From kb8aey at verizon.net Mon Oct 1 16:40:51 2007 From: kb8aey at verizon.net (mike coulombe) Date: Mon, 01 Oct 2007 11:40:51 -0500 (CDT) Subject: speech dispatcher Message-ID: <0JP8009MZRO23WE0@vms048.mailsrvcs.net> Hi, I have been happy with speech-dispatcher, but notice the e-speak voices don't change when you pick another voice. Has anyone else had this problem. Mike. From kb8aey at verizon.net Mon Oct 1 17:55:42 2007 From: kb8aey at verizon.net (mike coulombe) Date: Mon, 01 Oct 2007 12:55:42 -0500 (CDT) Subject: heed help with the help system Message-ID: <0JP800AJVV4TVVJ4@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> Hi, how do you use the gnome help with orca, or doesn't this work. I see topics, but don't know how to get to the text to read about them. Mike. X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 000777-4, 09/30/2007), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean From softy.lofty.ilp at btinternet.com Mon Oct 1 22:12:17 2007 From: softy.lofty.ilp at btinternet.com (Ian Pascoe) Date: Mon, 1 Oct 2007 23:12:17 +0100 Subject: Accessability in Edubuntu Message-ID: Hi Can anyone confirm whether Edubuntu, which I believe ships with the Gnome desktop, has Orca and associated components pre-packaged within the Live CD, or if it has to be downloaded afterwards? Ian From themuso at themuso.com Tue Oct 2 01:11:28 2007 From: themuso at themuso.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2007 11:11:28 +1000 Subject: Accessability in Edubuntu In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20071002011128.GA5995@themuso.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Tue, Oct 02, 2007 at 08:12:17AM EST, Ian Pascoe wrote: > Hi > > Can anyone confirm whether Edubuntu, which I believe ships with the Gnome > desktop, has Orca and associated components pre-packaged within the Live CD, > or if it has to be downloaded afterwards? I believe that orca does come on the edubuntu CD, but I am not sure how well, if at all, it works in a thin client environment. - -- Luke Yelavich GPG key: 0xD06320CE (http://www.themuso.com/themuso-gpg-key.txt) Email & MSN: themuso at themuso.com Jabber: themuso at jabber.org.au -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFHAZrAjVefwtBjIM4RAiWrAKDcvzB4mWNwLR2qNB10lZQy5/qITACfcDOP GWZgyckYdjzYQ14dCAzgLPc= =hj65 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From jdashiel at shellworld.net Tue Oct 2 08:23:46 2007 From: jdashiel at shellworld.net (Jude DaShiell) Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2007 03:23:46 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Accessability in Edubuntu In-Reply-To: <20071002011128.GA5995@themuso.com> References: <20071002011128.GA5995@themuso.com> Message-ID: I can tell you exactly how well orca will work in a thin client environment and I can explain why. Orca requires a thick client to work at all, and it requires broad band access. Without those two components in place it will not work at all. This is why. The other name for thin client is dumb terminal. That means you get a keyboard; a screen, a network connection, and nothing else. No memory; no hard drive, no floppies no speakers, no connection for refreshable braille display, and no way to do screen magnification without additional hardware. With a thick client also known as a pc equipped with all the dangerous stuff listed above the thin client/dumb terminal hasn't got, maybe orca can run provided it can talk to the environment on the other end through a pipe. Well jaws and window-eyes work that way at least require pipes. I know about this stuff because a system that will be expanding in the coming years uses citrix where I work and they're most likely going to take it to narrow band so screen reader users will need to use dos or command line linux if required to access that system. Why dos rather than windows and why command line instead of X in Linux? Simple, all that pixel grabbing the graphical user environments do to figure out what to communicate to you takes up band width since they're pulling it off the net constantly. Dos and Linux ommand line applications only need characters not pixels and for every symbol on the screen to get generated that's 143 fewer pieces of information for dos and command line linux than it is for any of the graphical user interfaces. If I'm not mistaken 12x12 pixels in a character but I probably ought to take the smallest screen resolution and do the math on that vertical*horizontal/2,000. All of this stuff was known and documented as far back as 2001 and put out on the web. I found a paper by a writer from R.N.I.B. with this information in it earlier this year. The reason for using narrow band is to help security. With minimal resources available and minimal speeds possible because of minimal resources a network take over even by someone who managed to tap into the right network cable becomes infeasible. On Tue, 2 Oct 2007, Luke Yelavich wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > On Tue, Oct 02, 2007 at 08:12:17AM EST, Ian Pascoe wrote: >> Hi >> >> Can anyone confirm whether Edubuntu, which I believe ships with the Gnome >> desktop, has Orca and associated components pre-packaged within the Live CD, >> or if it has to be downloaded afterwards? > > I believe that orca does come on the edubuntu CD, but I am not sure how well, if at all, it > works in a thin client environment. > - -- > Luke Yelavich > GPG key: 0xD06320CE > (http://www.themuso.com/themuso-gpg-key.txt) > Email & MSN: themuso at themuso.com > Jabber: themuso at jabber.org.au > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) > > iD8DBQFHAZrAjVefwtBjIM4RAiWrAKDcvzB4mWNwLR2qNB10lZQy5/qITACfcDOP > GWZgyckYdjzYQ14dCAzgLPc= > =hj65 > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility > From steve at fullmeasure.co.uk Tue Oct 2 09:35:27 2007 From: steve at fullmeasure.co.uk (Steve Lee) Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2007 10:35:27 +0100 Subject: Accessability in Edubuntu In-Reply-To: References: <20071002011128.GA5995@themuso.com> Message-ID: <6a4dbccf0710020235q4f5f1bcdgda741d1e5fd59fdf@mail.gmail.com> On 02/10/2007, Jude DaShiell wrote: > I can tell you exactly how well orca will work in a thin client > environment and I can explain why. Orca requires a thick client to work > at all, and it requires broad band access. Without those two components > in place it will not work at all. I can't comment on Orca so I'll just make a couple of general points as thin clients need to support AT as well. In the UK education section (schoolforge.org.uk) thin client is one of the key advantages of FOSS that can be promoted (saving cash, ease admin). I have limited knowledge but believe the situation should not be as bad as you present. I just needs some concentrated effort. * X, (the linux display system) is naturally thin client. LTSP just gets it going and in usual desktop situations the display happens to be on the same box as the client software. Thus most programs will 'just work' thin client as far as display and common input is concerned unless they have worked around it somehow. The Accessibility APIs also work in this distributed model * I understand sound now works with LTSP. * As far as performance/bandwidth is concerned yes thin client pushes the load onto infrastructure and servers. The X protocol is pretty good and optimisations are available (NX, ndiyo). The graphics packages that many programs and widget sets use work hard to reduce bandwidth too (e.g cairo). www.schoolforge.org.uk/index.php/Assistive_Technology_with_Terminal_Servers -- Steve Lee -- Open Source Assistive Technology Software PowerTalk - your presentations can speak for themselves www.fullmeasure.co.uk From ogra at ubuntu.com Tue Oct 2 09:47:02 2007 From: ogra at ubuntu.com (Oliver Grawert) Date: Tue, 02 Oct 2007 11:47:02 +0200 Subject: Accessability in Edubuntu In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1191318422.17903.23.camel@laptop> hi, Am Montag, den 01.10.2007, 23:12 +0100 schrieb Ian Pascoe: > Can anyone confirm whether Edubuntu, which I believe ships with the Gnome > desktop, has Orca and associated components pre-packaged within the Live CD, > or if it has to be downloaded afterwards? i just tested it on a gutsy client and apprently it has the sound device hardcoded ... in gutsy we have three possibilities to transfer sound to the client, the top layer is a virtual alsa device (which works fine for all other apps, so i'd somewhat had expected it to work, but apparently i'm wrong) ... there is also a pulseaudio tunnel to the client (in fact thats the layer the alsa device sits on top of vial libasound2-plugins) which you can use directly as well indeed. and as third we have an esound emulation of pulseaudio running on the thin client and teh ESPEAKER variable set in teh users session to guarantee backwards compatibility. apparently the portaudio library orca uses in the backend isnt capable of making use of the virtual alsa device here and the only other fallback this library offers seems to be oss. ciao oli -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Dies ist ein digital signierter Nachrichtenteil URL: From jdashiel at shellworld.net Tue Oct 2 10:08:00 2007 From: jdashiel at shellworld.net (Jude DaShiell) Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2007 05:08:00 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Accessability in Edubuntu In-Reply-To: <6a4dbccf0710020235q4f5f1bcdgda741d1e5fd59fdf@mail.gmail.com> References: <20071002011128.GA5995@themuso.com> <6a4dbccf0710020235q4f5f1bcdgda741d1e5fd59fdf@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I did the research, reason is we now have citrix where I work and this was work connected. If I were in the least degree wrong given the distribution my research results was given I'm sure my supervisor would have told me long ago. On Tue, 2 Oct 2007, Steve Lee wrote: > On 02/10/2007, Jude DaShiell wrote: >> I can tell you exactly how well orca will work in a thin client >> environment and I can explain why. Orca requires a thick client to work >> at all, and it requires broad band access. Without those two components >> in place it will not work at all. > > I can't comment on Orca so I'll just make a couple of general points > as thin clients need to support AT as well. In the UK education > section (schoolforge.org.uk) thin client is one of the key advantages > of FOSS that can be promoted (saving cash, ease admin). I have limited > knowledge but believe the situation should not be as bad as you > present. I just needs some concentrated effort. > > * X, (the linux display system) is naturally thin client. LTSP just > gets it going and in usual desktop situations the display happens to > be on the same box as the client software. Thus most programs will > 'just work' thin client as far as display and common input is > concerned unless they have worked around it somehow. The Accessibility > APIs also work in this distributed model > * I understand sound now works with LTSP. > * As far as performance/bandwidth is concerned yes thin client pushes > the load onto infrastructure and servers. The X protocol is pretty > good and optimisations are available (NX, ndiyo). The graphics > packages that many programs and widget sets use work hard to reduce > bandwidth too (e.g cairo). > > www.schoolforge.org.uk/index.php/Assistive_Technology_with_Terminal_Servers > > -- > Steve Lee > -- > Open Source Assistive Technology Software > PowerTalk - your presentations can speak for themselves > www.fullmeasure.co.uk > From ogra at ubuntu.com Tue Oct 2 10:15:57 2007 From: ogra at ubuntu.com (Oliver Grawert) Date: Tue, 02 Oct 2007 12:15:57 +0200 Subject: Accessability in Edubuntu In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1191320157.17903.26.camel@laptop> hi, Am Montag, den 01.10.2007, 23:12 +0100 schrieb Ian Pascoe: > Can anyone confirm whether Edubuntu, which I believe ships with the Gnome > desktop, has Orca and associated components pre-packaged within the Live CD, > or if it has to be downloaded afterwards? i just tested it on a gutsy client and apprently it has the sound device hardcoded ... in gutsy we have three possibilities to transfer sound to the client, the top layer is a virtual alsa device (which works fine for all other apps, so i'd somewhat had expected it to work, but apparently i'm wrong) ... there is also a pulseaudio tunnel to the client (in fact thats the layer the alsa device sits on top of vial libasound2-plugins) which you can use directly as well indeed. and as third we have an esound emulation of pulseaudio running on the thin client and teh ESPEAKER variable set in teh users session to guarantee backwards compatibility. apparently the portaudio library orca uses in the backend isnt capable of making use of the virtual alsa device here and the only other fallback this library offers seems to be oss. ciao oli -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: signature.asc Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 189 bytes Desc: Dies ist ein digital signierter Nachrichtenteil URL: From cerha at brailcom.org Tue Oct 2 11:32:20 2007 From: cerha at brailcom.org (Tomas Cerha) Date: Tue, 02 Oct 2007 13:32:20 +0200 Subject: Accessability in Edubuntu In-Reply-To: <1191318422.17903.23.camel@laptop> References: <1191318422.17903.23.camel@laptop> Message-ID: <47022C44.90700@brailcom.org> Oliver Grawert wrote: > in gutsy we have three possibilities to transfer sound to > the client Hello, when using Speech Dispatcher, there is one more option, since SD supports NAS (Network Audio Server). In addition, it is possible to run Speech Dispatcher on the thin client side. This would dramatically reduce the bandwidth for the cost of higher CPU load on the client machine. We are using this setup successfully, so I'll be glad to describe it in more detail, if someone is interested. Best regards Tomas Cerha From lubos.pintes at orangemail.sk Tue Oct 2 18:25:06 2007 From: lubos.pintes at orangemail.sk (Lubos Pintes) Date: Tue, 02 Oct 2007 20:25:06 +0200 Subject: sound in Wine Message-ID: <47028D02.5050605@orangemail.sk> Hello all, When I started to use, or better said, play with Ubuntu I had a problem with sound. Orca and some other applications couldn't play simultaneously. I then applied some tricks from Orca wiki and that helped. Now I probably had the similar problem in Wine. Either Wine and Orca, or two Wine applications cannot play something simultaneously. For example, the Screamer Radio plays, but crashes when I forget to switch off the Orca speech. Because Wine is inaccessible, I cannot look at winecfg to correct this problem. Can someone help me? Something like a registry patch with correct settings would be strongly appreciated. I managed to install eg. MS SAPI SDK 5.1 and Jim Kitchen's games. These would probably work if the problem with sound could be corrected. Many Thanks. From softy.lofty.ilp at btinternet.com Wed Oct 3 19:36:57 2007 From: softy.lofty.ilp at btinternet.com (Ian Pascoe) Date: Wed, 3 Oct 2007 20:36:57 +0100 Subject: Accessability in Edubuntu In-Reply-To: <6a4dbccf0710020235q4f5f1bcdgda741d1e5fd59fdf@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Thanks to all who replied. However, and this may well be my fault, I'm looking at putting Edubuntu on a stand alone PC for use by my children, so the question of networking the resources is not necessary. However, the information exchange has proved useful and interesting. So to confirm, on a stand alone PC running Edubuntu it should come with Orca as part of the Live CD? Ian -----Original Message----- From: ubuntu-accessibility-bounces at lists.ubuntu.com [mailto:ubuntu-accessibility-bounces at lists.ubuntu.com]On Behalf Of Steve Lee Sent: 02 October 2007 10:35 To: Jude DaShiell Cc: ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com Subject: Re: Accessability in Edubuntu On 02/10/2007, Jude DaShiell wrote: > I can tell you exactly how well orca will work in a thin client > environment and I can explain why. Orca requires a thick client to work > at all, and it requires broad band access. Without those two components > in place it will not work at all. I can't comment on Orca so I'll just make a couple of general points as thin clients need to support AT as well. In the UK education section (schoolforge.org.uk) thin client is one of the key advantages of FOSS that can be promoted (saving cash, ease admin). I have limited knowledge but believe the situation should not be as bad as you present. I just needs some concentrated effort. * X, (the linux display system) is naturally thin client. LTSP just gets it going and in usual desktop situations the display happens to be on the same box as the client software. Thus most programs will 'just work' thin client as far as display and common input is concerned unless they have worked around it somehow. The Accessibility APIs also work in this distributed model * I understand sound now works with LTSP. * As far as performance/bandwidth is concerned yes thin client pushes the load onto infrastructure and servers. The X protocol is pretty good and optimisations are available (NX, ndiyo). The graphics packages that many programs and widget sets use work hard to reduce bandwidth too (e.g cairo). www.schoolforge.org.uk/index.php/Assistive_Technology_with_Terminal_Servers -- Steve Lee -- Open Source Assistive Technology Software PowerTalk - your presentations can speak for themselves www.fullmeasure.co.uk -- Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility From jim at winonacotter.org Fri Oct 5 14:17:19 2007 From: jim at winonacotter.org (Jim Kronebusch) Date: Fri, 5 Oct 2007 09:17:19 -0500 Subject: Accessability in Edubuntu In-Reply-To: References: <20071002011128.GA5995@themuso.com> Message-ID: <20071005140755.M13427@winonacotter.org> > The other name for thin > client is dumb terminal. That means you get a keyboard; a screen, a > network connection, and nothing else. No memory; no hard drive, no > floppies no speakers, no connection for refreshable braille display, and > no way to do screen magnification without additional hardware. Not exactly. You need memory, you can have a floppy drive, you can have speakers. There is no need for a physical hard drive because everything lives in RAM. If you need extra swap space nbd is available. Thin Clients aren't exactly "dumb terminals", they