From samuel.thibault at ens-lyon.org Thu Mar 1 01:27:44 2012 From: samuel.thibault at ens-lyon.org (Samuel Thibault) Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2012 02:27:44 +0100 Subject: Health & Accessibility topic of LSM 2012 Message-ID: <20120301012744.GE13483@type.famille.thibault.fr> LSM/RMLL 2012                  13th Libre Software Meeting                       July 7-12, 2012                      Geneva, SWITZERLAND                    http://2012.rmll.info/               Call For Papers and Participation            limited on health & accessibility topic      [we apologize for duplicate receipt of this message]          Last call before deadline : march *31* 2012 Dear Colleague, The 13th Libre Software Meeting (LSM) takes place in Geneva, Switzerland, July 7-12 2012 (http://2012.rmll.info/). LSM is an annual non-commercial conference on Libre Softwares that includes round tables and practical workshops. The objective is to provide a place where users, developers and promoters of Libre Software can exchange ideas and information. Attendance is free and open to everyone.  Each year the health & accessibility workshop is held as part of this broader meeting. This year, it will be organized around 3 major fields: - Accessibility, autonomy and dependency management (mobile/web accessibility, accessible desktop applications, usability, ...) - Hospital information system & Tele-health (EHR, telemedicine systems, workflow solutions, PACS, HL7, ...) - Imaging & visualization of medical data (CAS, CAD, bio-imaging, image acquisition/processing/segmentation/registration, simulation, organ tracking ...) We invite presentations that address these major fields. The LSM committee aims to disseminate and improve Libre projects in the health and accessibility domains through this workshop. To better target the various exchanges that will be taking place, the programme committee of the health & accessibility workshop proposes several kinds of meetings: - "Solution" meetings, with conferences  and round tables to present solutions dedicated to previous areas. - "State of the art" conferences between practitioners, developers, scientists and users to discuss about what exists according to the specific needs of users, what works well or a little less well, to talk about approaches... - "Technical" presentations between developers and scientists. This will allow initiation of exchanges between communities that do not necessarily have the opportunity to meet and will maybe lead to new collaborations or projects. Finally, a workshop area will be available to try out and exchange tools presented by their authors or by seasoned users of those solutions. Last year the health & accessibility workshop received (for example) the following projects: Chewing Word, drupal, FreeMedForms, GDCM, ITK, joomla kaekus, odt2braille, OpenStreetMap, OsiriX, typo3, ubuntu, VTK, WEASIS, wordpress, ... ... Information on health workshops from previous annual meetings are available on : - http://2011.rmll.info/-Sante-accessibilite-et-handicap-?lang=en You will be able to attend conferences  on other related issues such as "System Administration" (like Nagios, GLPI, Cfengine, ...), "Development" (like NoSQL, Lucene, GCC, ...), "Law" (like Licenses,OpenData, FSF, ...), "Internet" (WebGL, Jabber, Typo3, ...), ... All previous conferences are available on : - http://2011.rmll.info/-Programme-?lang=en This year, LSM will have also 3 transversal topics (thread) : • Cloud • Common goods • "Libre" economy If you are interested to participate, please submit your presentation at: http://call.rmll.info/talk/new Please feel free to share this information with others people who may be interested. We welcome your participation and input and look forward for a valuable meeting.  *IMPORTANT* *DATES*: - The deadline for submission is 31 March 2012.  - The list of accepted presentations will be announced 15 April, 2012. - Meeting: July 7-12, 2012. *ABSTRACT* *SUBMISSION*: - The call for papers is available here:  EN : http://2012.rmll.info/participer/call-for-papers  DE : http://2012.rmll.info/participer/call-for-papers-deutsch  FR : http://2012.rmll.info/participer/appel-a-conferences - And you can answer on :  http://call.rmll.info/  (Note, you can submit in *english* or *french*) Best regards, Programme Commitee of the LSM 2012 health/accessibility topic From pstowe at gmail.com Sat Mar 3 15:22:39 2012 From: pstowe at gmail.com (Penelope Stowe) Date: Sat, 3 Mar 2012 10:22:39 -0500 Subject: Global Bug Jam This Weekend Message-ID: Hiya, This weekend is Ubuntu's Global Bug Jam. Although we aren't doing an in-person jam, Alan Bell, myself, and others are working in #ubuntu-accessibility[0]. Currently we're trying to finish the last personas[1]. If we get those done before the end of the weekend, we will move onto other things. Anyone and everyone is welcome to join us! While I can't promise help to people doing code bug fixes or testing as that's not where I have expertise, if you want to just hang out with us while doing things other than the personas, that's great too! I hope to see some of you in the channel. ~Penelope [0] http://webchat.freenode.net/?channels=ubuntu-accessibility [1] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Accessibility/Personas -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From vilmar at informal.com.br Sat Mar 3 15:36:23 2012 From: vilmar at informal.com.br (=?UTF-8?B?Sm9zw6kgVmlsbWFyIEVzdMOhY2lvIGRlIFNvdXph?=) Date: Sat, 03 Mar 2012 12:36:23 -0300 Subject: with menus in 12.04 Message-ID: <4F523A77.3000901@informal.com.br> Hi all. I installed 12.04 beta in a virtual machine and I am facing some problems regarding the menu bar. The problem is that I am not able to activate the menu bar pressing the f10key. Am I doing something wrong? Thanks. From christopherh40 at gmail.com Sat Mar 3 17:19:47 2012 From: christopherh40 at gmail.com (chris hallsworth) Date: Sat, 03 Mar 2012 17:19:47 +0000 Subject: No sound in 12.04 Beta Message-ID: <4F5252B3.8020801@gmail.com> Hello all. I wish to report the lack of sound in Ubuntu 12.04 Beta. I installed it via Wubi last night our time. Everything seems to work except the sound. For a blind person who relies on the use of Orca, I feel this should be addressed as a matter of urgency. Previous versions of Ubuntu I could get sound. My laptop is an Acer Aspire 5735 and the sound chip is the Intel HD Audio onboard, sometimes called High Definition Audio. -- Christopher H From chaltain at gmail.com Sat Mar 3 18:52:19 2012 From: chaltain at gmail.com (Christopher Chaltain) Date: Sat, 03 Mar 2012 12:52:19 -0600 Subject: No sound in 12.04 Beta In-Reply-To: <4F5252B3.8020801@gmail.com> References: <4F5252B3.8020801@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4F526863.9080008@gmail.com> When you say you had sound with previous versions of Ubuntu, were you talking about this same laptop? If this is the first time you've installed Ubuntu on this lapttop, do you know if the lapttop and the sound chip are supported by Ubuntu? What previous versions of Ubuntu are you talking about, 11.10, 11.04, 12.04 Alpha 1, ...? When you say you have no sound, could it