-devel>
>              <https://lists.ubuntu.com/__mailman/listinfo/mir-devel
>         <https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/mir-devel>>
>
>
>

---

From: Robert Ancell <[email-masked]>
Date: Tue, 10 Sep 2013 16:13:10 +1200

This of course is just an example, but the rationale might be - a small
number of beta testers with certain hardware combination might be affected
by that bug, where no-one can make their system sleep until the power
management bug is fixed. Thus, the power management one might be a bigger
blocker to beta users.

Importances are not set in stone - they will change over the lifetime of
the project. By the time Mir is released, any of the bugs Medium or above
are likely to hit a large number of users.

On Tue, Sep 10, 2013 at 3:37 PM, Daniel van Vugt <
[email-masked]> wrote:

> dangerous. As Mir is not enabled by default, and the audience is presently
> opt-in experimenters, the Mir user base is still microscopic compared to
> that of Ubuntu in general.
>
>>         <mailto:daniel.van.vugt@**canonical.com<[email-masked]>
>> >
>>         <mailto:daniel.van.vugt@__cano**nical.com <http://canonical.com>
>>
>>         <mailto:daniel.van.vugt@**canonical.com<[email-masked]>
>> >>>
>>
>>         wrote:
>>
>>              All,
>>
>>              detailed examination/discussion/____**argument. But to start
>>
>>         with, I
>>
>>         https://bugs.launchpad.net/___**_mir/+bug/1206633<https://bugs.launchpad.net/____mir/+bug/1206633>
>>         <https://bugs.launchpad.net/__**mir/+bug/1206633<https://bugs.launchpad.net/__mir/+bug/1206633>
>> >
>>
>>
>>              <https://bugs.launchpad.net/__**mir/+bug/1206633<https://bugs.launchpad.net/__mir/+bug/1206633>
>>         https://bugs.launchpad.net/___**_mir/+bug/1218815<https://bugs.launchpad.net/____mir/+bug/1218815>
>>         <https://bugs.launchpad.net/__**mir/+bug/1218815<https://bugs.launchpad.net/__mir/+bug/1218815>
>> >
>>
>>
>>              <https://bugs.launchpad.net/__**mir/+bug/1218815<https://bugs.launchpad.net/__mir/+bug/1218815>
>>              [1] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/_**___Importance<https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/____Importance>
>>         <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/**__Importance<https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/__Importance>
>> >
>>
>>
>>              <https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/**__Importance<https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Bugs/__Importance>
>>         <mailto:[email-masked]**tu.com <http://ubuntu.com>
>>
>>         <mailto:Mir-devel@lists.**ubuntu.com <[email-masked]>
>> >>
>>
>>         https://lists.ubuntu.com/____**mailman/listinfo/mir-devel<https://lists.ubuntu.com/____mailman/listinfo/mir-devel>
>>         <https://lists.ubuntu.com/__**mailman/listinfo/mir-devel<https://lists.ubuntu.com/__mailman/listinfo/mir-devel>
>> >
>>              <https://lists.ubuntu.com/__**mailman/listinfo/mir-devel<https://lists.ubuntu.com/__mailman/listinfo/mir-devel>