have become much smarter. I have not worked with braille displays or screen magnification so I cannot speak to that. > I know > about this stuff because a system that will be expanding in the coming > years uses citrix Luckily Linux thin clients aren't Citrix :-) For what it is worth, I have been playing with getting text to speech to work in our thin client environment with no luck (Edubuntu Feisty). So I tried to enable it on my stand alone Gutsy Desktop, still no luck (Edubuntu Gutsy). However I cannot be certain that I am trying to set this up correctly. There doesn't seem to be any step by step documentation for this. I have read the manuals but they seem vague. I simply want to be able to take and Edubuntu Desktop and enable text to speech for OpenOffice and Firefox mainly. I guess I did have it working temporarily in Gutsy, but they my machine slowed down and started freezing. So maybe there are still some bugs that need working out. I haven't had the time to trouble shoot any further. Jim -- This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by the Cotter Technology Department, and is believed to be clean. From guyster at bex.net Sat Oct 6 17:08:46 2007 From: guyster at bex.net (Guy Schlosser) Date: Sat, 06 Oct 2007 13:08:46 -0400 Subject: accessible login Message-ID: <20071006100848.6ED7B25E@pop15.mta.everyone.net> Hey all, how do you enable accessible login in Gutsy? After I updated last night, I now have the login sound, but orca does not start automaticly. Any suggestions? Also, is there something that needs to be done in order to have Orca read items where you have to be root to administer? Finally, one last question. I noticed that firefox 3 was in the Gutsy universe repos. Why isn't that updated after alpha7. Alpha 8 has been released and a9pre is current. Thanks much in advance for any help. Thanks, Guy From s.bienlein at gmx.de Sat Oct 6 18:16:19 2007 From: s.bienlein at gmx.de (Simon Bienlein) Date: Sat, 6 Oct 2007 20:16:19 +0200 Subject: Comments on the Alternate Install CD Message-ID: <002f01c80844$fec21630$c864a8c0@simonlaptop> Hello, I installed Ubuntu with the Alternate Install CD. I pressed F6 and typed in the following: install brltty=ht,ttyS0,de The braille display was noticed and the instalation went on without any problems. But as I rebooted again I realised that I couldn't get BrlTTY started. That is because the parameter was set wrong in the file /etc/default/brltty. It would be good if the parameter could be set on yes when Ubuntu is installed with a brailledisplay. Would it be possible to give this wish to the developers? I can't setup orca. The speech is talking for a short time but then it crashes. This mistake is noticed with the Live CD aswell. It would be good if these problems could be solved before the Ubuntu release published. Kind regards Simon From jdashiel at shellworld.net Sun Oct 7 05:26:20 2007 From: jdashiel at shellworld.net (Jude DaShiell) Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 00:26:20 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Comments on the Alternate Install CD In-Reply-To: <002f01c80844$fec21630$c864a8c0@simonlaptop> References: <002f01c80844$fec21630$c864a8c0@simonlaptop> Message-ID: You could have done that yourself if you had gone into system preferences and accessibility and set assistive technology on and specifically enabled braille in that dialog. On Sat, 6 Oct 2007, Simon Bienlein wrote: > Hello, > > I installed Ubuntu with the Alternate Install CD. I pressed F6 and typed > in the following: > install brltty=ht,ttyS0,de > > The braille display was noticed and the instalation went on without any > problems. But as I rebooted again I realised that I couldn't get BrlTTY > started. That is because the parameter was set wrong in the file > /etc/default/brltty. > > It would be good if the parameter could be set on yes when Ubuntu is > installed with a brailledisplay. Would it be possible to give this wish > to the developers? > > I can't setup orca. The speech is talking for a short time but then it > crashes. This mistake is noticed with the Live CD aswell. > > It would be good if these problems could be solved before the Ubuntu > release published. > > Kind regards > Simon > > > > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility > From ianpascoe at btinternet.com Sun Oct 7 16:13:47 2007 From: ianpascoe at btinternet.com (Ian Pascoe) Date: Sun, 7 Oct 2007 17:13:47 +0100 Subject: Sight Village Project Message-ID: Hi all In conjunction with the UK Ubuntu Loco Team, we are proposing to have a stand at this exhibition next year. See https://wiki.ubuntu.com/UKTeam/IdeasPool/Sight_Village_2008 There is a lot of preparatory work that needs to be covered off. In particular are the construction of the "How To" guides. To this end I have two immiediate questions: A. Is anyone aware of a convertor that exists to convert documentation produced by Open Office that will enable it to be printed on a brail printer with level 1, non conctatenated, brail support? I am using the Ubuntu Accessability and Orca content pages to provide my background for these documents, and although obvious can I check that: B. To set up a brail display from either a Live CD or current Ubuntu installation, the display needs to be attached during the setup process? In addition, if there are any centralised content owners for these two sites, and to avoid traffic on the list, would they mind contacting me directly off line? This is to ensure that we have a two way communication to cover off any potential ambiguity and to advise on the content of the final documents produced. I hope to share these guides with the community prior to the event to ensure that there are no blufers, and then have them hosted for use by the community as a whole. Many thanks Ian From kb8aey at verizon.net Sun Oct 7 16:41:59 2007 From: kb8aey at verizon.net (mike coulombe) Date: Sun, 07 Oct 2007 11:41:59 -0500 (CDT) Subject: orca on the live cd Message-ID: <0JPJ0042CVPYTBT1@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> Hi, I have been away for a few days. I didn't see any messages when I got back about the status of the live CD. So I just wondered if the problem with orca not working on it has or is going to be corrected soon. Thanks for any info Mike. X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 000778-5, 10/06/2007), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean From s.bienlein at gmx.de Mon Oct 8 13:11:39 2007 From: s.bienlein at gmx.de (Simon Bienlein) Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2007 15:11:39 +0200 Subject: Comments on the Alternate Install CD References: <002f01c80844$fec21630$c864a8c0@simonlaptop> Message-ID: <00c001c809ac$c3aba4d0$c864a8c0@simonlaptop> Hi Jude, Thank you very much for your answer. But I think this suggestion is not the right solution to solve the problem. It isn't possible to work with the command line if the problem isn't solved. Wouldn't it be better if BrlTTY would be started automaticaly? It is the case with Debian and I don't know a reason why it shouldn't be like this with Ubuntu aswell. How do other blind Ubuntu-Users think about this? Kind regards Simon From lubos.pintes at orangemail.sk Mon Oct 8 14:13:15 2007 From: lubos.pintes at orangemail.sk (Lubos Pintes) Date: Mon, 08 Oct 2007 16:13:15 +0200 Subject: Comments on the Alternate Install CD In-Reply-To: <00c001c809ac$c3aba4d0$c864a8c0@simonlaptop> References: <002f01c80844$fec21630$c864a8c0@simonlaptop> <00c001c809ac$c3aba4d0$c864a8c0@simonlaptop> Message-ID: <470A3AFB.2090701@orangemail.sk> Right! I tried what worked in Debian and it is not working in Ubuntu. But currently Ubuntu doesn't work for me at all. Simon Bienlein wrote / napísal(a): > Hi Jude, > > Thank you very much for your answer. But I think this suggestion is not > the right solution to solve the problem. It isn't possible to work with > the command line if the problem isn't solved. > > Wouldn't it be better if BrlTTY would be started automaticaly? It is the > case with Debian and I don't know a reason why it shouldn't be like this > with Ubuntu aswell. > > How do other blind Ubuntu-Users think about this? > > Kind regards > > Simon > > > From jdashiel at shellworld.net Mon Oct 8 20:23:30 2007 From: jdashiel at shellworld.net (Jude DaShiell) Date: Mon, 8 Oct 2007 15:23:30 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Comments on the Alternate Install CD In-Reply-To: <470A3AFB.2090701@orangemail.sk> References: <002f01c80844$fec21630$c864a8c0@simonlaptop> <00c001c809ac$c3aba4d0$c864a8c0@simonlaptop> <470A3AFB.2090701@orangemail.sk> Message-ID: orca doesn't come up talking when a reboot happens; there's that login prompt to handle first. One thing I can tell you is about the control-u key combination. It wipes out everything typed on a line before you hit it so can clear out bad login and password information for you. On Mon, 8 Oct 2007, Lubos Pintes wrote: > Right! I tried what worked in Debian and it is not working in Ubuntu. > But currently Ubuntu doesn't work for me at all. > > Simon Bienlein wrote / napísal(a): >> Hi Jude, >> >> Thank you very much for your answer. But I think this suggestion is not >> the right solution to solve the problem. It isn't possible to work with >> the command line if the problem isn't solved. >> >> Wouldn't it be better if BrlTTY would be started automaticaly? It is the >> case with Debian and I don't know a reason why it shouldn't be like this >> with Ubuntu aswell. >> >> How do other blind Ubuntu-Users think about this? >> >> Kind regards >> >> Simon >> >> >> > > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility > From William.Walker at Sun.COM Tue Oct 9 18:49:10 2007 From: William.Walker at Sun.COM (Willie Walker) Date: Tue, 09 Oct 2007 14:49:10 -0400 Subject: heed help with the help system In-Reply-To: <0JP800AJVV4TVVJ4@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> References: <0JP800AJVV4TVVJ4@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <470BCD26.8030106@sun.com> Hi Mike: The help system is currently not very accessible. It is based upon an older version of the Firefox rendering engine. We've decided to wait until it brings in the rendering engine used by Firefox 3 before we invest resources in making it more accessible. We acknowledge this is less than ideal, but we don't think it makes a lot of sense pouring resources into something that will be replaced soon. Will mike coulombe wrote: > Hi, how do you use the gnome help with orca, or doesn't this work. > I see topics, but don't know how to get to the text to read about them. > Mike. > X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 000777-4, 09/30/2007), Outbound message > X-Antivirus-Status: Clean > > > From William.Walker at Sun.COM Tue Oct 9 18:52:34 2007 From: William.Walker at Sun.COM (Willie Walker) Date: Tue, 09 Oct 2007 14:52:34 -0400 Subject: [orca-list] accessible login In-Reply-To: <20071006100848.6ED7B25E@pop15.mta.everyone.net> References: <20071006100848.6ED7B25E@pop15.mta.everyone.net> Message-ID: <470BCDF2.2080206@sun.com> Hi Guy: The last time I looked, accessible login was broken on Gutsy. I sent information off to the Ubuntu folks for tracking the problem down, but I'm not sure where they stand with it right now. There's some information on Accessible Login here: http://www.gnome.org/projects/gdm/docs/2.18/accessibility.html Hope this helps, Will PS - Accessible login does indeed work - I've tested it on OpenSolaris. Guy Schlosser wrote: > Hey all, how do you enable accessible login in Gutsy? After I > updated last night, I now have the login sound, but orca does not > start automaticly. Any suggestions? Also, is there something that > needs to be done in order to have Orca read items where you have to > be root to administer? Finally, one last question. I noticed that > firefox 3 was in the Gutsy universe repos. Why isn't that updated > after alpha7. Alpha 8 has been released and a9pre is > current. Thanks much in advance for any help. > > Thanks, > > > Guy > > _______________________________________________ > Orca-list mailing list > Orca-list at gnome.org > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list > Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca > From janina at rednote.net Wed Oct 10 13:33:48 2007 From: janina at rednote.net (Janina Sajka) Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2007 09:33:48 -0400 Subject: [orca-list] accessible login In-Reply-To: <470BCDF2.2080206@sun.com> References: <20071006100848.6ED7B25E@pop15.mta.everyone.net> <470BCDF2.2080206@sun.com> Message-ID: <20071010133348.GJ6341@rednote.net> Accessible login appears to be broken on every Linux distribution. As Will points out, this is an issue with distributions. Nevertheless, it's a serious issue for accessibility. The email below discusses Ubuntu. At the Gnome A11y Summit this weekend we verified that Suse is broken. My own experience indicates that Fedora 7 and Fedora 7.91 are broken. Now that our assistive technologies have passed from mostly developmental software into the realm of usable tools for real people with disabilities, this situation is no longer tolerable. We must call on all distributions to institute procedures to insure that accessible login gets fixed and stays fixed. This will require regular testing, as there are many ways to break accessible login. Janina Willie Walker writes: > Hi Guy: > > The last time I looked, accessible login was broken on Gutsy. I sent > information off to the Ubuntu folks for tracking the problem down, but > I'm not sure where they stand with it right now. > > There's some information on Accessible Login here: > > http://www.gnome.org/projects/gdm/docs/2.18/accessibility.html > > Hope this helps, > > Will > > PS - Accessible login does indeed work - I've tested it on OpenSolaris. > > Guy Schlosser wrote: > > Hey all, how do you enable accessible login in Gutsy? After I > > updated last night, I now have the login sound, but orca does not > > start automaticly. Any suggestions? Also, is there something that > > needs to be done in order to have Orca read items where you have to > > be root to administer? Finally, one last question. I noticed that > > firefox 3 was in the Gutsy universe repos. Why isn't that updated > > after alpha7. Alpha 8 has been released and a9pre is > > current. Thanks much in advance for any help. > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > Guy > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Orca-list mailing list > > Orca-list at gnome.org > > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list > > Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca > > > > _______________________________________________ > Orca-list mailing list > Orca-list at gnome.org > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list > Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca -- Janina Sajka, Phone: +1.202.595.7777; sip:janina at a11y.org Partner, Capital Accessibility LLC http://CapitalAccessibility.Com Marketing the Owasys 22C talking screenless cell phone in the U.S. and Canada Learn more at http://ScreenlessPhone.Com Chair, Open Accessibility janina at a11y.org Linux Foundation http://a11y.org From Brian.Cameron at Sun.COM Wed Oct 10 18:46:41 2007 From: Brian.Cameron at Sun.COM (Brian Cameron) Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2007 13:46:41 -0500 Subject: [orca-list] accessible login In-Reply-To: <20071010133348.GJ6341@rednote.net> References: <20071006100848.6ED7B25E@pop15.mta.everyone.net> <470BCDF2.2080206@sun.com> <20071010133348.GJ6341@rednote.net> Message-ID: <470D1E11.5020506@sun.com> Janina: Some thoughts from the GDM maintainer... > Accessible login appears to be broken on every Linux distribution. As > Will points out, this is an issue with distributions. Nevertheless, it's > a serious issue for accessibility. I recently worked with Ubuntu to fix their problems with accessibility so I think their recent releases should be working. Their problem was that they install the at-spi-registryd to a non-default location and they needed to fix the way they call configure to specify the location of the registry daemon. This might be a problem for other distros? There also have been some useful a11y related bug fixes in GDM 2.20, so I would recommend using the latest & greatest. > The email below discusses Ubuntu. At the Gnome A11y Summit this weekend > we verified that Suse is broken. My own experience indicates that Fedora > 7 and Fedora 7.91 are broken. It would be helpful if people were to file bugs or explain on the gdm-list at gnome.org mail list what the problems are. I'd be happy to help. The GDM documentation at the following link has some help in the "Accessibility" section to explain how to debug some common accessibility issues with GDM: http://www.gnome.org/projects/gdm/docs.html > Now that our assistive technologies have passed from mostly > developmental software into the realm of usable tools for real people > with disabilities, this situation is no longer tolerable. We must call > on all distributions to institute procedures to insure that accessible > login gets fixed and stays fixed. This will require regular testing, as > there are many ways to break accessible login. There are some well known bugs/issues with accessibility. For example, it doesn't work so well with gdmgreeter and some AT programs. You probably need to switch to using gdmlogin if you really need to use an AT that can interact with the widgets. gdmgreeter would require some work to really support accessibility properly. It's main problem is the way it uses GnomeCanvas for building the theme, and the fact that it doesn't support keyboard navigation. Also, failsafe xterm isn't accessible. Perhaps GDM should be configurable so you could use it with gnome-terminal, which does support accessibility? gdmsetup is also not accessible, and probably can't be as long as it requires that you run it as root. Brian > Willie Walker writes: >> Hi Guy: >> >> The last time I looked, accessible login was broken on Gutsy. I sent >> information off to the Ubuntu folks for tracking the problem down, but >> I'm not sure where they stand with it right now. >> >> There's some information on Accessible Login here: >> >> http://www.gnome.org/projects/gdm/docs/2.18/accessibility.html >> >> Hope this helps, >> >> Will >> >> PS - Accessible login does indeed