be that the sound is muted or the volume is turned down low? Have you tried using your systems media buttons to raise or unmute the volume? BTW, I've opened a bug for the situation where the volume is turned down so low that you can't hear it when booting the live CD or the first reboot after an install. That bug is: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/alsa-driver/+bug/927459 On 03/03/12 11:19, chris hallsworth wrote: > Hello all. > I wish to report the lack of sound in Ubuntu 12.04 Beta. I installed it > via Wubi last night our time. Everything seems to work except the sound. > For a blind person who relies on the use of Orca, I feel this should be > addressed as a matter of urgency. Previous versions of Ubuntu I could > get sound. My laptop is an Acer Aspire 5735 and the sound chip is the > Intel HD Audio onboard, sometimes called High Definition Audio. -- Christopher (CJ) chaltain at gmail.com From petra at access-for-all.ch Sun Mar 4 08:05:21 2012 From: petra at access-for-all.ch (Petra Ritter) Date: Sun, 04 Mar 2012 09:05:21 +0100 Subject: No sound in 12.04 Beta In-Reply-To: <4F5252B3.8020801@gmail.com> References: <4F5252B3.8020801@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4F532241.8010104@access-for-all.ch> Hello Chris, Am 03.03.2012 18:19, schrieb chris hallsworth: > Hello all. > I wish to report the lack of sound in Ubuntu 12.04 Beta. I installed it > via Wubi last night our time. Everything seems to work except the sound. > For a blind person who relies on the use of Orca, I feel this should be > addressed as a matter of urgency. Previous versions of Ubuntu I could > get sound. My laptop is an Acer Aspire 5735 and the sound chip is the > Intel HD Audio onboard, sometimes called High Definition Audio. I have Ubuntu 12.04 Beta installed in Virtualbox 4.1.8. The sound Chip iis an ICH AC97 witch is baypassed from me Windows 7 Host-System. I had no problem with the sound hawever I have got a notebook Acer Aspiere 7750Z, too. I will tray the Beta Version as a live-CD on this system. Maybe it depents on the sound chip wether the problem occurs. Petra From ka1cey at gmail.com Sun Mar 4 23:52:59 2012 From: ka1cey at gmail.com (Dave Hunt) Date: Sun, 04 Mar 2012 18:52:59 -0500 Subject: Accessible Login in 12.04? Message-ID: <4F54005B.3010209@gmail.com> Hi, Does the 12.04 Beta 1 have an accessible login greeter? When last I used 11.10, lightdm was not accessible with orca. Cheers, Dave_H From chaltain at gmail.com Mon Mar 5 00:48:54 2012 From: chaltain at gmail.com (Christopher Chaltain) Date: Sun, 04 Mar 2012 18:48:54 -0600 Subject: Accessible Login in 12.04? In-Reply-To: <4F54005B.3010209@gmail.com> References: <4F54005B.3010209@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4F540D76.3080803@gmail.com> I haven't brought up 12.04 in a little bit, but the last time I tried Alpha 2, lightdm still wasn't accessible. I haven't taken a look at Beta 1 yet. BTW, because of this, I mostly just use auto log on now, although I know that doesn't answer your question. On 04/03/12 17:52, Dave Hunt wrote: > Hi, > > Does the 12.04 Beta 1 have an accessible login greeter? When last I > used 11.10, lightdm was not accessible with orca. > > > Cheers, > > > Dave_H -- Christopher (CJ) chaltain at gmail.com From vilmar at informal.com.br Mon Mar 5 01:01:50 2012 From: vilmar at informal.com.br (=?UTF-8?B?Sm9zw6kgVmlsbWFyIEVzdMOhY2lvIGRlIFNvdXph?=) Date: Sun, 04 Mar 2012 22:01:50 -0300 Subject: Accessible Login in 12.04? In-Reply-To: <4F540D76.3080803@gmail.com> References: <4F54005B.3010209@gmail.com> <4F540D76.3080803@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4F54107E.1080709@informal.com.br> Hi. I installed beta 1 yesterday and orca doesn't speak in the login. On 03/04/2012 09:48 PM, Christopher Chaltain wrote: > I haven't brought up 12.04 in a little bit, but the last time I tried > Alpha 2, lightdm still wasn't accessible. I haven't taken a look at Beta > 1 yet. BTW, because of this, I mostly just use auto log on now, although > I know that doesn't answer your question. > > On 04/03/12 17:52, Dave Hunt wrote: >> Hi, >> >> Does the 12.04 Beta 1 have an accessible login greeter? When last I >> used 11.10, lightdm was not accessible with orca. >> >> >> Cheers, >> >> >> Dave_H > From hammera at pickup.hu Mon Mar 5 06:42:21 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2012 07:42:21 +0100 Subject: First start general GNOME3 shortcuts doesn't work Message-ID: <4F54604D.2000007@pickup.hu> Hy, I see following issue since thursday or friday my Precise system, I using Precise with GNOME3 fallback session. I don't no why, but general shortcuts doesn't work. Typical examples are ALT+F1, ALT+F2, ALT+TAB, ALT+F4. Of course, this shortcuts are setted in GNOME Control Center Keyboard preference tool/keybindings page. Attila From dusek at brailcom.org Tue Mar 6 10:39:06 2012 From: dusek at brailcom.org (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Boris_Du=B9ek?=) Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2012 11:39:06 +0100 Subject: (In)Accessibility of Unity in current Precise Message-ID: Hello, my colleague is using current Precise with Orca and Unity 2D and is encountering the following problems: 1. In 2D, if you open the menu using Alt+letter (e.g. Alt+S for "&Soubor" in Czech, could be Alt+F for "&File" in English), it does not announce menu item names when navigating left/right and up/down. 2. In 3D, neither Dash (Alt+F2) nor Launcher (Alt+F1) are accessible (you can navigate them, but no speech) Luke mentioned for some of these problems that "patch exists" or is even coming some time ago (approx. half of February), but the problems above still persist. Can I find some of those patches anywhere so that I can make a patched version of Unity? Or better, are those patches coming in some updated unity package for Precise? Thanks and best regards, Boris Dušek BRAILCOM,o.p.s. From nolan at thewordnerd.info Tue Mar 6 14:04:26 2012 From: nolan at thewordnerd.info (Nolan Darilek) Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2012 08:04:26 -0600 Subject: (In)Accessibility of Unity in current Precise In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4F56196A.2000605@thewordnerd.info> Ugh! We get to this point in every release, where there are patches for a whole bunch of issues that take forever to land. Meanwhile, testers can't examine the new release to see what new issues were revealed after the fixing of the old. So there's no accessibility *test* cycle, just a bunch of bugs that go away after it's too late to address the newly-revealed ones. Meanwhile, accessibility users aren't confident in the newer betas, as even the final release can contain major issues that block productive use. This isn't a slam on Luke, but on Canonical. If Canonical is pushing out Ubuntu for Android, surely they can put more accessibility people on the Ubuntu project, especially as it rolls out everywhere. It's going to be *more* important to have a highly accessible Ubuntu if it runs on my phone, tablet and TV. Canonical is in an awesome position to fix this once and have it run across the board, yet I only see Luke addressing patches and other volunteers occasionally popping in to remark on things. Seems I've asked this before, but whom do we have to ask to get Canonical to put more people on the accessibility team as they surely are doing so for mobile/TV development? Is there some process other than posting to this list again to better let our voices be heard? When folks patch these accessibility issues, those patches should land in a short timeframe. As of now I'm on 11.04 because 11.10 had accessibility issues I couldn't live with, and 12.04 is shaping up to be the same. Unfortunately, Firefox is moving on, and I'm experiencing focus stickage/accessibility hangs that aren't likely to be fixed because I'm on GNOME 2.32, and I can't see things getting better as Firefox rockets onward, either. If I don't get feedback on how to approach Canonical, I'll put up and promote a change.org petition before the week is out. We need to get more people helping Luke ASAP, especially as I for one don't want to get left behind when Ubuntu lands on Android. Canonical, please stop deprioritizing accessibility. 