work - I've tested it on OpenSolaris. >> >> Guy Schlosser wrote: >>> Hey all, how do you enable accessible login in Gutsy? After I >>> updated last night, I now have the login sound, but orca does not >>> start automaticly. Any suggestions? Also, is there something that >>> needs to be done in order to have Orca read items where you have to >>> be root to administer? Finally, one last question. I noticed that >>> firefox 3 was in the Gutsy universe repos. Why isn't that updated >>> after alpha7. Alpha 8 has been released and a9pre is >>> current. Thanks much in advance for any help. >>> >>> Thanks, >>> >>> >>> Guy >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Orca-list mailing list >>> Orca-list at gnome.org >>> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list >>> Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Orca-list mailing list >> Orca-list at gnome.org >> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list >> Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca > From William.Walker at Sun.COM Wed Oct 10 19:31:57 2007 From: William.Walker at Sun.COM (Willie Walker) Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2007 15:31:57 -0400 Subject: [orca-list] accessible login In-Reply-To: <470D1E11.5020506@sun.com> References: <20071006100848.6ED7B25E@pop15.mta.everyone.net> <470BCDF2.2080206@sun.com> <20071010133348.GJ6341@rednote.net> <470D1E11.5020506@sun.com> Message-ID: <470D28AD.5000901@sun.com> Hi Brian: Thanks! I think the OpenSUSE folks also ran into the same problem. JP seemed to think this change might have been the source of confusion: http://svn.gnome.org/viewvc/gdm2/trunk/gui/gdmcommon.c?r1=5263&r2=5262&pathrev=5263. This change seemed to go in with http://svn.gnome.org/viewvc/gdm2?view=revision&revision=5263. I'm not an expert in how various distributions build things, though, so I'm just passing on what I understood. Will Brian Cameron wrote: > Janina: > > Some thoughts from the GDM maintainer... > > >> Accessible login appears to be broken on every Linux distribution. As >> Will points out, this is an issue with distributions. Nevertheless, it's >> a serious issue for accessibility. >> > > I recently worked with Ubuntu to fix their problems with accessibility > so I think their recent releases should be working. Their problem was > that they install the at-spi-registryd to a non-default location and > they needed to fix the way they call configure to specify the location > of the registry daemon. This might be a problem for other distros? > > There also have been some useful a11y related bug fixes in GDM 2.20, > so I would recommend using the latest & greatest. > > >> The email below discusses Ubuntu. At the Gnome A11y Summit this weekend >> we verified that Suse is broken. My own experience indicates that Fedora >> 7 and Fedora 7.91 are broken. >> > > It would be helpful if people were to file bugs or explain on the > gdm-list at gnome.org mail list what the problems are. I'd be happy to > help. The GDM documentation at the following link has some help > in the "Accessibility" section to explain how to debug some common > accessibility issues with GDM: > > http://www.gnome.org/projects/gdm/docs.html > > >> Now that our assistive technologies have passed from mostly >> developmental software into the realm of usable tools for real people >> with disabilities, this situation is no longer tolerable. We must call >> on all distributions to institute procedures to insure that accessible >> login gets fixed and stays fixed. This will require regular testing, as >> there are many ways to break accessible login. >> > > There are some well known bugs/issues with accessibility. For example, > it doesn't work so well with gdmgreeter and some AT programs. You > probably need to switch to using gdmlogin if you really need to use an > AT that can interact with the widgets. gdmgreeter would require some > work to really support accessibility properly. It's main problem is > the way it uses GnomeCanvas for building the theme, and the fact that > it doesn't support keyboard navigation. > > Also, failsafe xterm isn't accessible. Perhaps GDM should be > configurable so you could use it with gnome-terminal, which does support > accessibility? > > gdmsetup is also not accessible, and probably can't be as long as it > requires that you run it as root. > > Brian > > > >> Willie Walker writes: >> >>> Hi Guy: >>> >>> The last time I looked, accessible login was broken on Gutsy. I sent >>> information off to the Ubuntu folks for tracking the problem down, but >>> I'm not sure where they stand with it right now. >>> >>> There's some information on Accessible Login here: >>> >>> http://www.gnome.org/projects/gdm/docs/2.18/accessibility.html >>> >>> Hope this helps, >>> >>> Will >>> >>> PS - Accessible login does indeed work - I've tested it on OpenSolaris. >>> >>> Guy Schlosser wrote: >>> >>>> Hey all, how do you enable accessible login in Gutsy? After I >>>> updated last night, I now have the login sound, but orca does not >>>> start automaticly. Any suggestions? Also, is there something that >>>> needs to be done in order to have Orca read items where you have to >>>> be root to administer? Finally, one last question. I noticed that >>>> firefox 3 was in the Gutsy universe repos. Why isn't that updated >>>> after alpha7. Alpha 8 has been released and a9pre is >>>> current. Thanks much in advance for any help. >>>> >>>> Thanks, >>>> >>>> >>>> Guy >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Orca-list mailing list >>>> Orca-list at gnome.org >>>> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list >>>> Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca >>>> >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Orca-list mailing list >>> Orca-list at gnome.org >>> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list >>> Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca >>> > > _______________________________________________ > gnome-accessibility-list mailing list > gnome-accessibility-list at gnome.org > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-accessibility-list > From Brian.Cameron at Sun.COM Wed Oct 10 20:26:58 2007 From: Brian.Cameron at Sun.COM (Brian Cameron) Date: Wed, 10 Oct 2007 15:26:58 -0500 Subject: [orca-list] accessible login In-Reply-To: <470D28AD.5000901@sun.com> References: <20071006100848.6ED7B25E@pop15.mta.everyone.net> <470BCDF2.2080206@sun.com> <20071010133348.GJ6341@rednote.net> <470D1E11.5020506@sun.com> <470D28AD.5000901@sun.com> Message-ID: <470D3592.5030709@sun.com> Willie: This change was made to allow distros to configure where at-spi-registryd is located, if it is not in the default "libexecdir" location. So, distros that install at-spi-registryd to a different location need to specify --with-atspi-dir=/path when configuring GDM. If this is their problem, then this should fix it. This configure option is new in GDM 2.20. If using older GDM, then you'ld probably just need to hack gui/gdmcommon.c to look in the right directory or backport the new configure option to the older GDM. Brian > Thanks! I think the OpenSUSE folks also ran into the same problem. JP > seemed to think this change might have been the source of confusion: > http://svn.gnome.org/viewvc/gdm2/trunk/gui/gdmcommon.c?r1=5263&r2=5262&pathrev=5263. > This change seemed to go in with > http://svn.gnome.org/viewvc/gdm2?view=revision&revision=5263. > I'm not an expert in how various distributions build things, though, so > I'm just passing on what I understood. > > Will > > Brian Cameron wrote: >> Janina: >> >> Some thoughts from the GDM maintainer... >> >> >>> Accessible login appears to be broken on every Linux distribution. As >>> Will points out, this is an issue with distributions. Nevertheless, it's >>> a serious issue for accessibility. >>> >> >> I recently worked with Ubuntu to fix their problems with accessibility >> so I think their recent releases should be working. Their problem was >> that they install the at-spi-registryd to a non-default location and >> they needed to fix the way they call configure to specify the location >> of the registry daemon. This might be a problem for other distros? >> >> There also have been some useful a11y related bug fixes in GDM 2.20, >> so I would recommend using the latest & greatest. >> >> >>> The email below discusses Ubuntu. At the Gnome A11y Summit this weekend >>> we verified that Suse is broken. My own experience indicates that Fedora >>> 7 and Fedora 7.91 are broken. >>> >> >> It would be helpful if people were to file bugs or explain on the >> gdm-list at gnome.org mail list what the problems are. I'd be happy to >> help. The GDM documentation at the following link has some help >> in the "Accessibility" section to explain how to debug some common >> accessibility issues with GDM: >> >> http://www.gnome.org/projects/gdm/docs.html >> >> >>> Now that our assistive technologies have passed from mostly >>> developmental software into the realm of usable tools for real people >>> with disabilities, this situation is no longer tolerable. We must call >>> on all distributions to institute procedures to insure that accessible >>> login gets fixed and stays fixed. This will require regular testing, as >>> there are many ways to break accessible login. >>> >> >> There are some well known bugs/issues with accessibility. For example, >> it doesn't work so well with gdmgreeter and some AT programs. You >> probably need to switch to using gdmlogin if you really need to use an >> AT that can interact with the widgets. gdmgreeter would require some >> work to really support accessibility properly. It's main problem is >> the way it uses GnomeCanvas for building the theme, and the fact that >> it doesn't support keyboard navigation. >> >> Also, failsafe xterm isn't accessible. Perhaps GDM should be >> configurable so you could use it with gnome-terminal, which does support >> accessibility? >> >> gdmsetup is also not accessible, and probably can't be as long as it >> requires that you run it as root. >> >> Brian >> >> >> >>> Willie Walker writes: >>> >>>> Hi Guy: >>>> >>>> The last time I looked, accessible login was broken on Gutsy. I >>>> sent information off to the Ubuntu folks for tracking the problem >>>> down, but I'm not sure where they stand with it right now. >>>> >>>> There's some information on Accessible Login here: >>>> >>>> http://www.gnome.org/projects/gdm/docs/2.18/accessibility.html >>>> >>>> Hope this helps, >>>> >>>> Will >>>> >>>> PS - Accessible login does indeed work - I've tested it on OpenSolaris. >>>> >>>> Guy Schlosser wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hey all, how do you enable accessible login in Gutsy? After I >>>>> updated last night, I now have the login sound, but orca does not >>>>> start automaticly. Any suggestions? Also, is there something that >>>>> needs to be done in order to have Orca read items where you have to >>>>> be root to administer? Finally, one last question. I noticed that >>>>> firefox 3 was in the Gutsy universe repos. Why isn't that updated >>>>> after alpha7. Alpha 8 has been released and a9pre is current. >>>>> Thanks much in advance for any help. >>>>> >>>>> Thanks, >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Guy >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Orca-list mailing list >>>>> Orca-list at gnome.org >>>>> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list >>>>> Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca >>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Orca-list mailing list >>>> Orca-list at gnome.org >>>> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list >>>> Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca >>>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> gnome-accessibility-list mailing list >> gnome-accessibility-list at gnome.org >> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/gnome-accessibility-list >> > From kb8aey at verizon.net Thu Oct 11 15:53:10 2007 From: kb8aey at verizon.net (mike coulombe) Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2007 10:53:10 -0500 (CDT) Subject: orca on the live cd Message-ID: <0JPR00G2J84LX720@vms040.mailsrvcs.net> Hi, release is coming soon. Has there been any progress on getting orca working on the live CD, or is this one going to be left this way. Mike. From metalhead1009000 at gmail.com Thu Oct 11 17:53:08 2007 From: metalhead1009000 at gmail.com (Mike Reiser) Date: Thu, 11 Oct 2007 12:53:08 -0500 Subject: orca on the live cd References: <0JPR00G2J84LX720@vms040.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <003d01c80c2f$967efcc0$b5e44e8b@mike5cb7a2e1b7> Haven't checked yet, hope it's fixed by release as I want to test the new ability to do admin tasks. Mike ----- Original Message ----- From: "mike coulombe" To: "ubuntu" Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 10:53 AM Subject: orca on the live cd > Hi, release is coming soon. Has there been any progress on getting orca > working on the live CD, or is this one going to be left this way. > Mike. > > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility From lubos.pintes at orangemail.sk Fri Oct 12 07:28:16 2007 From: lubos.pintes at orangemail.sk (Lubos Pintes) Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 09:28:16 +0200 Subject: orca on the live cd In-Reply-To: <003d01c80c2f$967efcc0$b5e44e8b@mike5cb7a2e1b7> References: <0JPR00G2J84LX720@vms040.mailsrvcs.net> <003d01c80c2f$967efcc0$b5e44e8b@mike5cb7a2e1b7> Message-ID: <470F2210.70301@orangemail.sk> Hi, I tested Live CD from October 10 with following results: Atleast on my notebook, there is, I suppose, collision between sound playing and Orca speech. Ubuntu on my laptop works, but with these problems: - It is certainly impossible to do eg. installation simply by clicking on the install icon. - When Orca is speaking and some other app tries to play some sound Orca crashes,. Mike Reiser wrote / napísal(a): > Haven't checked yet, hope it's fixed by release as I want to test the new > ability to do admin tasks. > > Mike > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "mike coulombe" > To: "ubuntu" > Sent: Thursday, October 11, 2007 10:53 AM > Subject: orca on the live cd > > >> Hi, release is coming soon. Has there been any progress on getting orca >> working on the live CD, or is this one going to be left this way. >> Mike. >> >> -- >> Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list >> Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com >> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility > > From linux at cpu100.net Fri Oct 12 20:56:57 2007 From: linux at cpu100.net (Fabiano) Date: Fri, 12 Oct 2007 17:56:57 -0300 Subject: orca on the live cd In-Reply-To: <470F2210.70301@orangemail.sk> References: <0JPR00G2J84LX720@vms040.mailsrvcs.net> <003d01c80c2f$967efcc0$b5e44e8b@mike5cb7a2e1b7> <470F2210.70301@orangemail.sk> Message-ID: <470FDF99.1030009@cpu100.net> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From herzog at frontiernet.net Sun Oct 14 03:06:56 2007 From: herzog at frontiernet.net (Herzog) Date: Sat, 13 Oct 2007 23:06:56 -0400 Subject: Who do I tell Message-ID: <471187D0.200@frontiernet.net> Who can I tell my bug discoveries to so my wining gets to the right UBUNTU guy(s) who could help fix them.? I use Ubuntu and Orca, which came on my new Dell 1420 Laptop. I have been getting updates, I don't know whether thru Dell, Ubuntu, or ??? So far they have been useful. But to whom can I tell the changes that are bad, or still needed? For instance, now there is no way I know of to shut Orca off. You wonder why I would want to!! The answer is that in Thunderbird, when I try to send mail, a box asks for THE My password, which is the one for the ISP. If ORCA is off, it will work, and I can send mail, or receive mail.; and I can check the box that says remember this password. I am sighted; a blind person could never cope. Now I can only cope by removing ORCA, signing on, remembering the password being checked, and then reinstall Orca. Actually I don't cope, I just use my windows XP machine and JAWS, which works with thunderbird fairly well, but not yet good enough for a blind person, (my wife) to use. She uses Eudora. I suspect that ORCA or maybe it is only the echo part of it, interacting, that might causes other boxes, maybe not only passwords, to fail Wil Herzog . From bhawkeslewis at googlemail.com Sun Oct 14 09:08:10 2007 From: bhawkeslewis at googlemail.com (Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis) Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2007 10:08:10 +0100 Subject: Who do I tell In-Reply-To: <471187D0.200@frontiernet.net> References: <471187D0.200@frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <4711DC7A.5050400@googlemail.com> You could quit Orca with Insert-Q: http://live.gnome.org/Orca/KeyboardCommands Then press Alt+F2, type "orca", and press Enter to start Orca again when you want to. Or you could mute the volume temporarily. The Dell 1420 laptop includes a set of 7 media control button on the top right of the keyboard. There's a group of four on the left, then a group of three on the right. The first button in the group of three is the mute or unmute button. There is documentation of this, but Dell have relied on diagrams rather than putting it into a particularly accessible format: http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/systems/ins1420/en/OM/about.htm#wp1187428 It might be worth raising that issue with their customer support. You didn't say whether you have compiled the latest version of Orca, or are just running an old standard package: http://live.gnome.org/Orca/DownloadInstall If it's still a problem in the latest version, you should consider writing the Orca mailing list or filing a bug in the Gnome bug tracker: http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list http://live.gnome.org/Orca/Bugs It may well turn out to be a problem with Thunderbird but the Orca developers are probably best placed to determine that. -- Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis Herzog wrote: > Who can I tell my bug discoveries to so my wining gets to the right > UBUNTU guy(s) who could help fix them.? > > I use Ubuntu and Orca, which came on my new Dell 1420 Laptop. > > I have been getting updates, I don't know whether thru Dell, Ubuntu, or ??? > So far they have been useful. But to whom can I tell the changes that > are bad, or still needed? > > For instance, now there is no way I know of to shut Orca off. > You wonder why I would want to!! > The answer is that in Thunderbird, when I try to send mail, a box asks > for THE My password, which is the one for the ISP. > If ORCA is off, it will work, and I can send mail, or receive mail.; and > I can check the box that says remember this password. > I am sighted; a blind person could never cope. > Now I can only cope by removing ORCA, signing on, remembering the > password being checked, and then reinstall Orca. > > Actually I don't cope, I just use my windows XP machine and JAWS, which > works with thunderbird fairly well, but not yet good enough for a blind > person, (my wife) to use. She uses Eudora. > > I suspect that ORCA or maybe it is only the echo part of it, > interacting, that might causes other boxes, maybe not only passwords, to > fail Wil Herzog > . > From jdashiel at shellworld.net Sun Oct 14 10:37:36 2007 From: jdashiel at shellworld.net (Jude DaShiell) Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2007 05:37:36 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Who do I tell In-Reply-To: <4711DC7A.5050400@googlemail.com> References: <471187D0.200@frontiernet.net> <4711DC7A.5050400@googlemail.com> Message-ID: Has anyone ever used the dell support web page and not gone around in a circle? Their site is an accessibility violation. Could be one of the blind consumer organizations might help out after they finish with target. On Sun, 14 Oct 2007, Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis wrote: > You could quit Orca with Insert-Q: > > http://live.gnome.org/Orca/KeyboardCommands > > Then press Alt+F2, type "orca", and press Enter to start Orca again when > you want to. > > Or you could mute the volume temporarily. The Dell 1420 laptop includes > a set of 7 media control button on the top right of the keyboard. > There's a group of four on the left, then a group of three on the right. > The first button in the group of three is the mute or unmute button. > There is documentation of this, but Dell have relied on diagrams rather > than putting it into a particularly accessible format: > > http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/systems/ins1420/en/OM/about.htm#wp1187428 > > It might be worth raising that issue with their customer support. > > You didn't say whether you have compiled the latest version of Orca, or > are just running an old standard package: > > http://live.gnome.org/Orca/DownloadInstall > > If it's still a problem in the latest version, you should consider > writing the Orca mailing list or filing a bug in the Gnome bug tracker: > > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list > > http://live.gnome.org/Orca/Bugs > > It may well turn out to be a problem with Thunderbird but the Orca > developers are probably best placed to determine that. > > -- > Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis > > Herzog wrote: >> Who can I tell my bug discoveries to so my wining gets to the right >> UBUNTU guy(s) who could help fix them.? >> >> I use Ubuntu and Orca, which came on my new Dell 1420 Laptop. >> >> I have been getting updates, I don't know whether thru Dell, Ubuntu, or ??? >> So far they have been useful. But to whom can I tell the changes that >> are bad, or still needed? >> >> For instance, now there is no way I know of to shut Orca off. > >> You wonder why I would want to!! >> The answer is that in Thunderbird, when I try to send mail, a box asks >> for THE My password, which is the one for the ISP. >> If ORCA is off, it will work, and I can send mail, or receive mail.; and >> I can check the box that says remember this password. >> I am sighted; a blind person could never cope. >> Now I can only cope by removing ORCA, signing on, remembering the >> password being checked, and then reinstall Orca. >> >> Actually I don't cope, I just use my windows XP machine and JAWS, which >> works with thunderbird fairly well, but not yet good enough for a blind >> person, (my wife) to use. She uses Eudora. >> >> I suspect that ORCA or maybe it is only the echo part of it, >> interacting, that might causes other boxes, maybe not only passwords, to >> fail Wil Herzog >> . >> > > > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility > From kb8aey at verizon.net Sun Oct 14 21:02:05 2007 From: kb8aey at verizon.net (mike coulombe) Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2007 16:02:05 -0500 (CDT) Subject: orca nolonger speaks Message-ID: <0JPX000JF6FHSCRC@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> Hi, I got the updates today and see there was some speech updates. However while orca doesn't crash anymore it doesn't speak unless I use speech dispatcher. I don't know if this is the case with the live CD, but it is with my installation. Mike. From themuso at themuso.com Sun Oct 14 22:43:49 2007 From: themuso at themuso.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2007 08:43:49 +1000 Subject: orca nolonger speaks In-Reply-To: <0JPX000JF6FHSCRC@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> References: <0JPX000JF6FHSCRC@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <20071014224349.GA22199@themuso.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Mon, Oct 15, 2007 at 07:02:05AM EST, mike coulombe wrote: > Hi, I got the updates today and see there was some speech updates. However while orca doesn't crash anymore it doesn't speak unless I use speech dispatcher. > I don't know if this is the case with the live CD, but it is with my installation. Can I assume this is on an installed system? You might want to check that software sound mixing (ESD) is disabled in the sound preferences. - -- Luke Yelavich GPG key: 0xD06320CE (http://www.themuso.com/themuso-gpg-key.txt) Email & MSN: themuso at themuso.com Jabber: themuso at jabber.org.au -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFHEpuljVefwtBjIM4RAkFAAKC1dfihgTF8RgSbn+KMFjVMcjuVKgCeJwQl kSbyPNhP75w+S20F8XvrbZE= =rbl9 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From themuso at themuso.com Sun Oct 14 23:03:45 2007 From: themuso at themuso.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2007 09:03:45 +1000 Subject: orca nolonger speaksL In-Reply-To: <0JPX000JF6FHSCRC@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> References: <0JPX000JF6FHSCRC@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <20071014230345.GA23062@themuso.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Mon, Oct 15, 2007 at 07:02:05AM EST, mike coulombe wrote: > Hi, I got the updates today and see there was some speech updates. However while orca doesn't crash anymore it doesn't speak unless I use speech dispatcher. > I don't know if this is the case with the live CD, but it is with my installation. I've just had a thought about why this is occurring. Espeak that will ship in gutsy final will use portaudio v18 again, as portaudio v19 was giving troubles. V18 only uses oss, and since you are running speech-dispatcher, portaudio v18 cannot talk to the oss device, as speech-dispatcher is running. You will need to stop speech-dispatcher to use espeak with the gnome-speech driver. - -- Luke Yelavich GPG key: 0xD06320CE (http://www.themuso.com/themuso-gpg-key.txt) Email & MSN: themuso at themuso.com Jabber: themuso at jabber.org.au -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFHEqBRjVefwtBjIM4RAhUQAJ9V4dZhI7Rb4VViNlciagT5J6mnwQCgoAP0 xiX8ZjMp/pGAlSwGKtF1z/A= =Ijtw -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From rob at mur.org.uk Mon Oct 15 12:28:17 2007 From: rob at mur.org.uk (Robert Murray) Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2007 13:28:17 +0100 Subject: orca nolonger speaksL In-Reply-To: <20071014230345.GA23062@themuso.com> References: <0JPX000JF6FHSCRC@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> <20071014230345.GA23062@themuso.com> Message-ID: <20071015122815.GA11313@mur.org.uk> On Mon, Oct 15, 2007 at 09:03:45AM +1000, Luke Yelavich wrote: > I've just had a thought about why this is occurring. Espeak that will ship in gutsy final will > use portaudio v18 again, as portaudio v19 was giving troubles. V18 only uses oss, and since you > are running speech-dispatcher, portaudio v18 cannot talk to the oss device, as speech-dispatcher > is running. You will need to stop speech-dispatcher to use espeak with the gnome-speech driver. Another alternative, which is working perfectly for me, is to divert espeak-synthesis-driver, and replace it with a script which uses aoss to run espeak-synthesis-driver. See the list archives for a step by step explanation. This allows espeak to use alsa, so you can use other audio apps. I currently use orca, emacspeak and windows in virtualbox. Would it be useful if I made a package for this? Regards Rob > - -- > Luke Yelavich > GPG key: 0xD06320CE > (http://www.themuso.com/themuso-gpg-key.txt) > Email & MSN: themuso at themuso.com > Jabber: themuso at jabber.org.au > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) > > iD8DBQFHEqBRjVefwtBjIM4RAhUQAJ9V4dZhI7Rb4VViNlciagT5J6mnwQCgoAP0 > xiX8ZjMp/pGAlSwGKtF1z/A= > =Ijtw > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility From themuso at themuso.com Mon Oct 15 12:57:57 2007 From: themuso at themuso.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2007 22:57:57 +1000 Subject: orca nolonger speaksL In-Reply-To: <20071015122815.GA11313@mur.org.uk> References: <0JPX000JF6FHSCRC@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> <20071014230345.GA23062@themuso.com> <20071015122815.GA11313@mur.org.uk> Message-ID: <20071015125757.GA4255@themuso.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Mon, Oct 15, 2007 at 10:28:17PM EST, Robert Murray wrote: > Would it be useful if I made a package for this? Not at this point. Aoss doesn't always reliably work with all sound cards for all apps. - -- Luke Yelavich GPG key: 0xD06320CE (http://www.themuso.com/themuso-gpg-key.txt) Email & MSN: themuso at themuso.com Jabber: themuso at jabber.org.au -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFHE2PVjVefwtBjIM4RApD0AJ96dqzyXXbiQU6mwImfKM79qyfeQgCfYjEG lJ/k0EOoSuTtsd67zI/RB6o= =Ctc5 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From William.Walker at Sun.COM Mon Oct 15 14:55:12 2007 From: William.Walker at Sun.COM (Willie Walker) Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2007 10:55:12 -0400 Subject: Who do I tell In-Reply-To: <471187D0.200@frontiernet.net> References: <471187D0.200@frontiernet.net> Message-ID: <47137F50.2080408@sun.com> Hi Wil: > I use Ubuntu and Orca, which came on my new Dell 1420 Laptop. > Neat! Did it come this way from Dell? If so, which version of Ubuntu did it come with? > For instance, now there is no way I know of to shut Orca off. > You wonder why I would want to!! > The answer is that in Thunderbird, when I try to send mail, a box asks > for THE My password, which is the one for the ISP. > If ORCA is off, it will work, and I can send mail, or receive mail.; and > I can check the box that says remember this password. > I am sighted; a blind person could never cope. > Now I can only cope by removing ORCA, signing on, remembering the > password being checked, and then reinstall Orca. > This sounds like it might be some bad integration between the thing asking for the password and the AT-SPI. Knowing more about your system will definitely help us narrow down the possible problems. Can you send the output of the following commands please? orca --version gnome-about --version uname -a Thanks! Will (Orca project lead) From rob at mur.org.uk Mon Oct 15 15:10:56 2007 From: rob at mur.org.uk (Robert Murray) Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2007 16:10:56 +0100 Subject: orca nolonger speaksL In-Reply-To: <20071015125757.GA4255@themuso.com> References: <0JPX000JF6FHSCRC@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> <20071014230345.GA23062@themuso.com> <20071015122815.GA11313@mur.org.uk> <20071015125757.GA4255@themuso.com> Message-ID: <20071015151056.GB11313@mur.org.uk> On Mon, Oct 15, 2007 at 10:57:57PM +1000, Luke Yelavich wrote: > > Would it be useful if I made a package for this? > > Not at this point. Aoss doesn't always reliably work with all sound cards for all apps. I know, it's just a hack, but it works for me, and should work for others. Of course I just mean to create an unofficial package, this kind of hack shouldn't ever go in to the archive. Regards Rob From themuso at themuso.com Mon Oct 15 22:20:53 2007 From: themuso at themuso.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Tue, 16 Oct 2007 08:20:53 +1000 Subject: orca nolonger speaksL In-Reply-To: <20071015151056.GB11313@mur.org.uk> References: <0JPX000JF6FHSCRC@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> <20071014230345.GA23062@themuso.com> <20071015122815.GA11313@mur.org.uk> <20071015125757.GA4255@themuso.com> <20071015151056.GB11313@mur.org.uk> Message-ID: <20071015222053.GA8208@themuso.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Tue, Oct 16, 2007 at 01:10:56AM EST, Robert Murray wrote: > I know, it's just a hack, but it works for me, and should work for others. Of course I just mean to create an unofficial package, this kind of hack > shouldn't ever go in to the archive. I plan to backport updated orca/gnome-speech packages for gutsy, which will go in my PPA, so I can include this change if people wish it. - -- Luke Yelavich GPG key: 0xD06320CE (http://www.themuso.com/themuso-gpg-key.txt) Email & MSN: themuso at themuso.com Jabber: themuso at jabber.org.au -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFHE+fFjVefwtBjIM4RAiaLAJ9nhmpokv1EI/4TJwHzHV6gVKZ4zgCeNW6B T4CThMi/tx0/5RoYzNgNwDY= =nh7f -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From herzog at frontiernet.net Mon Oct 15 22:48:36 2007 From: herzog at frontiernet.net (Herzog) Date: Mon, 15 Oct 2007 18:48:36 -0400 Subject: Speech quitting In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4713EE44.2050408@frontiernet.net> 3 messages on ubuntu-accessibility-request at lists.ubuntu.com wrote: > 1. orca nolonger speaks (mike coulombe) > 2. Re: orca nolonger speaks (Luke Yelavich) > 3. Re: orca nolonger speaksL (Luke Yelavich) > > I had the no speak problem; cured by different things wrong. Once was fixed by removing and reinstalling ORCA, when it regained it's sound, AND found the IBM voice I'd been trying to add. The second time was the sound volume control being not installed, according to a boot up screen, which was fixed by an update. My updates are automatic, with permission, so I don't know how to steer you to them. Wil From Brian.Cameron at Sun.COM Tue Oct 16 17:40:19 2007 From: Brian.Cameron at Sun.COM (Brian Cameron) Date: Tue, 16 Oct 2007 12:40:19 -0500 Subject: [orca-list] accessible login In-Reply-To: <1192543155.11607.1.camel@boilermaker.dyn.webahead.ibm.com> References: <20071006100848.6ED7B25E@pop15.mta.everyone.net> <470BCDF2.2080206@sun.com> <20071010133348.GJ6341@rednote.net> <470D1E11.5020506@sun.com> <1192543155.11607.1.camel@boilermaker.dyn.webahead.ibm.com> Message-ID: <4714F783.3010702@sun.com> George: > On Wed, 2007-10-10 at 13:46 -0500, Brian Cameron wrote: >> gdmsetup is also not accessible, and probably can't be as long as it >> requires that you run it as root. > > This should not be an issue on GNOME 2.18 and newer systems. > > http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=163132 I assume you mean that gdmsetup should work when launched with gksu when you run it after you have logged in. Yes, this is true. I should have been more clear. I don't think gdmsetup will work when launched directly from the login screen if the user has configured GDM to allow people to launch this from the GDM System Menu. In this situation, I don't believe GDM starts gdmsetup with the at-spi daemon running, and it doesn't seem to work so well in my testing. One idea for fixing this would be to modify gdmsetup so that it runs as a non-root user (such as the gdm user when launched from the logins creen), and is modified so that it has an "Apply" button. This way gdmsetup would only actually modify the configuration when the user clicks the "Apply" button and not the current way it works (where it updates the configuration as you make changes in gdmsetup). Then we could modify gdmsetup so that the action it performs when you click this "Apply" button is done with privilege via gksu or whatever. This way none of the GUI aspects of the program need to run as root. But, as you may be aware, GDM is currently being rewritten to use D-Bus, so perhaps things will be fixed in a different way? Brian From kb8aey at verizon.net Tue Oct 16 22:13:19 2007 From: kb8aey at verizon.net (mike coulombe) Date: Tue, 16 Oct 2007 17:13:19 -0500 (CDT) Subject: speech-dispatcher Message-ID: <0JQ0004Q8Z25VH53@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> Hi, I notice when speech-dispatcher is running yasr doesn't work. Is there a way to correct this problem. I use yasr because dosemu doesn't work with orca. Mike. From listaddr1 at gmx.net Wed Oct 17 06:17:39 2007 From: listaddr1 at gmx.net (Lukas Loehrer) Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 08:17:39 +0200 Subject: speech-dispatcher In-Reply-To: <0JQ0004Q8Z25VH53@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> References: <0JQ0004Q8Z25VH53@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <18197.43267.877565.527833@gargle.gargle.HOWL> mike coulombe writes ("speech-dispatcher"): > Hi, I notice when speech-dispatcher is running yasr doesn't work. Is there a way to correct this problem. I use yasr because dosemu doesn't work with orca. What tts system are you using with yasr? If you have a reasonably new version of yasr, it can use speech-dispatcher just like orca. If you are using yasr with eflite, you must make sure you use a version of flite with the alsa patch. Best regards, Lukas From shalev.tomer at gmail.com Wed Oct 17 14:44:39 2007 From: shalev.tomer at gmail.com (Tomer Shalev) Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 16:44:39 +0200 Subject: Booting Ubuntu into Orca involves too complicated key-sequence (F5, Down, Down, Down, Enter) Message-ID: <9cff4eb30710170744l7087e181l7ae81cca0694a5e3@mail.gmail.com> Hi there, In Ubuntu, during the boot stage the user is shown the following options after pressing F5 (See Accessible Install of Ubuntu Feisty ): - None (has focus) - High Contrast - Magnifier - Screen Reader - Keyboard Modifiers - On Screen Keyboard I this that the 'Screen Reader' option should be the first option, so that in order to save a blind user from counting the number of times that he/she have to press the 'Down' button. Actually, it would be better if the 'Screen Reader' had its own function key assigned to, say F10, so that blind users can start Orca with one press of a button, rather than having to press 'F5, Down, Down, Down, Enter', which seems a bit demanding, considering the fact that typing the wrong key sequence results in an un-usable boot from the view point of a blind person. I guess it would be hard to persuade Ubuntu team to allocate a function key for Orca in the main boot menu, but it worth a shot. Promoting the 'Screen Reader' option be the first option in the 'F5' menu is also an adequate solution, as the user would only press 'F5, Enter'. What do you think? Note: This message was first posted at orca-list: http://mail.gnome.org/archives/orca-list/2007-October/msg00181.html Tomer Shalev -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rkcole72984 at gmail.com Wed Oct 17 19:47:47 2007 From: rkcole72984 at gmail.com (Robert Cole) Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 12:47:47 -0700 Subject: Utilizing Orca (General Question) Message-ID: <471666E3.5040703@gmail.com> Hello, everyone. I've been taking classes related to the JAWS screen reader for the past couple of weeks. The organization which is teaching me does not offer any support for Ubuntu/Linux (nor did they really know anything about it). I've been a user of screen magnifiers for years, but I've recently realized that I can accomplish things a lot faster by using a screen reader. I've been working with Orca a bit today, and I just have a few questions: 1) How does one go about reading Web pages with Orca? Is this something which will be improved with Firefox in Ubuntu Gutsy? 