11.10 was a transitional release that was highly broken in many respects. Blind users at least can't wait until 12.10 for an Ubuntu with speaking menus, speaking notifications and access to content in Ubuntu's default mail client. On 03/06/2012 04:39 AM, Boris Dušek wrote: > Hello, > > my colleague is using current Precise with Orca and Unity 2D and is > encountering the following problems: > > 1. In 2D, if you open the menu using Alt+letter (e.g. Alt+S for "&Soubor" in Czech, > could be Alt+F for "&File" in English), it does not announce menu item names > when navigating left/right and up/down. > 2. In 3D, neither Dash (Alt+F2) nor Launcher (Alt+F1) are accessible (you can > navigate them, but no speech) > > Luke mentioned for some of these problems that "patch exists" or is even > coming some time ago (approx. half of February), but the problems above still persist. > > Can I find some of those patches anywhere so that I can make a patched version of Unity? > Or better, are those patches coming in some updated unity package for Precise? > > Thanks and best regards, > Boris Dušek > BRAILCOM,o.p.s. > > From alanbell at ubuntu.com Tue Mar 6 14:33:03 2012 From: alanbell at ubuntu.com (Alan Bell) Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2012 14:33:03 +0000 Subject: (In)Accessibility of Unity in current Precise In-Reply-To: <4F56196A.2000605@thewordnerd.info> References: <4F56196A.2000605@thewordnerd.info> Message-ID: <4F56201F.5040403@ubuntu.com> totally agree, and sharing this with the unity-design list so more people can see it. 12.04 had been pretty decent compared to other development cycles up to a few weeks ago, then it all went wrong. I am not happy about some of the stuff that landed this cycle with zero design consideration for accessibility. Stuff like the shortcuts overlay on long hold of the super key is quite literally broken by design. The HUD landed in 3d and now Unity2d with no functionality for screen reader users (silent in 3d all suggestions are "push button" in 2d), currently the global menu and indicators are almost entirely broken, probably due to the same thing that broke the menus. I know there have been improvements, tedg has done an improvement to the menus by applying role hints to stop everything being a checkbox menu item (caused by the global menu using a check box menu item for everything irrespective of whether it is semantically a checkbox item just because they *look* the same). Menus are currently silent except for reading out the hint (checkbox or radio button) and the shortcuts. I think some of the indicators were briefly not called "image", but right now they all appear to be called "window". I want to start doing some documentation and screencasts and filing of small bugs and fixing strings, but I can't do any polishing because it is all broken. I do know that Unity was supposed to not land broken this cycle, but I can't imagine that orca or onboard feature in the pre-landing test scripts. Are these scripts published? Alan. On 06/03/12 14:04, Nolan Darilek wrote: > Ugh! We get to this point in every release, where there are patches > for a whole bunch of issues that take forever to land. Meanwhile, > testers can't examine the new release to see what new issues were > revealed after the fixing of the old. So there's no accessibility > *test* cycle, just a bunch of bugs that go away after it's too late to > address the newly-revealed ones. Meanwhile, accessibility users aren't > confident in the newer betas, as even the final release can contain > major issues that block productive use. > > This isn't a slam on Luke, but on Canonical. If Canonical is pushing > out Ubuntu for Android, surely they can put more accessibility people > on the Ubuntu project, especially as it rolls out everywhere. It's > going to be *more* important to have a highly accessible Ubuntu if it > runs on my phone, tablet and TV. Canonical is in an awesome position > to fix this once and have it run across the board, yet I only see Luke > addressing patches and other volunteers occasionally popping in to > remark on things. > > Seems I've asked this before, but whom do we have to ask to get > Canonical to put more people on the accessibility team as they surely > are doing so for mobile/TV development? Is there some process other > than posting to this list again to better let our voices be heard? > When folks patch these accessibility issues, those patches should land > in a short timeframe. As of now I'm on 11.04 because 11.10 had > accessibility issues I couldn't live with, and 12.04 is shaping up to > be the same. Unfortunately, Firefox is moving on, and I'm experiencing > focus stickage/accessibility hangs that aren't likely to be fixed > because I'm on GNOME 2.32, and I can't see things getting better as > Firefox rockets onward, either. > > If I don't get feedback on how to approach Canonical, I'll put up and > promote a change.org petition before the week is out. We need to get > more people helping Luke ASAP, especially as I for one don't want to > get left behind when Ubuntu lands on Android. > > Canonical, please stop deprioritizing accessibility. 11.10 was a > transitional release that was highly broken in many respects. Blind > users at least can't wait until 12.10 for an Ubuntu with speaking > menus, speaking notifications and access to content in Ubuntu's > default mail client. > On 03/06/2012 04:39 AM, Boris Dušek wrote: >> Hello, >> >> my colleague is using current Precise with Orca and Unity 2D and is >> encountering the following problems: >> >> 1. In 2D, if you open the menu using Alt+letter (e.g. Alt+S for >> "&Soubor" in Czech, >> could be Alt+F for "&File" in English), it does not announce menu >> item names >> when navigating left/right and up/down. >> 2. In 3D, neither Dash (Alt+F2) nor Launcher (Alt+F1) are accessible >> (you can >> navigate them, but no speech) >> >> Luke mentioned for some of these problems that "patch exists" or is even >> coming some time ago (approx. half of February), but the problems >> above still persist. >> >> Can I find some of those patches anywhere so that I can make a >> patched version of Unity? >> Or better, are those patches coming in some updated unity package for >> Precise? >> >> Thanks and best regards, >> Boris Dušek >> BRAILCOM,o.p.s. >> >> > > -- The Open Learning Centre is rebranding, find out about our new name and look at http://libertus.co.uk From nolan at thewordnerd.info Tue Mar 6 14:47:13 2012 From: nolan at thewordnerd.info (Nolan Darilek) Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2012 08:47:13 -0600 Subject: (In)Accessibility of Unity in current Precise In-Reply-To: <4F56201F.5040403@ubuntu.com> References: <4F56196A.2000605@thewordnerd.info> <4F56201F.5040403@ubuntu.com> Message-ID: <4F562371.1000504@thewordnerd.info> Wait, you mean there's *this much breakage* in a *beta*? I thought that betas were supposed to be more stable than less, but what you've just described is a fucking accessibility nightmare. I don't use that sort of language lightly on public mailing lists, but it's absolutely infuriating how Linux for human beings is only for those humans fortunate enough to see. The rest of us can just go away. CCing the Unity list myself. It looks as if, should I choose to stay with Ubuntu, I will be stuck on 11.04 again unless some major fixes land in the 12.04 timeframe. This, of course, assumes that 12.10 won't be just as broken for accessibility as was 12.04 and 11.10 before it. I'm stuck on an ancient at-spi that is getting no accessibility fixes that I know of. New Firefox versions are breaking things that worked for years, and I doubt I'll see any fixes. At this point I'm very seriously switching back to OS X after years of Ubuntu use. Don't get me wrong, I love Linux and really don't like how Apple treats their developers and users. I feel, though, that I've been patient enough for Canonical to get it, and if free software can't meet my needs then proprietary already does. Also, wasn't 12.04 supposed to be an LTS release? Do blind and other disabled users not get the benefits of that? This email brought to you by my netbook upgrade, which I guess will be hosed. I was really hoping to discover that things more or less worked and I could upgrade my main machine, particularly as there's a Firefox accessibility hang that locks up my system so tight that nothing short of a full reboot can get things back. Restarting gdm isn't even sufficient anymore. In other words, 11.04 is no longer stable for me. Arrowing through webpages causes focus to stick, and my machine now hangs regularly. This is not a hardware issue, as I've seen these hangs in the a11y subsystem for years, but I can't upgrade to the newest at-spi and get any fixes for a problem that grows worse and worse. Even a less stable beta would be a relief if the other non-a11y issues were slated to be fixed before or shortly after release. On 03/06/2012 08:33 AM, Alan Bell wrote: > totally agree, and sharing this with the unity-design list so more > people can see it. 12.04 had been pretty decent compared to other > development cycles up to a few weeks ago, then it all went wrong. I am > not happy about some of the stuff that landed this cycle with zero > design consideration for accessibility. Stuff like the shortcuts > overlay on long hold of the super key is quite literally broken by > design. The HUD landed in 3d and now Unity2d with no functionality for > screen reader users (silent in 3d all suggestions are "push button" in > 2d), currently the global menu and indicators are almost entirely > broken, probably due to the same thing that broke the menus. I know > there have been improvements, tedg has done an improvement to the > menus by applying role hints to stop everything being a checkbox menu > item (caused by the global menu using a check box menu item for > everything irrespective of whether it is semantically a checkbox item > just because they *look* the same). Menus are currently silent except > for reading out the hint (checkbox or radio button) and the shortcuts. > I think some of the indicators were briefly not called "image", but > right now they all appear to be called "window". I want to start doing > some documentation and screencasts and filing of small bugs and fixing > strings, but I can't do any polishing because it is all broken. I do > know that Unity was supposed to not land broken this cycle, but I > can't imagine that orca or onboard feature in the pre-landing test > scripts. Are these scripts published? > > Alan. > > On 06/03/12 14:04, Nolan Darilek wrote: >> Ugh! We get to this point in every release, where there are patches >> for a whole bunch of issues that take forever to land. Meanwhile, >> testers can't examine the new release to see what new issues were >> revealed after the fixing of the old. So there's no accessibility >> *test* cycle, just a bunch of bugs that go away after it's too late >> to address the newly-revealed ones. Meanwhile, accessibility users >> aren't confident in the newer betas, as even the final release can >> contain major issues that block productive use. >> >> This isn't a slam on Luke, but on Canonical. If Canonical is pushing >> out Ubuntu for Android, surely they can put more accessibility people >> on the Ubuntu project, especially as it rolls out everywhere. It's >> going to be *more* important to have a highly accessible Ubuntu if it >> runs on my phone, tablet and TV. Canonical is in an awesome position >> to fix this once and have it run across the board, yet I only see >> Luke addressing patches and other volunteers occasionally popping in >> to remark on things. >> >> Seems I've asked this before, but whom do we have to ask to get >> Canonical to put more people on the accessibility team as they surely >> are doing so for mobile/TV development? Is there some process other >> than posting to this list again to better let our voices be heard? >> When folks patch these accessibility issues, those patches should >> land in a short timeframe. As of now I'm on 11.04 because 11.10 had >> accessibility issues I couldn't live with, and 12.04 is shaping up to >> be the same. Unfortunately, Firefox is moving on, and I'm >> experiencing focus stickage/accessibility hangs that aren't likely to >> be fixed because I'm on GNOME 2.32, and I can't see things getting >> better as Firefox rockets onward, either. >> >> If I don't get feedback on how to approach Canonical, I'll put up and >> promote a change.org petition before the week is out. We need to get >> more people helping Luke ASAP, especially as I for one don't want to >> get left behind when Ubuntu lands on Android. >> >> Canonical, please stop deprioritizing accessibility. 