2) Is Thunderbird at all accessible? 3) I found the page which contains information related to Orca keyboard shortcuts. Are there any others whihc may not be listed? And is there any other place I can find information on Orca? Thanks, everyone. Take care. From kb8aey at verizon.net Wed Oct 17 22:51:34 2007 From: kb8aey at verizon.net (mike coulombe) Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 17:51:34 -0500 (CDT) Subject: problems playing music when orca is running. Message-ID: <0JQ200BDAVHXDWW5@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> Hi, I notice when trying to play a song when orca is running all sound is lost. Exiting the music does get orca to speak again. I haven't tried this for awhile, but thought I red awhile ago that port audio was suppose to correct this problem. It doesn't matter if software mixing is enabled or not, the result is the same. If this is suppose to work, is there another setting that has to be made. Thanks Mike. X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 000782-1, 10/17/2007), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean From metalhead1009000 at gmail.com Wed Oct 17 23:07:52 2007 From: metalhead1009000 at gmail.com (Mike Reiser) Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 18:07:52 -0500 Subject: Utilizing Orca (General Question) References: <471666E3.5040703@gmail.com> Message-ID: <002b01c81112$8c3dc100$b5e44e8b@mike5cb7a2e1b7> As for reading webpages, you can arrow through them and yse the H and shift H keys to go through them. Improvements are being made all the time and I'm sure it'll get better in gutsy. Mike ----- Original Message ----- From: "Robert Cole" To: "Ubuntu Accessibility Mailing List" Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 2:47 PM Subject: Utilizing Orca (General Question) > Hello, everyone. > > I've been taking classes related to the JAWS screen reader for the past > couple of weeks. The organization which is teaching me does not offer > any support for Ubuntu/Linux (nor did they really know anything about > it). I've been a user of screen magnifiers for years, but I've recently > realized that I can accomplish things a lot faster by using a screen > reader. I've been working with Orca a bit today, and I just have a few > questions: > > 1) How does one go about reading Web pages with Orca? Is this > something which will be improved with Firefox in Ubuntu Gutsy? > > 2) Is Thunderbird at all accessible? > > 3) I found the page which contains information related to Orca keyboard > shortcuts. Are there any others whihc may not be listed? And is there > any other place I can find information on Orca? > > Thanks, everyone. > > Take care. > > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility From kb8aey at verizon.net Wed Oct 17 23:04:49 2007 From: kb8aey at verizon.net (mike coulombe) Date: Wed, 17 Oct 2007 18:04:49 -0500 (CDT) Subject: can orca be set different for each ap Message-ID: <0JQ200MMEW41SKU6@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> Hi, can the preferences for orca like rate be set different for each ap. For example a slower rate in openoffice. I didn't see anything in the settings regarding this, but I remember someone mentioned this several months ago. Mike. From listaddr1 at gmx.net Thu Oct 18 08:11:18 2007 From: listaddr1 at gmx.net (Lukas Loehrer) Date: Thu, 18 Oct 2007 10:11:18 +0200 Subject: problems playing music when orca is running. In-Reply-To: <0JQ200BDAVHXDWW5@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> References: <0JQ200BDAVHXDWW5@vms046.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <18199.5414.131168.2396@gargle.gargle.HOWL> mike coulombe writes ("problems playing music when orca is running."): > Hi, I notice when trying to play a song when orca is running all sound is lost. > Exiting the music does get orca to speak again. I haven't tried this for awhile, but thought I red awhile ago that port audio was suppose to correct this problem. > It doesn't matter if software mixing is enabled or not, the result is the same. If this is suppose to work, is there another setting that has to be made. Thanks Mike. Gutsy still uses portaudio 18, so things have not changed with respect to audio mixing. You have at least two options: either use speech-dispatcher or try the aoss trick with gnome-speech as discussed before for example on the orca list. Best regards, Lukas From kb8aey at verizon.net Sun Oct 21 16:40:13 2007 From: kb8aey at verizon.net (mike coulombe) Date: Sun, 21 Oct 2007 11:40:13 -0500 (CDT) Subject: problems installing the latest version Message-ID: <0JQ9009ELSZ11CL6@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> Hi, I have a older dell desktop I want to install the latest version of ubuntu on. For some reason the dapper live CD will load, but any live CD after that doesn't. It starts to boot and stops in a few seconds. The words ubuntu are on the screen. My question is is this a live CD issue, or a case where linux will not work on this computer. If anyone has had this problem, did you try the alternative CD. If so did this work. Mike. From debee at jfcl.com Tue Oct 23 04:06:50 2007 From: debee at jfcl.com (Deborah Norling) Date: Mon, 22 Oct 2007 21:06:50 -0700 Subject: Disappointed with Gutsy live (long) Message-ID: <000001c8152a$24136640$8201010a@Reason> I like Ubuntu, because as they say, it usually "just works". I run a feisty-based server and helped my sighted husband set up MythTV on a pre-release of Gutsy. That's why I'm particularly disappointed with the newly released Gutsy live desktop CD. I'm posting this in detail in hopes that I've just missed something crucial. I played with the Feisty live CD back in March and April of this year, before and after it was released. I never successfully installed Feisty using Orca. I had no trouble at all with Ubuntu (any version) if I stuck to the alternate or server install CD, and installed using the serial port. But the problems I had with Feisty six months ago seem to still be occurring. Serial ports are disappearing from desktops so I want to be able to use Linux without needing to depend on speakup, hardware synthesizers or serial consoles. At this point Linux is a hobby; I work as a Windows computer tech for a college. But I hope to eventually ditch Windows and even find employment working in a non-windows environment. I boot the Gutsy live desktop CD and press F5 for the access options. I press 3 or arrow down to it, to activate Orca. I press ENTER twice and wait a couple of minutes. Orca runs, and it seems to be working as well as it ever worked. It can't read help, which would seem to be the first thing a new user would want to do, but OpenOffice does work, so I presume it is happy with my hardware. I run brltty by quitting orca, running gnome-terminal, typing sudo su and on the next command line typing "brltty -bauto -d/dev/ttyUSB0". Brltty runs, but says the screen is not in text mode. Ok, guess even in a terminal, we aren't in text mode. It would be nice if this was better documented; the need to run brltty for Braille support, even though Braille support is already checked in the Orca preferences, the fact that even in gnome-terminal the screen is presumably not text-based, and the fact that help isn't working. I can add to the wiki of course. but would beginners know to look there? What about a readme on the CD, which auto-starts in Windows with a screen that's basically advertising for Ubuntu with no real information. Or maybe just a how-to page on the Ubuntu site that covers all this. I am eager to improve the docs, but I have to get it running first and know what I'm doing. Another disappointment: this is still brltty 3.72. The Orca wiki states that it's better to use 3.8 because it can be compiled with the python bindings -- so why is an older, less effective version on this new live CD? I run Orca again and now it is communicating with brltty. Python bindings or not, it seems to show everything in Braille just fine. On my Windows PC, I search the internet for information about installing Gutsy using Orca. Lots of info about conflicts with different versions of portaudio, forum postings about how cool it is that Ubuntu is accessible, but no definitive tutorial or how-to on installing. A few days ago, I found lots more information on fixing MythTV problems. It's disappointing that there is so little information as I do believe strongly in RTFM. I've already tried the Install icon from the desktop with my husband reading the screen. He confirms that the install runs, but Orca can only echo keystrokes, it reads nothing in the install dialogs. I locate instructions on installing Feisty with Orca, the same wiki page I've myself contributed to. I follow those instructions, running gnome-terminal, typing sudo su, quitting orca, then running orca again with orca --disable-setup --disable main-window. I next type ubiquity, and the install runs, but still, Orca can't read any of it. Not even in flat review does it see anything. Between these tests I've done alt-ctrl-backspace to kill the X session, and brltty remains active, informing me that default boot scripts are being run. Each time Orca does automatically load and work with Braille. It crashes once, but I get it back easily, and the system seems generally stable. At one point, I try running gparted as root, and though ps confirms that gparted is running, Orca can't read its screen either. Is orca only really able to let me access just a few "productivity" apps? I saw that Sun at CSUN had done a session on MythTV with Orca last year, so I'd expected Orca to work with a wide variety of software. I've tried this on several PCS and I can't figure out if Orca is really this undeveloped or I'm doing something wrong. I've looked on the wiki at what I presume are the latest release notes; they discuss details like the spell-checker working better in OpenOffice, Firefox 2 vs 3 and the bugginess of acroread. I'm grateful that so much hard work has gone in to working with the Firefox developers and scripting applications like Gaim, But I now just want to read the install dialogs. In theory, since X is client-server based, since all information is openly available, and because a whole ton of people are working hard on this project, Orca should be miles ahead of Windows screen readers like JAWS. I'm disappointed; I really want to ditch Windows, but how can I if access is this flaky still? --Debee -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From metalhead1009000 at gmail.com Tue Oct 23 12:34:24 2007 From: metalhead1009000 at gmail.com (Mike Reiser) Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 07:34:24 -0500 Subject: Disappointed with Gutsy live (long) References: <000001c8152a$24136640$8201010a@Reason> Message-ID: <007101c81571$0c6ff250$b5e44e8b@mike5cb7a2e1b7> I share your disappointments, I can't even get the live CD to work here. We've been basically excluded from the testing phase of this version also. Mike ----- Original Message ----- From: Deborah Norling To: ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 11:06 PM Subject: Disappointed with Gutsy live (long) I like Ubuntu, because as they say, it usually "just works". I run a feisty-based server and helped my sighted husband set up MythTV on a pre-release of Gutsy. That's why I'm particularly disappointed with the newly released Gutsy live desktop CD. I'm posting this in detail in hopes that I've just missed something crucial. I played with the Feisty live CD back in March and April of this year, before and after it was released. I never successfully installed Feisty using Orca. I had no trouble at all with Ubuntu (any version) if I stuck to the alternate or server install CD, and installed using the serial port. But the problems I had with Feisty six months ago seem to still be occurring. Serial ports are disappearing from desktops so I want to be able to use Linux without needing to depend on speakup, hardware synthesizers or serial consoles. At this point Linux is a hobby; I work as a Windows computer tech for a college. But I hope to eventually ditch Windows and even find employment working in a non-windows environment. I boot the Gutsy live desktop CD and press F5 for the access options. I press 3 or arrow down to it, to activate Orca. I press ENTER twice and wait a couple of minutes. Orca runs, and it seems to be working as well as it ever worked. It can't read help, which would seem to be the first thing a new user would want to do, but OpenOffice does work, so I presume it is happy with my hardware. I run brltty by quitting orca, running gnome-terminal, typing sudo su and on the next command line typing "brltty -bauto -d/dev/ttyUSB0". Brltty runs, but says the screen is not in text mode. Ok, guess even in a terminal, we aren't in text mode. It would be nice if this was better documented; the need to run brltty for Braille support, even though Braille support is already checked in the Orca preferences, the fact that even in gnome-terminal the screen is presumably not text-based, and the fact that help isn't working. I can add to the wiki of course. but would beginners know to look there? What about a readme on the CD, which auto-starts in Windows with a screen that's basically advertising for Ubuntu with no real information. Or maybe just a how-to page on the Ubuntu site that covers all this. I am eager to improve the docs, but I have to get it running first and know what I'm doing. Another disappointment: this is still brltty 3.72. The Orca wiki states that it's better to use 3.8 because it can be compiled with the python bindings -- so why is an older, less effective version on this new live CD? I run Orca again and now it is communicating with brltty. Python bindings or not, it seems to show everything in Braille just fine. On my Windows PC, I search the internet for information about installing Gutsy using Orca. Lots of info about conflicts with different versions of portaudio, forum postings about how cool it is that Ubuntu is accessible, but no definitive tutorial or how-to on installing. A few days ago, I found lots more information on fixing MythTV problems. It's disappointing that there is so little information as I do believe strongly in RTFM. I've already tried the Install icon from the desktop with my husband reading the screen. He confirms that the install runs, but Orca can only echo keystrokes, it reads nothing in the install dialogs. I locate instructions on installing Feisty with Orca, the same wiki page I've myself contributed to. I follow those instructions, running gnome-terminal, typing sudo su, quitting orca, then running orca again with orca --disable-setup --disable main-window. I next type ubiquity, and the install runs, but still, Orca can't read any of it. Not even in flat review does it see anything. Between these tests I've done alt-ctrl-backspace to kill the X session, and brltty remains active, informing me that default boot scripts are being run. Each time Orca does automatically load and work with Braille. It crashes once, but I get it back easily, and the system seems generally stable. At one point, I try running gparted as root, and though ps confirms that gparted is running, Orca can't read its screen either. Is orca only really able to let me access just a few "productivity" apps? I saw that Sun at CSUN had done a session on MythTV with Orca last year, so I'd expected Orca to work with a wide variety of software. I've tried this on several PCS and I can't figure out if Orca is really this undeveloped or I'm doing something wrong. I've looked on the wiki at what I presume are the latest release notes; they discuss details like the spell-checker working better in OpenOffice, Firefox 2 vs 3 and the bugginess of acroread. I'm grateful that so much hard work has gone in to working with the Firefox developers and scripting applications like Gaim, But I now just want to read the install dialogs. In theory, since X is client-server based, since all information is openly available, and because a whole ton of people are working hard on this project, Orca should be miles ahead of Windows screen readers like JAWS. I'm disappointed; I really want to ditch Windows, but how can I if access is this flaky still? --Debee ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ -- Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From softy.lofty.ilp at btinternet.com Tue Oct 23 21:00:07 2007 From: softy.lofty.ilp at btinternet.com (Ian Pascoe) Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 22:00:07 +0100 Subject: Upgrading to gutsy In-Reply-To: <0JQ9009ELSZ11CL6@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: Hi Upgraded from 6.10 to 7.04 using the update manager with no problems. Updated yesterday from 7.04 to 7.10 and this went through OK. However, Orca now no longer starts at boot up - no change in user details. Although I can get Orca up and running, when I press Insert and Space to get the Orca preferences, I get the message " Starting Orca preferences - this may take some time", and after 5 minutes I lost patience and Ctrol + Shift + Del to re-start Gnome. Having done so, I only got a system beep, and no drums. Tried accessing the preferences again and waited for about 10 minutes and still no box, Ctrl + Shift + Del and the computer re-started. I have not as yet managed to change to allow Orca to start up at boot time, as I cannot set the preferences to make the screen useable. So two questions - one, why did Orca get disabled during the upgrade process? Secondly, how long should I wait for the Orca preferences dialogue to appear? Ian From jdashiel at shellworld.net Tue Oct 23 21:27:52 2007 From: jdashiel at shellworld.net (Jude DaShiell) Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 16:27:52 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Disappointed with Gutsy live (long) In-Reply-To: <007101c81571$0c6ff250$b5e44e8b@mike5cb7a2e1b7> References: <000001c8152a$24136640$8201010a@Reason> <007101c81571$0c6ff250$b5e44e8b@mike5cb7a2e1b7> Message-ID: I read over on the speakup list of another failed attempt to get the system upgraded from feisty to gutsy using the CD if memory serves. Apparently not all the hardware that was on the computer was supported by gutsy so dpkg went into a Catch #22 situation where further upgrading is blocked because dpkg couldn't install a package correctly and completely. On Tue, 23 Oct 2007, Mike Reiser wrote: > I share your disappointments, I can't even get the live CD to work here. We've been basically excluded from the testing phase of this version also. > > Mike > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Deborah Norling > To: ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 11:06 PM > Subject: Disappointed with Gutsy live (long) > > > I like Ubuntu, because as they say, it usually "just works". I run a feisty-based server and helped my sighted husband set up MythTV on a pre-release of Gutsy. > > That's why I'm particularly disappointed with the newly released Gutsy live desktop CD. I'm posting this in detail in hopes that I've just missed something crucial. > > I played with the Feisty live CD back in March and April of this year, before and after it was released. I never successfully installed Feisty using Orca. I had no trouble at all with Ubuntu (any version) if I stuck to the alternate or server install CD, and installed using the serial port. But the problems I had with Feisty six months ago seem to still be occurring. > > Serial ports are disappearing from desktops so I want to be able to use Linux without needing to depend on speakup, hardware synthesizers or serial consoles. At this point Linux is a hobby; I work as a Windows computer tech for a college. But I hope to eventually ditch Windows and even find employment working in a non-windows environment. > > I boot the Gutsy live desktop CD and press F5 for the access options. I press 3 or arrow down to it, to activate Orca. I press ENTER twice and wait a couple of minutes. > > Orca runs, and it seems to be working as well as it ever worked. It can't read help, which would seem to be the first thing a new user would want to do, but OpenOffice does work, so I presume it is happy with my hardware. > > I run brltty by quitting orca, running gnome-terminal, typing sudo su and on the next command line typing "brltty -bauto -d/dev/ttyUSB0". > > Brltty runs, but says the screen is not in text mode. Ok, guess even in a terminal, we aren't in text mode. > > It would be nice if this was better documented; the need to run brltty for Braille support, even though Braille support is already checked in the Orca preferences, the fact that even in gnome-terminal the screen is presumably not text-based, and the fact that help isn't working. I can add to the wiki of course. but would beginners know to look there? What about a readme on the CD, which auto-starts in Windows with a screen that's basically advertising for Ubuntu with no real information. Or maybe just a how-to page on the Ubuntu site that covers all this. I am eager to improve the docs, but I have to get it running first and know what I'm doing. > > Another disappointment: this is still brltty 3.72. The Orca wiki states that it's better to use 3.8 because it can be compiled with the python bindings -- so why is an older, less effective version on this new live CD? > > I run Orca again and now it is communicating with brltty. Python bindings or not, it seems to show everything in Braille just fine. > > On my Windows PC, I search the internet for information about installing Gutsy using Orca. Lots of info about conflicts with different versions of portaudio, forum postings about how cool it is that Ubuntu is accessible, but no definitive tutorial or how-to on installing. A few days ago, I found lots more information on fixing MythTV problems. It's disappointing that there is so little information as I do believe strongly in RTFM. > > I've already tried the Install icon from the desktop with my husband reading the screen. He confirms that the install runs, but Orca can only echo keystrokes, it reads nothing in the install dialogs. > > I locate instructions on installing Feisty with Orca, the same wiki page I've myself contributed to. I follow those instructions, running gnome-terminal, typing sudo su, quitting orca, then running orca again with orca --disable-setup --disable main-window. I next type ubiquity, and the install runs, but still, Orca can't read any of it. Not even in flat review does it see anything. > > Between these tests I've done alt-ctrl-backspace to kill the X session, and brltty remains active, informing me that default boot scripts are being run. Each time Orca does automatically load and work with Braille. It crashes once, but I get it back easily, and the system seems generally stable. > > At one point, I try running gparted as root, and though ps confirms that gparted is running, Orca can't read its screen either. Is orca only really able to let me access just a few "productivity" apps? I saw that Sun at CSUN had done a session on MythTV with Orca last year, so I'd expected Orca to work with a wide variety of software. > > I've tried this on several PCS and I can't figure out if Orca is really this undeveloped or I'm doing something wrong. > > I've looked on the wiki at what I presume are the latest release notes; they discuss details like the spell-checker working better in OpenOffice, Firefox 2 vs 3 and the bugginess of acroread. I'm grateful that so much hard work has gone in to working with the Firefox developers and scripting applications like Gaim, But I now just want to read the install dialogs. > > In theory, since X is client-server based, since all information is openly available, and because a whole ton of people are working hard on this project, Orca should be miles ahead of Windows screen readers like JAWS. I'm disappointed; I really want to ditch Windows, but how can I if access is this flaky still? > > --Debee > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility > From metalhead1009000 at gmail.com Tue Oct 23 22:49:44 2007 From: metalhead1009000 at gmail.com (Mike Reiser) Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 17:49:44 -0500 Subject: Disappointed with Gutsy live (long) References: <000001c8152a$24136640$8201010a@Reason> <007101c81571$0c6ff250$b5e44e8b@mike5cb7a2e1b7> Message-ID: <007f01c815c7$0ad84540$b5e44e8b@mike5cb7a2e1b7> I've tried it in a vm on windows and natively on the cd and no luck in eather case. I think we should wait until it is finally confirmed that the cd works properly. Mike ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jude DaShiell" To: "Mike Reiser" Cc: ; Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 4:27 PM Subject: Re: Disappointed with Gutsy live (long) >I read over on the speakup list of another failed attempt to get the system >upgraded from feisty to gutsy using the CD if memory serves. Apparently not >all the hardware that was on the computer was supported by gutsy so dpkg >went into a Catch #22 situation where further upgrading is blocked because >dpkg couldn't install a package correctly and completely. > > > > On Tue, 23 Oct 2007, Mike Reiser wrote: > >> I share your disappointments, I can't even get the live CD to work here. >> We've been basically excluded from the testing phase of this version >> also. >> >> Mike >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: Deborah Norling >> To: ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com >> Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 11:06 PM >> Subject: Disappointed with Gutsy live (long) >> >> >> I like Ubuntu, because as they say, it usually "just works". I run a >> feisty-based server and helped my sighted husband set up MythTV on a >> pre-release of Gutsy. >> >> That's why I'm particularly disappointed with the newly released Gutsy >> live desktop CD. I'm posting this in detail in hopes that I've just >> missed something crucial. >> >> I played with the Feisty live CD back in March and April of this year, >> before and after it was released. I never successfully installed Feisty >> using Orca. I had no trouble at all with Ubuntu (any version) if I stuck >> to the alternate or server install CD, and installed using the serial >> port. But the problems I had with Feisty six months ago seem to still be >> occurring. >> >> Serial ports are disappearing from desktops so I want to be able to use >> Linux without needing to depend on speakup, hardware synthesizers or >> serial consoles. At this point Linux is a hobby; I work as a Windows >> computer tech for a college. But I hope to eventually ditch Windows and >> even find employment working in a non-windows environment. >> >> I boot the Gutsy live desktop CD and press F5 for the access options. I >> press 3 or arrow down to it, to activate Orca. I press ENTER twice and >> wait a couple of minutes. >> >> Orca runs, and it seems to be working as well as it ever worked. It >> can't read help, which would seem to be the first thing a new user would >> want to do, but OpenOffice does work, so I presume it is happy with my >> hardware. >> >> I run brltty by quitting orca, running gnome-terminal, typing sudo su >> and on the next command line typing "brltty -bauto -d/dev/ttyUSB0". >> >> Brltty runs, but says the screen is not in text mode. Ok, guess even in >> a terminal, we aren't in text mode. >> >> It would be nice if this was better documented; the need to run brltty >> for Braille support, even though Braille support is already checked in >> the Orca preferences, the fact that even in gnome-terminal the screen is >> presumably not text-based, and the fact that help isn't working. I can >> add to the wiki of course. but would beginners know to look there? What >> about a readme on the CD, which auto-starts in Windows with a screen >> that's basically advertising for Ubuntu with no real information. Or >> maybe just a how-to page on the Ubuntu site that covers all this. I am >> eager to improve the docs, but I have to get it running first and know >> what I'm doing. >> >> Another disappointment: this is still brltty 3.72. The Orca wiki states >> that it's better to use 3.8 because it can be compiled with the python >> bindings -- so why is an older, less effective version on this new live >> CD? >> >> I run Orca again and now it is communicating with brltty. Python >> bindings or not, it seems to show everything in Braille just fine. >> >> On my Windows PC, I search the internet for information about installing >> Gutsy using Orca. Lots of info about conflicts with different versions of >> portaudio, forum postings about how cool it is that Ubuntu is >> accessible, but no definitive tutorial or how-to on installing. A few >> days ago, I found lots more information on fixing MythTV problems. It's >> disappointing that there is so little information as I do believe >> strongly in RTFM. >> >> I've already tried the Install icon from the desktop with my husband >> reading the screen. He confirms that the install runs, but Orca can only >> echo keystrokes, it reads nothing in the install dialogs. >> >> I locate instructions on installing Feisty with Orca, the same wiki page >> I've myself contributed to. I follow those instructions, running >> gnome-terminal, typing sudo su, quitting orca, then running orca again >> with orca --disable-setup --disable main-window. I next type ubiquity, >> and the install runs, but still, Orca can't read any of it. Not even in >> flat review does it see anything. >> >> Between these tests I've done alt-ctrl-backspace to kill the X session, >> and brltty remains active, informing me that default boot scripts are >> being run. Each time Orca does automatically load and work with Braille. >> It crashes once, but I get it back easily, and the system seems generally >> stable. >> >> At one point, I try running gparted as root, and though ps confirms that >> gparted is running, Orca can't read its screen either. Is orca only >> really able to let me access just a few "productivity" apps? I saw that >> Sun at CSUN had done a session on MythTV with Orca last year, so I'd >> expected Orca to work with a wide variety of software. >> >> I've tried this on several PCS and I can't figure out if Orca is really >> this undeveloped or I'm doing something wrong. >> >> I've looked on the wiki at what I presume are the latest release notes; >> they discuss details like the spell-checker working better in OpenOffice, >> Firefox 2 vs 3 and the bugginess of acroread. I'm grateful that so much >> hard work has gone in to working with the Firefox developers and >> scripting applications like Gaim, But I now just want to read the install >> dialogs. >> >> In theory, since X is client-server based, since all information is >> openly available, and because a whole ton of people are working hard on >> this project, Orca should be miles ahead of Windows screen readers like >> JAWS. I'm disappointed; I really want to ditch Windows, but how can I if >> access is this flaky still? >> >> --Debee >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> >> -- >> Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list >> Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com >> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility >> From jdashiel at shellworld.net Tue Oct 23 23:38:13 2007 From: jdashiel at shellworld.net (Jude DaShiell) Date: Tue, 23 Oct 2007 18:38:13 -0500 (CDT) Subject: Disappointed with Gutsy live (long) In-Reply-To: <007f01c815c7$0ad84540$b5e44e8b@mike5cb7a2e1b7> References: <000001c8152a$24136640$8201010a@Reason> <007101c81571$0c6ff250$b5e44e8b@mike5cb7a2e1b7> <007f01c815c7$0ad84540$b5e44e8b@mike5cb7a2e1b7> Message-ID: I'm probably going to pass on this version entirely. A new version ought to come with accessibility improvements beyond gutsy that may be worth installing. On Tue, 23 Oct 2007, Mike Reiser wrote: > I've tried it in a vm on windows and natively on the cd and no luck in eather > case. I think we should wait until it is finally confirmed that the cd works > properly. > > Mike > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jude DaShiell" > To: "Mike Reiser" > Cc: ; > Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 4:27 PM > Subject: Re: Disappointed with Gutsy live (long) > > >> I read over on the speakup list of another failed attempt to get the system >> upgraded from feisty to gutsy using the CD if memory serves. Apparently not >> all the hardware that was on the computer was supported by gutsy so dpkg >> went into a Catch #22 situation where further upgrading is blocked because >> dpkg couldn't install a package correctly and completely. >> >> >> >> On Tue, 23 Oct 2007, Mike Reiser wrote: >> >> > I share your disappointments, I can't even get the live CD to work here. >> > We've been basically excluded from the testing phase of this version >> > also. >> > >> > Mike >> > ----- Original Message ----- >> > From: Deborah Norling >> > To: ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com >> > Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 11:06 PM >> > Subject: Disappointed with Gutsy live (long) >> > >> > >> > I like Ubuntu, because as they say, it usually "just works". I run a >> > feisty-based server and helped my sighted husband set up MythTV on a >> > pre-release of Gutsy. >> > >> > That's why I'm particularly disappointed with the newly released Gutsy >> > live desktop CD. I'm posting this in detail in hopes that I've just >> > missed something crucial. >> > >> > I played with the Feisty live CD back in March and April of this year, >> > before and after it was released. I never successfully installed Feisty >> > using Orca. I had no trouble at all with Ubuntu (any version) if I stuck >> > to the alternate or server install CD, and installed using the serial >> > port. But the problems I had with Feisty six months ago seem to still be >> > occurring. >> > >> > Serial ports are disappearing from desktops so I want to be able to use >> > Linux without needing to depend on speakup, hardware synthesizers or >> > serial consoles. At this point Linux is a hobby; I work as a Windows >> > computer tech for a college. But I hope to eventually ditch Windows and >> > even find employment working in a non-windows environment. >> > >> > I boot the Gutsy live desktop CD and press F5 for the access options. I >> > press 3 or arrow down to it, to activate Orca. I press ENTER twice and >> > wait a couple of minutes. >> > >> > Orca runs, and it seems to be working as well as it ever worked. It >> > can't read help, which would seem to be the first thing a new user would >> > want to do, but OpenOffice does work, so I presume it is happy with my >> > hardware. >> > >> > I run brltty by quitting orca, running gnome-terminal, typing sudo su >> > and on the next command