11.10 was a >> transitional release that was highly broken in many respects. Blind >> users at least can't wait until 12.10 for an Ubuntu with speaking >> menus, speaking notifications and access to content in Ubuntu's >> default mail client. >> On 03/06/2012 04:39 AM, Boris Dušek wrote: >>> Hello, >>> >>> my colleague is using current Precise with Orca and Unity 2D and is >>> encountering the following problems: >>> >>> 1. In 2D, if you open the menu using Alt+letter (e.g. Alt+S for >>> "&Soubor" in Czech, >>> could be Alt+F for "&File" in English), it does not announce >>> menu item names >>> when navigating left/right and up/down. >>> 2. In 3D, neither Dash (Alt+F2) nor Launcher (Alt+F1) are accessible >>> (you can >>> navigate them, but no speech) >>> >>> Luke mentioned for some of these problems that "patch exists" or is >>> even >>> coming some time ago (approx. half of February), but the problems >>> above still persist. >>> >>> Can I find some of those patches anywhere so that I can make a >>> patched version of Unity? >>> Or better, are those patches coming in some updated unity package >>> for Precise? >>> >>> Thanks and best regards, >>> Boris Dušek >>> BRAILCOM,o.p.s. >>> >>> >> >> > > From alanbell at ubuntu.com Tue Mar 6 15:18:13 2012 From: alanbell at ubuntu.com (Alan Bell) Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2012 15:18:13 +0000 Subject: (In)Accessibility of Unity in current Precise In-Reply-To: <4F562371.1000504@thewordnerd.info> References: <4F56196A.2000605@thewordnerd.info> <4F56201F.5040403@ubuntu.com> <4F562371.1000504@thewordnerd.info> Message-ID: <4F562AB5.2010908@ubuntu.com> On 06/03/12 14:47, Nolan Darilek wrote: > Wait, you mean there's *this much breakage* in a *beta*? yes. There are expected to be broken things in a beta, but I do agree that if the with-eyes experience was as bad as it is eyes-free right now then it probably wouldn't go out of the door. On the plus side I do believe that the fixes are really quite small, and then I expect it will be quite good in comparison to older releases. What concerns me the most is that things are not being tested until too late. *Designs* are not tested for accessibility. The design team should be doing accessibility testing before anyone writes any code. It should be known roughly what script an orca user would hear when going through the dash or the hud or the menus etc. before they get coded up. This is massively easier to do than drawing pictures for the visual design (it is just text) and would probably help the design and implementation process much more than it would be any kind of overhead. > I don't use that sort of language lightly on public mailing lists, yeah, best not to. It doesn't really make your point any stronger and then people end up focussing on that and not the broken software that needs fixing. Alan -- The Open Learning Centre is rebranding, find out about our new name and look at http://libertus.co.uk From nolan at thewordnerd.info Tue Mar 6 15:27:54 2012 From: nolan at thewordnerd.info (Nolan Darilek) Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2012 09:27:54 -0600 Subject: (In)Accessibility of Unity in current Precise In-Reply-To: <4F562AB5.2010908@ubuntu.com> References: <4F56196A.2000605@thewordnerd.info> <4F56201F.5040403@ubuntu.com> <4F562371.1000504@thewordnerd.info> <4F562AB5.2010908@ubuntu.com> Message-ID: <4F562CFA.2010405@thewordnerd.info> On 03/06/2012 09:18 AM, Alan Bell wrote: > > On the plus side I do believe that the fixes are really quite small, > and then I expect it will be quite good in comparison to older > releases. What concerns me the most is that things are not being > tested until too late. *Designs* are not tested for accessibility. The > design team should be doing accessibility testing before anyone writes > any code. It should be known roughly what script an orca user would > hear when going through the dash or the hud or the menus etc. before > they get coded up. This is massively easier to do than drawing > pictures for the visual design (it is just text) and would probably > help the design and implementation process much more than it would be > any kind of overhead. > >> Hopefully that is the case. >> I don't use that sort of language lightly on public mailing lists, > yeah, best not to. It doesn't really make your point any stronger and > then people end up focussing on that and not the broken software that > needs fixing. > Unfortunately, I'm part of a group that gets left behind as a matter of course. Whenever a new platform comes out, it's a given that I as a blind user won't be able to use it for at least a year. Even then, it may be two more years before access is compelling (I'm writing an Android screen reader, and it wasn't until October that I actually felt like it was a decently-accessible platform.) Also, whether you like or dislike Winphone 7, Microsoft just flat out didn't consider accessibility at all, and while WP7 may not have been the best choice, it should at least have been a choice. Ubuntu is rapidly becoming something that is not a choice for disabled users because new releases that fix bugs for able-bodied people merely break things worse for us. I regret that it detracts, but if just being who you are and existing isn't a compelling reason for people from all platforms to design with you in mind, and if a company refuses to learn from its proven track record of shipping production-ready releases that are unusable for some despite the availability of knowledge that would fix that, well, I have a hard time approaching that level of exclusion coolly and calmly. So let's get this stuff fixed, OK? And let's put in place *now* processes that prevent this going forward. I'm tired of having this discussion every time a beta gets released, then six months later it's like "oh, wow, we're having this chat for the first time aren't we?" Uh, no, we *aren't*. From cjk at teamcharliesangels.com Tue Mar 6 15:50:03 2012 From: cjk at teamcharliesangels.com (Charlie Kravetz) Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2012 08:50:03 -0700 Subject: (In)Accessibility of Unity in current Precise In-Reply-To: <4F562AB5.2010908@ubuntu.com> References: <4F56196A.2000605@thewordnerd.info> <4F56201F.5040403@ubuntu.com> <4F562371.1000504@thewordnerd.info> <4F562AB5.2010908@ubuntu.com> Message-ID: <20120306085003.46cde61c@teamcharliesangels.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Tue, 06 Mar 2012 15:18:13 +0000 Alan Bell wrote: > On 06/03/12 14:47, Nolan Darilek wrote: > > Wait, you mean there's *this much breakage* in a *beta*? > yes. There are expected to be broken things in a beta, but I do agree > that if the with-eyes experience was as bad as it is eyes-free right now > then it probably wouldn't go out of the door. > > On the plus side I do believe that the fixes are really quite small, and > then I expect it will be quite good in comparison to older releases. > What concerns me the most is that things are not being tested until too > late. *Designs* are not tested for accessibility. The design team should > be doing accessibility testing before anyone writes any code. It should > be known roughly what script an orca user would hear when going through > the dash or the hud or the menus etc. before they get coded up. This is > massively easier to do than drawing pictures for the visual design (it > is just text) and would probably help the design and implementation > process much more than it would be any kind of overhead. > > > I don't use that sort of language lightly on public mailing lists, > yeah, best not to. It doesn't really make your point any stronger and > then people end up focussing on that and not the broken software that > needs fixing. > > Alan > Much as I hate to say it, this is what I have fought for at UDS for quite a while now. Every 6 months, the rhetoric is the same. "Accessibility is very important. We will make sure it can be tested during the Alpha testing stages! We can not have a11y broken for the cycle, and expect it to work at release." Unfortunately, talk is still much cheaper than action. - -- Charlie Kravetz Linux Registered User Number 425914 [http://counter.li.org/] Never let anyone steal your DREAM. [http://keepingdreams.com] -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJPVjIrAAoJEFNEIRz9dxbAArkH/RVUOtaZstHjocJfQo3vnppw +GRn9AuifkubxZf5p4dg+t3W7N3TGPSZbIyVepT03Xr+XCty1rtTy37F530Iq0j5 qTNWefFJkmFSSrHtijTa+NZEQH2C+oHg2dsZqSp18MFfaivzGI4ASTX0Pqslowtk TlfxMs/67UlXgGPAEMYTF6+k/fUr4z0fYCASKy2XRBgDYPqDrBFT4RIlnEKDom46 0VbR7MK5qHw08mCNJi5KuTBZ9Df5m1eFoabej9vHYTcj7EgvGcZ4iKNIA2zdAZHW 5o8Zpav2Pgf0ZWDCNpSYavtWwMhKC6W0i3boCDvzxzZAWQMYMKgeUYt8QI43b1c= =/EtN -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From nolan at thewordnerd.info Tue Mar 6 16:13:46 2012 From: nolan at thewordnerd.info (Nolan Darilek) Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2012 10:13:46 -0600 Subject: (In)Accessibility of Unity in current Precise In-Reply-To: <20120306085003.46cde61c@teamcharliesangels.com> References: <4F56196A.2000605@thewordnerd.info> <4F56201F.5040403@ubuntu.com> <4F562371.1000504@thewordnerd.info> <4F562AB5.2010908@ubuntu.com> <20120306085003.46cde61c@teamcharliesangels.com> Message-ID: <4F5637BA.6060304@thewordnerd.info> On 03/06/2012 09:50 AM, Charlie Kravetz wrote: > Much as I hate to say it, this is what I have fought for at UDS for > quite a while now. Every 6 months, the rhetoric is the same. > "Accessibility is very important. We will make sure it can be tested > during the Alpha testing stages! We can not have a11y broken for the > cycle, and expect it to work at release." Unfortunately, talk is still > much cheaper than action. This is why I'm *angry*. Not just annoyed, but seriously angry. I see this from Google, Microsoft, Canonical and to a lesser extent Apple. So how do we change this? I'd have hoped that posting to this list would be enough, but it seems like it's the place where accessibility issues go to die, ignored by the mainstream community. Think I might try posting something in the brainstorm question-asking system, whatever it's called. Then change.org. This is so incredibly disappointing and unfortunate. Also unfortunate is how halfway through every do-release-upgrade I've ever done, speech changes from English to some non-English language, and even though the computer is still running, I can't finish the upgrade. I have a screen session running and an ssh server up, but my access point seems to be flaking out and I can't connect to finish the upgrade--that, or something in the upgrade broke wifi. I might be more forgiving of that if I was upgrading to a working system, but it looks like I won't be. I get that for some this is a passionate volunteer effort, but I am a developer who uses his Ubuntu system exclusively for work and play. This is not just an annoyance. Rather, it is the system I use to have fun and pay my bills slipping further and further out-of-date with the mainstream. I am very seriously wondering if Windows or OS X might represent the only upgrade path I'll ever have available to me. At the very least, I could be productively receiving accessibility upgrades at a pace equivalent to what I do on Ubuntu, once every year or year and a half. From nolan at thewordnerd.info Tue Mar 6 18:16:39 2012 From: nolan at thewordnerd.info (Nolan Darilek) Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2012 12:16:39 -0600 Subject: Brainstorm.ubuntu.com inaccessible account creation process Message-ID: <4F565487.2050601@thewordnerd.info> I thought I'd post to Brainstorm about this, so I wrote a letter. Only, the account creation process uses an ASCII CAPTCHA with no audio equivalent. I can't even run that past WebVisum. I'll figure something else out, I guess. Ugh this is disheartening. I was so looking forward to a 12.04 release that, while not perfect, would at least give me a working GNOME 3 and current at-spi2. From chaltain at gmail.com Tue Mar 6 20:05:10 2012 From: chaltain at gmail.com (Christopher Chaltain) Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2012 14:05:10 -0600 Subject: Brainstorm.ubuntu.com inaccessible account creation process In-Reply-To: <4F565487.2050601@thewordnerd.info> References: <4F565487.2050601@thewordnerd.info> Message-ID: <4F566DF6.6050903@gmail.com> What account creation process are you talking about? Where are you trying to create an account? I'm not going to say you don't have valid reasons to be disappointed, but I wouldn't give up hope on 12.04 altogether. We're only a week or two past feature freeze, and we're only on the first beta for 12.04. I agree it would have been better if accessibility had played a bigger role during the design and development phases, but there is still time to get bugs resolved. I'm also not sure about the relationship between Gnome and Unity, but I thought 12.04 would be shipping with Unity and not Gnome 3. On 06/03/12 12:16, Nolan Darilek wrote: > I thought I'd post to Brainstorm about this, so I wrote a letter. Only, > the account creation process uses an ASCII CAPTCHA with no audio > equivalent. I can't even run that past WebVisum. > > I'll figure something else out, I guess. Ugh this is disheartening. I > was so looking forward to a 12.04 release that, while not perfect, would > at least give me a working GNOME 3 and current at-spi2. > -- Christopher (CJ) chaltain at gmail.com From alanbell at ubuntu.com Tue Mar 6 20:09:21 2012 From: alanbell at ubuntu.com (Alan Bell) Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2012 20:09:21 +0000 Subject: Brainstorm.ubuntu.com inaccessible account creation process In-Reply-To: <4F566DF6.6050903@gmail.com> References: <4F565487.2050601@thewordnerd.info> <4F566DF6.6050903@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4F566EF1.6070201@ubuntu.com> On 06/03/12 20:05, Christopher Chaltain wrote: > What account creation process are you talking about? Where are you > trying to create an account? > > I'm not going to say you don't have valid reasons to be disappointed, > but I wouldn't give up hope on 12.04 altogether. We're only a week or > two past feature freeze, and we're only on the first beta for 12.04. I > agree it would have been better if accessibility had played a bigger > role during the design and development phases, but there is still time > to get bugs resolved. yes, and these issues are being raised with the relevant developers. > > I'm also not sure about the relationship between Gnome and Unity, but I > thought 12.04 would be shipping with Unity and not Gnome 3. > Unity is a shell for Gnome, but it is not Gnome-Shell. Unity will be shipping with most of the stuff that is considered the Gnome 3 desktop, but there will be some bits and pieces that are Gnome 2 I believe. The Gnome desktop is a heap of applications from the Gnome project, including stuff like Gedit, Orca etc. One application in the full Gnome 3 desktop is Gnome-Shell. That