line typing "brltty -bauto -d/dev/ttyUSB0". >> > >> > Brltty runs, but says the screen is not in text mode. Ok, guess even in >> > a terminal, we aren't in text mode. >> > >> > It would be nice if this was better documented; the need to run brltty >> > for Braille support, even though Braille support is already checked in >> > the Orca preferences, the fact that even in gnome-terminal the screen is >> > presumably not text-based, and the fact that help isn't working. I can >> > add to the wiki of course. but would beginners know to look there? What >> > about a readme on the CD, which auto-starts in Windows with a screen >> > that's basically advertising for Ubuntu with no real information. Or >> > maybe just a how-to page on the Ubuntu site that covers all this. I am >> > eager to improve the docs, but I have to get it running first and know >> > what I'm doing. >> > >> > Another disappointment: this is still brltty 3.72. The Orca wiki states >> > that it's better to use 3.8 because it can be compiled with the python >> > bindings -- so why is an older, less effective version on this new live >> > CD? >> > >> > I run Orca again and now it is communicating with brltty. Python >> > bindings or not, it seems to show everything in Braille just fine. >> > >> > On my Windows PC, I search the internet for information about installing >> > Gutsy using Orca. Lots of info about conflicts with different versions >> > of portaudio, forum postings about how cool it is that Ubuntu is >> > accessible, but no definitive tutorial or how-to on installing. A few >> > days ago, I found lots more information on fixing MythTV problems. It's >> > disappointing that there is so little information as I do believe >> > strongly in RTFM. >> > >> > I've already tried the Install icon from the desktop with my husband >> > reading the screen. He confirms that the install runs, but Orca can only >> > echo keystrokes, it reads nothing in the install dialogs. >> > >> > I locate instructions on installing Feisty with Orca, the same wiki page >> > I've myself contributed to. I follow those instructions, running >> > gnome-terminal, typing sudo su, quitting orca, then running orca again >> > with orca --disable-setup --disable main-window. I next type ubiquity, >> > and the install runs, but still, Orca can't read any of it. Not even in >> > flat review does it see anything. >> > >> > Between these tests I've done alt-ctrl-backspace to kill the X session, >> > and brltty remains active, informing me that default boot scripts are >> > being run. Each time Orca does automatically load and work with Braille. >> > It crashes once, but I get it back easily, and the system seems >> > generally stable. >> > >> > At one point, I try running gparted as root, and though ps confirms that >> > gparted is running, Orca can't read its screen either. Is orca only >> > really able to let me access just a few "productivity" apps? I saw that >> > Sun at CSUN had done a session on MythTV with Orca last year, so I'd >> > expected Orca to work with a wide variety of software. >> > >> > I've tried this on several PCS and I can't figure out if Orca is really >> > this undeveloped or I'm doing something wrong. >> > >> > I've looked on the wiki at what I presume are the latest release notes; >> > they discuss details like the spell-checker working better in >> > OpenOffice, Firefox 2 vs 3 and the bugginess of acroread. I'm grateful >> > that so much hard work has gone in to working with the Firefox >> > developers and scripting applications like Gaim, But I now just want to >> > read the install dialogs. >> > >> > In theory, since X is client-server based, since all information is >> > openly available, and because a whole ton of people are working hard on >> > this project, Orca should be miles ahead of Windows screen readers like >> > JAWS. I'm disappointed; I really want to ditch Windows, but how can I if >> > access is this flaky still? >> > >> > --Debee >> > >> > >> > >> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> > >> > >> > -- >> > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list >> > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com >> > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility >> > > From themuso at themuso.com Wed Oct 24 01:16:51 2007 From: themuso at themuso.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 11:16:51 +1000 Subject: Ubuntu Accessibility, only as good as your testing and feedback. Message-ID: <20071024011651.GB8990@themuso.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hello all I have seen much talk about the state of accessibility for Ubuntu 7.10 Feisty, and how some people have had no problems, yet thers are also those who are disappointed in the way things are for this release. I would like to make it clear, that the quality of accessibility is only as good as your testing, and feedback. By feedback, I do not mean posts to a mailing list, hoping that your questions will be ansered, and your feedback heard. The *BEST* way of giving feedback, is filing bugs against packages in Ubuntu. Once a bug is filed with specific information on what the problem is, and how it can be reproduced, action can then be taken to track down where the problem is, and get it fixed. Please note also, that I am currently the only one working to improve screen reader accessibility in Ubuntu, and I do it in my own time. If I was to receive funding to spend extra time working on Ubuntu accessibility, things would likely be a different story, but this is currently not to be, so I do what I can, when I can. As the new leader of the Ubuntu Accessibility team, I intend to put a call out for more helpers, whether it be in testing and feedback, being in contact with upstream projects, bug triajing, or packaging. The Ubuntu Developer's Summit for the hardy release is next week, and I hope to take a thorough look at where things stand accessibility wise, and what goals can be set, and implemented for the hardy release. Finally, I would like to thank everybody for sticking with Linux, and what it has to offer accessibility wise. I know it would be so easy to return to using what you know and feel comfortable with, but at least part time, choose not to, because you believe in a free alternative to proprietary accessibility technologies. This is also what I believe in, and do so very strongly and pashionately. There is still a ways to go yet, but with yor support, feedback, and testing, we can be a match, if not much better, than those technologies that more often than not, cost way more than what people with disabilities can afford. I would also like to thank the upstream project developers, and testers, whether paid, or not. If it weren't for your outstanding efforts, we would not have Linux accessibility as it is today. Please keep on encouraging your users to file bugs, give general feedback, and test. It requires all of us to pitch in, but together, we can only improve the chance that we may offer free accessibility technology equivalents to the masses, at a level of use that is on par with our proprietary competition. Thank you for your time and patience, and above all, for your support. Lets make Ubuntu Hardy rock! - -- Luke Yelavich GPG key: 0xD06320CE (http://www.themuso.com/themuso-gpg-key.txt) Email & MSN: themuso at themuso.com Jabber: themuso at jabber.org.au -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFHHp0DjVefwtBjIM4RAjK5AJ9ZA4dnAZkB1QcuWNCnWlWXduKHNQCgpHFu 7bIMhKCwKJoivsB/av3+URA= =M2wG -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From aeclist at candt.waitrose.com Wed Oct 24 10:19:41 2007 From: aeclist at candt.waitrose.com (alan c) Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 11:19:41 +0100 Subject: Ubuntu Accessibility, only as good as your testing and feedback. In-Reply-To: <20071024011651.GB8990@themuso.com> References: <20071024011651.GB8990@themuso.com> Message-ID: <471F1C3D.2060003@candt.waitrose.com> Luke Yelavich wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > Hello all > I have seen much talk about the state of accessibility for Ubuntu 7.10 Feisty, and how some > people have had no problems, yet thers are also those who are disappointed in the way things are > for this release. I would like to make it clear, that the quality of accessibility is only as > good as your testing, and feedback. By feedback, I do not mean posts to a mailing list, hoping > that your questions will be ansered, and your feedback heard. The *BEST* way of giving feedback, > is filing bugs against packages in Ubuntu. Once a bug is filed with specific information on what > the problem is, and how it can be reproduced, action can then be taken to track down where the > problem is, and get it fixed. > > Please note also, that I am currently the only one working to improve screen reader > accessibility in Ubuntu, and I do it in my own time. If I was to receive funding to spend extra > time working on Ubuntu accessibility, things would likely be a different story, but this is > currently not to be, so I do what I can, when I can. Thanks Luke! -- alan cocks Kubuntu user#10391 From metalhead1009000 at gmail.com Wed Oct 24 18:59:20 2007 From: metalhead1009000 at gmail.com (Mike Reiser) Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 13:59:20 -0500 Subject: Disappointed with Gutsy live (long) References: <000001c8152a$24136640$8201010a@Reason> <007101c81571$0c6ff250$b5e44e8b@mike5cb7a2e1b7> <007f01c815c7$0ad84540$b5e44e8b@mike5cb7a2e1b7> Message-ID: <013901c81670$01950230$b5e44e8b@mike5cb7a2e1b7> Just re-downloaded it and tried it again and it seems to work fine in a vm session, am going to install it and test it finally. The install method is still the same I tried to do it from the desktop didn't work. I do notice like Debra that the install dialogue isn't read automatically like it was in previous versions. I'll file this as a bug soon. Mike ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jude DaShiell" To: "Mike Reiser" Cc: ; Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 6:38 PM Subject: Re: Disappointed with Gutsy live (long) > I'm probably going to pass on this version entirely. A new version ought > to come with accessibility improvements beyond gutsy that may be worth > installing. > > > > On Tue, 23 Oct 2007, Mike Reiser wrote: > >> I've tried it in a vm on windows and natively on the cd and no luck in >> eather case. I think we should wait until it is finally confirmed that >> the cd works properly. >> >> Mike >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jude DaShiell" >> >> To: "Mike Reiser" >> Cc: ; >> Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 4:27 PM >> Subject: Re: Disappointed with Gutsy live (long) >> >> >>> I read over on the speakup list of another failed attempt to get the >>> system upgraded from feisty to gutsy using the CD if memory serves. >>> Apparently not all the hardware that was on the computer was supported >>> by gutsy so dpkg went into a Catch #22 situation where further upgrading >>> is blocked because dpkg couldn't install a package correctly and >>> completely. >>> >>> >>> On Tue, 23 Oct 2007, Mike Reiser wrote: >>> >>> > I share your disappointments, I can't even get the live CD to work >>> > here. We've been basically excluded from the testing phase of this >>> > version also. >>> > >>> > Mike >>> > ----- Original Message ----- >>> > From: Deborah Norling >>> > To: ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com >>> > Sent: Monday, October 22, 2007 11:06 PM >>> > Subject: Disappointed with Gutsy live (long) >>> > >>> > >>> > I like Ubuntu, because as they say, it usually "just works". I run a >>> > feisty-based server and helped my sighted husband set up MythTV on a >>> > pre-release of Gutsy. >>> > >>> > That's why I'm particularly disappointed with the newly released >>> > Gutsy live desktop CD. I'm posting this in detail in hopes that I've >>> > just missed something crucial. >>> > >>> > I played with the Feisty live CD back in March and April of this >>> > year, before and after it was released. I never successfully installed >>> > Feisty using Orca. I had no trouble at all with Ubuntu (any version) >>> > if I stuck to the alternate or server install CD, and installed using >>> > the serial port. But the problems I had with Feisty six months ago >>> > seem to still be occurring. >>> > >>> > Serial ports are disappearing from desktops so I want to be able to >>> > use Linux without needing to depend on speakup, hardware synthesizers >>> > or serial consoles. At this point Linux is a hobby; I work as a >>> > Windows computer tech for a college. But I hope to eventually ditch >>> > Windows and even find employment working in a non-windows environment. >>> > >>> > I boot the Gutsy live desktop CD and press F5 for the access options. >>> > I press 3 or arrow down to it, to activate Orca. I press ENTER twice >>> > and wait a couple of minutes. >>> > >>> > Orca runs, and it seems to be working as well as it ever worked. It >>> > can't read help, which would seem to be the first thing a new user >>> > would want to do, but OpenOffice does work, so I presume it is happy >>> > with my hardware. >>> > >>> > I run brltty by quitting orca, running gnome-terminal, typing sudo su >>> > and on the next command line typing "brltty -bauto -d/dev/ttyUSB0". >>> > >>> > Brltty runs, but says the screen is not in text mode. Ok, guess even >>> > in a terminal, we aren't in text mode. >>> > >>> > It would be nice if this was better documented; the need to run >>> > brltty for Braille support, even though Braille support is already >>> > checked in the Orca preferences, the fact that even in gnome-terminal >>> > the screen is presumably not text-based, and the fact that help isn't >>> > working. I can add to the wiki of course. but would beginners know to >>> > look there? What about a readme on the CD, which auto-starts in >>> > Windows with a screen that's basically advertising for Ubuntu with no >>> > real information. Or maybe just a how-to page on the Ubuntu site that >>> > covers all this. I am eager to improve the docs, but I have to get it >>> > running first and know what I'm doing. >>> > >>> > Another disappointment: this is still brltty 3.72. The Orca wiki >>> > states that it's better to use 3.8 because it can be compiled with the >>> > python bindings -- so why is an older, less effective version on this >>> > new live CD? >>> > >>> > I run Orca again and now it is communicating with brltty. Python >>> > bindings or not, it seems to show everything in Braille just fine. >>> > >>> > On my Windows PC, I search the internet for information about >>> > installing Gutsy using Orca. Lots of info about conflicts with >>> > different versions of portaudio, forum postings about how cool it is >>> > that Ubuntu is accessible, but no definitive tutorial or how-to on >>> > installing. A few days ago, I found lots more information on fixing >>> > MythTV problems. It's disappointing that there is so little >>> > information as I do believe strongly in RTFM. >>> > >>> > I've already tried the Install icon from the desktop with my husband >>> > reading the screen. He confirms that the install runs, but Orca can >>> > only echo keystrokes, it reads nothing in the install dialogs. >>> > >>> > I locate instructions on installing Feisty with Orca, the same wiki >>> > page I've myself contributed to. I follow those instructions, running >>> > gnome-terminal, typing sudo su, quitting orca, then running orca again >>> > with orca --disable-setup --disable main-window. I next type ubiquity, >>> > and the install runs, but still, Orca can't read any of it. Not even >>> > in flat review does it see anything. >>> > >>> > Between these tests I've done alt-ctrl-backspace to kill the X >>> > session, and brltty remains active, informing me that default boot >>> > scripts are being run. Each time Orca does automatically load and work >>> > with Braille. It crashes once, but I get it back easily, and the >>> > system seems generally stable. >>> > >>> > At one point, I try running gparted as root, and though ps confirms >>> > that gparted is running, Orca can't read its screen either. Is orca >>> > only really able to let me access just a few "productivity" apps? I >>> > saw that Sun at CSUN had done a session on MythTV with Orca last year, >>> > so I'd expected Orca to work with a wide variety of software. >>> > >>> > I've tried this on several PCS and I can't figure out if Orca is >>> > really this undeveloped or I'm doing something wrong. >>> > >>> > I've looked on the wiki at what I presume are the latest release >>> > notes; they discuss details like the spell-checker working better in >>> > OpenOffice, Firefox 2 vs 3 and the bugginess of acroread. I'm >>> > grateful that so much hard work has gone in to working with the >>> > Firefox developers and scripting applications like Gaim, But I now >>> > just want to read the install dialogs. >>> > >>> > In theory, since X is client-server based, since all information is >>> > openly available, and because a whole ton of people are working hard >>> > on this project, Orca should be miles ahead of Windows screen readers >>> > like JAWS. I'm disappointed; I really want to ditch Windows, but how >>> > can I if access is this flaky still? >>> > >>> > --Debee >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> >>> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> > >>> > >>> > -- >>> > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list >>> > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com >>> > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility >>> > >> From kb8aey at verizon.net Wed Oct 24 21:32:13 2007 From: kb8aey at verizon.net (mike coulombe) Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 16:32:13 -0500 (CDT) Subject: questions about the alternative cd Message-ID: <0JQF00I1LQHMJL34@vms048.mailsrvcs.net> Hi, I am going to try to use the alternative CD to install ubuntu on a computer the live CD doesn't boot on. I have two questions. Does the latest alternative CD offer software speech. If not, has anyone installed from this CD. If so, when I get sighted help what option should we choose. I don't know what the menu options are on the alternative CD. Thanks Mike.. From themuso at themuso.com Wed Oct 24 23:16:17 2007 From: themuso at themuso.