isn't being shipped by default but that application can be installed. Alan. -- The Open Learning Centre is rebranding, find out about our new name and look at http://libertus.co.uk From chaltain at gmail.com Tue Mar 6 20:13:20 2012 From: chaltain at gmail.com (Christopher Chaltain) Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2012 14:13:20 -0600 Subject: Brainstorm.ubuntu.com inaccessible account creation process In-Reply-To: <4F566EF1.6070201@ubuntu.com> References: <4F565487.2050601@thewordnerd.info> <4F566DF6.6050903@gmail.com> <4F566EF1.6070201@ubuntu.com> Message-ID: <4F566FE0.4020000@gmail.com> OK, thanks Alan. Nevermind about the question on the account creation. In rereading the post, I now understand what account was being referred to. Sorry for my stupidity! On 06/03/12 14:09, Alan Bell wrote: > On 06/03/12 20:05, Christopher Chaltain wrote: >> What account creation process are you talking about? Where are you >> trying to create an account? >> >> I'm not going to say you don't have valid reasons to be disappointed, >> but I wouldn't give up hope on 12.04 altogether. We're only a week or >> two past feature freeze, and we're only on the first beta for 12.04. I >> agree it would have been better if accessibility had played a bigger >> role during the design and development phases, but there is still time >> to get bugs resolved. > yes, and these issues are being raised with the relevant developers. >> >> I'm also not sure about the relationship between Gnome and Unity, but I >> thought 12.04 would be shipping with Unity and not Gnome 3. >> > Unity is a shell for Gnome, but it is not Gnome-Shell. Unity will be > shipping with most of the stuff that is considered the Gnome 3 desktop, > but there will be some bits and pieces that are Gnome 2 I believe. The > Gnome desktop is a heap of applications from the Gnome project, > including stuff like Gedit, Orca etc. One application in the full Gnome > 3 desktop is Gnome-Shell. That isn't being shipped by default but that > application can be installed. > > Alan. > -- Christopher (CJ) chaltain at gmail.com From alanbell at ubuntu.com Tue Mar 6 20:17:33 2012 From: alanbell at ubuntu.com (Alan Bell) Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2012 20:17:33 +0000 Subject: Brainstorm.ubuntu.com inaccessible account creation process In-Reply-To: <4F565487.2050601@thewordnerd.info> References: <4F565487.2050601@thewordnerd.info> Message-ID: <4F5670DD.9000908@ubuntu.com> On 06/03/12 18:16, Nolan Darilek wrote: > I thought I'd post to Brainstorm about this, so I wrote a letter. > Only, the account creation process uses an ASCII CAPTCHA with no audio > equivalent. I can't even run that past WebVisum. > > I'll figure something else out, I guess. Ugh this is disheartening. I > was so looking forward to a 12.04 release that, while not perfect, > would at least give me a working GNOME 3 and current at-spi2. > that is an ascii art captcha, which is interesting, not seen one of those before. If you use IRC feel free to message me the captcha and I will tell you what it says. I am AlanBell on the freenode network. Alan. -- The Open Learning Centre is rebranding, find out about our new name and look at http://libertus.co.uk From marc.geiser at gmail.com Tue Mar 6 20:58:36 2012 From: marc.geiser at gmail.com (Marc Geiser) Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2012 21:58:36 +0100 Subject: LSM/RMLL 2012 : 13th Libre Software Meeting ::Call for Paper Message-ID: * LSM/RMLL 2012* 13th Libre Software Meeting July 7-12, 2012 Geneva, SWITZERLAND http://2012.rmll.info/ Call For Papers and Participation limited on health topic [we apologize for duplicate receipt of this message] Last call before deadline : march *31* 2012 Dear Colleague, The 13th Libre Software Meeting (LSM) takes place in Geneva, Switzerland, July 7-12 2012 (http://2012.rmll.info/). LSM is an annual non-commercial conference on Libre Softwares that includes round tables and practical workshops. The objective is to provide a place where users, developers and promoters of Libre Software can exchange ideas and information. Attendance is free and open to everyone. Each year the health workshop is held as part of this broader meeting. This year, it will be organized around 3 major fields: - Accessibility, autonomy and dependency management (mobile/web accessibility, accessible desktop applications, usability, ...) - Hospital information system & Tele-health (EHR, telemedicine systems, workflow solutions, PACS, HL7, ...) - Imaging & visualization of medical data (CAS, CAD, bio-imaging, image acquisition/processing/segmentation/registration, simulation, organ tracking ...) We invite presentations that address these major fields. The LSM committee aims to disseminate and improve Libre projects in the health domain through this workshop. To better target the various exchanges that will be taking place, the programme committee of the health workshop proposes several kinds of meetings: - "Solution" meetings, with conferences and round tables to present solutions dedicated to previous areas. - "State of the art" conferences between practitioners, developers and scientists to discuss about what exists according to the specific needs of users, what works well or a little less well, to talk about approaches... - "Technical" presentations between developers and scientists. This will allow initiation of exchanges between communities that do not necessarily have the opportunity to meet and will maybe lead to new collaborations or projects. Finally, a workshop area will be available to try out and exchange tools presented by their authors or by seasoned users of those solutions. Last year the health workshop received (for example) the following projects: OsiriX, FreeMedForms, GDCM, Chewing Word, ITK, VTK, WEASIS, ... Information on health workshops from previous annual meetings are available on : - http://2011.rmll.info/-Sante-accessibilite-et-handicap-?lang=en You will be able to attend conferences on other related issues such as "System Administration" (like Nagios, GLPI, Cfengine, ...), "Development" (like NoSQL, Lucene, GCC, ...), "Law" (like Licenses,OpenData, FSF, ...), "Internet" (WebGL, Jabber, Typo3, ...), ... All conferences are available on : - http://2011.rmll.info/-Programme-?lang=en This year, LSM will have also 3 transversal topics (thread) : - Cloud - Common goods - "Libre" economy If you are interested to participate, please submit your presentation at: http://call.rmll.info/talk/new Please feel free to share this information with others people who may be interested. We welcome your participation and input and look forward for a valuable meeting. *IMPORTANT* *DATES*: *- *The deadline for submission is 31 March 2012. - The list of accepted presentations will be announced 15 April, 2012. - Meeting: July 7-12, 2012. *ABSTRACT* *SUBMISSION*: - The call for papers is available here: EN : http://2012.rmll.info/participer/call-for-papers DE : http://2012.rmll.info/participer/call-for-papers-deutsch FR : http://2012.rmll.info/participer/appel-a-conferences - And you can answer on : http://call.rmll.info/ (Note, you can submit in *english* or *french*) Best regards, Programme