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 09:16:17 +1000 Subject: questions about the alternative cd In-Reply-To: <0JQF00I1LQHMJL34@vms048.mailsrvcs.net> References: <0JQF00I1LQHMJL34@vms048.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <20071024231617.GA2125@themuso.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Thu, Oct 25, 2007 at 07:32:13AM EST, mike coulombe wrote: > Hi, I am going to try to use the alternative CD to install ubuntu on a computer the live CD > doesn't boot on. I have two questions. Does the latest alternative CD offer software speech. No, the alternate CD does not offer software speech, as there is no usable screen reader that can read the text console. > If not, has anyone installed from this CD. If so, when I get sighted help what option should > we choose. I don't know what the menu options are on the alternative CD. Thanks Mike.. The questions you will be asked are similar to those in the GUI installer, although the interface is quite different, and things like the partitioning stage will likely be completely different to what the GUI installer presents. - -- Luke Yelavich GPG key: 0xD06320CE (http://www.themuso.com/themuso-gpg-key.txt) Email & MSN: themuso at themuso.com Jabber: themuso at jabber.org.au -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFHH9JBjVefwtBjIM4RAkxpAKC0/rkWdXsRiHQxrFz7718kmXTDBwCbB1k2 VnMk61Sj5ziNqhx9wxw+8vs= =ip2S -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From rkcole72984 at gmail.com Thu Oct 25 05:40:54 2007 From: rkcole72984 at gmail.com (Robert Cole) Date: Wed, 24 Oct 2007 22:40:54 -0700 Subject: Ubuntu Accessibility, only as good as your testing and feedback. In-Reply-To: <471F1C3D.2060003@candt.waitrose.com> References: <20071024011651.GB8990@themuso.com> <471F1C3D.2060003@candt.waitrose.com> Message-ID: <47202C66.1020102@gmail.com> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jaworek at szs.uni-karlsruhe.de Thu Oct 25 12:42:53 2007 From: jaworek at szs.uni-karlsruhe.de (Gerhard Jaworek) Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 14:42:53 +0200 Subject: Problem with the connection of a Braillestar 40 via USB In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20071025124253.GB5780@szs.uni-karlsruhe.de> Dear Members, I know about the problem whith the USB-Serial-converter in the Bs40. Can anybody tel me in which files I have to change things and which things have to be changed? Thank you vermy much. Greetings Gerhard. -- ======================================- Dipl. Inform.: Gerhard Jaworek wissenschaftlicher Mitarbeiter Studienzentrum fuer Sehgeschaedigte Universitaet Karlsruhe Engesserstr. 4 76128 Karlsruhe Deutschland Tel: +49 (0)721 608 4301 ======================================== From themuso at themuso.com Thu Oct 25 12:52:27 2007 From: themuso at themuso.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Thu, 25 Oct 2007 22:52:27 +1000 Subject: Problem with the connection of a Braillestar 40 via USB In-Reply-To: <20071025124253.GB5780@szs.uni-karlsruhe.de> References: <20071025124253.GB5780@szs.uni-karlsruhe.de> Message-ID: <20071025125226.GA21739@themuso.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Thu, Oct 25, 2007 at 10:42:53PM EST, Gerhard Jaworek wrote: > I know about the problem whith the USB-Serial-converter in the Bs40. > Can anybody tel me in which files I have to change things and which things > have to be changed? Could you please explain what this problem is? I may be in a better position to help you once I have a better idea of what you are trying to work around. Thanks. - -- Luke Yelavich GPG key: 0xD06320CE (http://www.themuso.com/themuso-gpg-key.txt) Email & MSN: themuso at themuso.com Jabber: themuso at jabber.org.au -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFHIJGKjVefwtBjIM4RAn7cAKClAav0G7sxveKj8IA8w69EjRsxyACgz9B3 RhmngmNUpPUGd7KKaQQ9NFM= =HlVL -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From William.Walker at Sun.COM Fri Oct 26 16:27:39 2007 From: William.Walker at Sun.COM (Willie Walker) Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2007 12:27:39 -0400 Subject: can orca be set different for each ap In-Reply-To: <0JQ200MMEW41SKU6@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> References: <0JQ200MMEW41SKU6@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <4722157B.6020500@sun.com> Hi Mike: Currently, I don't believe Orca supports this. But, there is a related enhancement request to do so: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=373078 Will mike coulombe wrote: > Hi, can the preferences for orca like rate be set different for each ap. For example a slower rate in openoffice. > I didn't see anything in the settings regarding this, but I remember someone mentioned this several months ago. > Mike. > From labrad0r at edpnet.be Fri Oct 26 17:06:30 2007 From: labrad0r at edpnet.be (Labrador) Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2007 19:06:30 +0200 Subject: problem with orca+magnifier under Gutsy Message-ID: <20071026170630.GF3562@starfish> Hi, I saw wednsday a demo of the latest Ubuntu Gutsy distro. Some blind person in the room asked to demonstrate the Accessibility part, and the guy did it; but just like at home where my wife uses Feisty it was impossible to stop the magnifyer with ALT+F4 or so, so the demonstrator had to restart Gnome: is this a hidden feature ? or is this a bug ? and so, if yes, it would be very nice to fix this or to resolve this problem in a simple and intuitive way (why not using ALT+F4) to close magnification. Anyway the problem was still present while already present under Feisty, the previous Ubuntu. Labrad0r From William.Walker at Sun.COM Fri Oct 26 18:42:56 2007 From: William.Walker at Sun.COM (Willie Walker) Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2007 14:42:56 -0400 Subject: problem with orca+magnifier under Gutsy In-Reply-To: <20071026170630.GF3562@starfish> References: <20071026170630.GF3562@starfish> Message-ID: <47223530.20205@sun.com> Hi: Alt+F4 means to close/kill the currently focused window. The magnifier really isn't a window that gets focus, so pressing Alt+F4 will kill the window that has focus (e.g., your e-mail application, like I just did when I couldn't remember what Alt+F4 did). Killing the magnifier is similar to killing speech: you need to exit Orca or tell Orca to stop magnifying the window. Will Labrador wrote: > Hi, > > I saw wednsday a demo of the latest Ubuntu Gutsy distro. > Some blind person in the room asked to demonstrate the Accessibility part, > and the guy did it; > > but just like at home where my wife uses Feisty it was impossible to stop > the magnifyer with ALT+F4 or so, > > so the demonstrator had to restart Gnome: > > is this a hidden feature ? or is this a bug ? and so, if yes, it would be > very nice to fix this or to resolve this problem in a simple and intuitive > way (why not using ALT+F4) to close magnification. > Anyway the problem was still present while already present under Feisty, the > previous Ubuntu. > > Labrad0r > > > From yellow.penguin at edpnet.be Fri Oct 26 19:24:42 2007 From: yellow.penguin at edpnet.be (YP) Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2007 21:24:42 +0200 Subject: problem with orca+magnifier under Gutsy In-Reply-To: <47223530.20205@sun.com> References: <20071026170630.GF3562@starfish> <47223530.20205@sun.com> Message-ID: <20071026192442.GC3745@starfish> On Fri, Oct 26, 2007 at 02:42:56PM -0400, Willie Walker wrote: > Hi: > > Alt+F4 means to close/kill the currently focused window. The magnifier > really isn't a window that gets focus, so pressing Alt+F4 will kill the > window that has focus (e.g., your e-mail application, like I just did > when I couldn't remember what Alt+F4 did). > > Killing the magnifier is similar to killing speech: you need to exit > Orca or tell Orca to stop magnifying the window. The problem is that sighted persons who sometimes totally ignore anything about magnifying+orca so when demonstrating it, they simply get into panic and they had to restart gnome brutally with ctrl+alt+backspace. I'm ignoring myself how to stop the magnifier/orca, so my wife also did that error and she wasn't able to stop it, except by opening a console and doing a sudo reboot Isn't there any simple way of resolving this problem so that people doesn't have to search for how to stop the thing after they just demonstrate it with good intensions of course ? Does you see the stop or exit button or something like that when the magnifier is active ? Y P From William.Walker at Sun.COM Fri Oct 26 19:35:00 2007 From: William.Walker at Sun.COM (Willie Walker) Date: Fri, 26 Oct 2007 15:35:00 -0400 Subject: problem with orca+magnifier under Gutsy In-Reply-To: <20071026192442.GC3745@starfish> References: <20071026170630.GF3562@starfish> <47223530.20205@sun.com> <20071026192442.GC3745@starfish> Message-ID: <47224164.9060802@sun.com> Hi: > The problem is that sighted persons who sometimes totally ignore anything > about magnifying+orca so when demonstrating it, they simply get into panic > and they had to restart gnome brutally with ctrl+alt+backspace. The demographic this request is catering to is a small percentage of users: the ignorant demoer with good intentions. I'll admit we should try to make things nicer for them, though. I think I need to better understand how the user got into this situation. How did the person enable magnification? What button did they press or checkbox did they check or command did they run? > Does you see the stop or exit button or something like that when the > magnifier is active ? Well....Alt+F4 is out of the question. That's for killing windows with focus. I suppose we could make up a new command, but we already have one -- Insert+Space to bring up the Orca Preferences dialog. If the user knows that, they already know a bit about Orca, though. The Orca main window typically appears by default and the user usually has to go out of their way to disable it. So, I guess I need to know more about what the user did to start Orca+magnifier and what, if any, windows appears on the desktop. Will From kb8aey at verizon.net Sun Oct 28 04:10:16 2007 From: kb8aey at verizon.net (mike coulombe) Date: Sat, 27 Oct 2007 23:10:16 -0500 (CDT) Subject: a question about installing programs Message-ID: <0JQL003CNSX3OXG4@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> Hi, I installed ubuntu using the alternative CD, and everything worked fine. The problem I am having is when using the add remove programs. It always asks for the CD that I installed ubuntu from. Has anyone else had this problem. If so what do I have to install to correct this. Thanks Mike. X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 071027-0, 10/27/2007), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean From aeclist at candt.waitrose.com Sun Oct 28 11:28:55 2007 From: aeclist at candt.waitrose.com (alan c) Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 11:28:55 +0000 Subject: a question about installing programs In-Reply-To: <0JQL003CNSX3OXG4@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> References: <0JQL003CNSX3OXG4@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <47247277.8030104@candt.waitrose.com> mike coulombe wrote: > Hi, I installed ubuntu using the alternative CD, and everything worked fine. > The problem I am having is when using the add remove programs. It always asks for the CD that I installed ubuntu from. > Has anyone else had this problem. If so what do I have to install to correct this. I noticed this too. It did seem to make use of the CD on those occasions, although I do not know why. However I only wanted internet use when installing further stuff. I saw the CD was an entry in the menu item System>software sources (iirc) and removed (or disabled ?) it. -- alan cocks Kubuntu user#10391 From kenny at hittsjunk.net Sun Oct 28 11:52:27 2007 From: kenny at hittsjunk.net (Kenny Hitt) Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 06:52:27 -0500 Subject: a question about installing programs In-Reply-To: <0JQL003CNSX3OXG4@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> References: <0JQL003CNSX3OXG4@vms042.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <20071028115226.GA3796@hittsjunk.net> Hi. Edit /etc/apt/sources.list and comment out the entry for the CD. Leave the entries for internet sources uncommented and it should work. Kenny On Sat, Oct 27, 2007 at 11:10:16PM -0500, mike coulombe wrote: > Hi, I installed ubuntu using the alternative CD, and everything worked fine. > The problem I am having is when using the add remove programs. It always asks for the CD that I installed ubuntu from. > Has anyone else had this problem. If so what do I have to install to correct this. > Thanks Mike. > X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 071027-0, 10/27/2007), Outbound message > X-Antivirus-Status: Clean > > > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility From kb8aey at verizon.net Sun Oct 28 23:02:34 2007 From: kb8aey at verizon.net (mike coulombe) Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 18:02:34 -0500 (CDT) Subject: need a little help with wireless networking Message-ID: <0JQN00A719CATF2O@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> Hi, I got a wireless card that seems to work with ubuntu. My question is what utility do I install to make use of it. I see it in the network settings, but there doesn't appear to be a place to enter the username and password. Is there a utility that works with orca for doing this. Thanks Mike. X-Antivirus: avast! (VPS 071028-0, 10/28/2007), Outbound message X-Antivirus-Status: Clean From themuso at themuso.com Mon Oct 29 03:20:40 2007 From: themuso at themuso.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Sun, 28 Oct 2007 23:20:40 -0400 Subject: need a little help with wireless networking In-Reply-To: <0JQN00A719CATF2O@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> References: <0JQN00A719CATF2O@vms044.mailsrvcs.net> Message-ID: <20071029032040.GB24567@marlon.yelavich.home> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Sun, Oct 28, 2007 at 07:02:34PM EDT, mike coulombe wrote: > Hi, I got a wireless card that seems to work with ubuntu. > My question is what utility do I install to make use of it. > I see it in the network settings, but there doesn't appear to be a place to enter the username and password. > Is there a utility that works with orca for doing this. This is not a place to ask general support questions. Such questions should be asked on the Ubuntu forums, or on the ubuntu user's mailing list. As to working with wireless, at this point, network manager is not entirely accessible, so it may be better to work with the wireless devices from the command-line and using /etc/network/interfaces. I hope to contact upstream to see about getting network manager more accessible for use with orca. - -- Luke Yelavich GPG key: 0xD06320CE (http://www.themuso.com/themuso-gpg-key.txt) Email & MSN: themuso at themuso.com Jabber: themuso at jabber.org.au -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFHJVGIjVefwtBjIM4RAuG0AJ4zpGNq+YsYPSSX+lEnFYKTwPNcLgCfZ/vE jhtOsm8LKJ7pRrpipqhXt2Y= =gnk+ -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From lists at janc.be Tue Oct 30 17:22:43 2007 From: lists at janc.be (Jan Claeys) Date: Tue, 30 Oct 2007 18:22:43 +0100 Subject: problem with orca+magnifier under Gutsy In-Reply-To: <47224164.9060802@sun.com> References: <20071026170630.GF3562@starfish> <47223530.20205@sun.com> <20071026192442.GC3745@starfish> <47224164.9060802@sun.com> Message-ID: <1193764963.16840.20.camel@saeko> Op vrijdag 26-10-2007 om 15:35 uur [tijdzone -0400], schreef Willie Walker: > I think I need to better understand how the user got into this > situation. How did the person enable magnification? What button did > they press or checkbox did they check or command did they run? Through the GNOME menus in Ubuntu, somewhere under: System --> Preferences --> Accessibility --> ... (I'm not sure what the last submenu is named in English exactly, as my locale is in Dutch, but I could find out if needed...) -- Jan Claeys From me at saurocesaretti.com Wed Oct 31 13:07:46 2007 From: me at saurocesaretti.com (Sauro Cesaretti) Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 14:07:46 +0100 Subject: Updating orca and brltty in ubuntu gutsy Message-ID: <000901c81bbf$084d0d30$2101a8c0@sauro> Hi everyone, I've just installed ubuntu 7.10 yesterday and I saw that it is still using brltty 3.7. And orca is not updated as well. I tried to install brltty from the source when gutsy was still in beta and it seems that the driver didn't work. Could I update these software from the source? Have you tried to do that? Should I follow a particular procedure? thank you in advance best regards, Sauro From themuso at themuso.com Wed Oct 31 16:17:25 2007 From: themuso at themuso.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Wed, 31 Oct 2007 12:17:25 -0400 Subject: Ttsynth/Ibmtts will no longer work, as of Ubuntu hardy 8.04. Message-ID: <20071031161612.GA9780@marlon> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Greetings all. I am writing to inform you all, that as of Ubuntu Hardy 8.04, to be released in April next year, the Ttsynth/Ibmtts speech synthesizer will no longer work, due to a library that it depends on, having been removed from the Ubuntu archives. This library was a left over piece from the gcc 2.95 and glibc 2.2 toolchain, that was kept in ubuntu for compatibility reasons. It is actually a wonder that it has stayed around this long. I appreciate the fact that there are many of you out there that use this synth daily, however this decision was out of my hands, and it is a matter for the vendors to sort out. I would encourage users of this synth to contact the vendor from which you purchased your license, to ask them for a proper resolution to this issue. The library that ttsynth/ibmtts currently depends on is libstdc++2.10-glibc2.2, which is the library that was removed from Ubuntu hardy. Thanks in advance for your understanding. - - -- Luke Yelavich GPG key: 0xD06320CE (http://www.themuso.com/themuso-gpg-key.txt) Email & MSN: themuso at themuso.com Jabber: themuso at jabber.org.au -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFHKKqVjVefwtBjIM4RAhE2AKDZxTqkYGsTuzqu3Zl8S6LVhT/6jwCeNpLg nc9iJOq7TGq9s15OUt/Naz4= =BhYP -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----