Commitee of the LSM 2012 health/accessibility topic -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From daphnewriter at gmail.com Wed Mar 7 16:59:00 2012 From: daphnewriter at gmail.com (Leon Johnston) Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2012 10:59:00 -0600 Subject: Address of LINUX USER GROUP in Pensacola, Florida Message-ID: Hi, I would very much appreciate your advising me of the address of the LINUX USER GROUP located in Pensacola, Florida, Gulf Breeze, Florida, or anywhere in Escambia or Santa Rosa counties in Florida. Thanks, -- *LEON* * * -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alanbell at ubuntu.com Wed Mar 7 22:10:14 2012 From: alanbell at ubuntu.com (Alan Bell) Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2012 22:10:14 +0000 Subject: (In)Accessibility of Unity in current Precise In-Reply-To: <4F562CFA.2010405@thewordnerd.info> References: <4F56196A.2000605@thewordnerd.info> <4F56201F.5040403@ubuntu.com> <4F562371.1000504@thewordnerd.info> <4F562AB5.2010908@ubuntu.com> <4F562CFA.2010405@thewordnerd.info> Message-ID: <4F57DCC6.4010609@ubuntu.com> So right now we have a broken dash, HUD, indicators, launcher, global menu and lightdm, I took a few videos and filed a few bugs. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=biJRwpcJBa8 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFVpVN21MbY http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gvHj1tLd2IQ Lightdm doesn't work https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-greeter/+bug/944161 https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity-greeter/+bug/944159 HUD doesn't work https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-appmenu/+bug/949445 Dash doesn't work https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/949372 Global menus and indicators don't work https://bugs.launchpad.net/dbusmenu/+bug/949370 Launcher doesn't work https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/949448 and finally one bonus bug that isn't in the videos is that the shortcuts overlay doesn't work https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/935194 I would really appreciate it if these things could be made broadly functional so that we can do some useful testing and fixing of the details. Right now there is no polishing that can be done to make it work better because it simply does not work at all. What I *really* want is for some basic testing to be done pre-landing of this code. A Beta would not go out of the door with this much broken for sighted users. Alan. From themuso at ubuntu.com Wed Mar 7 22:26:47 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2012 09:26:47 +1100 Subject: (In)Accessibility of Unity in current Precise In-Reply-To: <4F57DCC6.4010609@ubuntu.com> References: <4F56196A.2000605@thewordnerd.info> <4F56201F.5040403@ubuntu.com> <4F562371.1000504@thewordnerd.info> <4F562AB5.2010908@ubuntu.com> <4F562CFA.2010405@thewordnerd.info> <4F57DCC6.4010609@ubuntu.com> Message-ID: <20120307222647.GB4259@acapella> On Thu, Mar 08, 2012 at 09:10:14AM EST, Alan Bell wrote: > So right now we have a broken dash, HUD, indicators, launcher, > global menu and lightdm, I took a few videos and filed a few bugs. > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=biJRwpcJBa8 > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFVpVN21MbY > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gvHj1tLd2IQ > > Lightdm doesn't work > https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity-greeter/+bug/944161 > https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity-greeter/+bug/944159 On my radar, have had to track down a regression in GTK a11y code related to ubiquity, but am on top of that now, and once I file a bug upstream today, unity-greeter will be my next target. > HUD doesn't work > https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-appmenu/+bug/949445 There is a greater chance of solving this for Unity 2D, I'd like to take time to look at this as well if I can. > Dash doesn't work > https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/949372 Again, unity 2D is all I am caring about atm, and the dash works there, with a slight keyboard bug, not being able to move between lenses. > Global menus and indicators don't work > https://bugs.launchpad.net/dbusmenu/+bug/949370 If you mean the menus, then yes, I hav e aifx in the work, but it needs reworking to comply with dbusmenu tests. > Launcher doesn't work > https://bugs.launchpad.net/unity/+bug/949448 Unity 2D launcher works. If you haven't guessed already, I am only caring about Unity 2D for the LTS, because once again, its consistantly the most accessible, thanks to QT and the new at-spi bridge. Luke From guyster104 at att.net Wed Mar 7 23:04:44 2012 From: guyster104 at att.net (Guy Schlosser) Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2012 18:04:44 -0500 Subject: keyboard shortcuts in unity 2d Message-ID: <4F57E98C.9050505@att.net> Hi all, since we're on the topic of broken accessibility during the beta, I would like to bring up a couple regressions that I've noticed during my testing. I am running Unity 2d on a fully up-to-date laptop as of 5:30 PM today. Whenever I use alt+space to access the system menu (for minimizing, maximizing, etc.), this menu does not appear, leaving no ability to minimize windows. Along this same line, alt+f4 does not work for closing them, but fortunately, I'm able to work around this with ctrl+q. Lastly, alt+tab is not working to switch between opened windows, however my work around for this has been to access the launcher, and switch that way. With all this being said, I am definitely impressed with how Ubuntu 12.04 is shaping up. My system is mostly usable with Unity 2d, although I will definitely be happy when U3d has the same level of accessibility. It'll come though, keep up the good work. Thanks, Guy From cjk at teamcharliesangels.com Wed Mar 7 23:07:57 2012 From: cjk at teamcharliesangels.com (Charlie Kravetz) Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2012 16:07:57 -0700 Subject: Address of LINUX USER GROUP in Pensacola, Florida In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20120307160757.3111d40d@teamcharliesangels.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Wed, 7 Mar 2012 10:59:00 -0600 Leon Johnston wrote: > Hi, > > I would very much appreciate your advising me of the address of the > LINUX USER GROUP located in Pensacola, Florida, Gulf Breeze, Florida, or > anywhere in Escambia or Santa Rosa counties in Florida. > > > Thanks, > We don't actually maintain lists of Linux User Groups. I could suggest contacting the Florida Local Community Team [1], and see if a member is near you. The Florida Loco is a group of Ubuntu users, within the state of Florida. By using the links on the wiki page, you can email the team leaders and find a user close to you that may be able to assist. [1] http://loco.ubuntu.com/teams/ubuntu-us-florida - -- Charlie Kravetz Linux Registered User Number 425914 [http://counter.li.org/] Never let anyone steal your DREAM. [http://keepingdreams.com] -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJPV+pNAAoJEFNEIRz9dxbA7nYIALGauMlmEwlCGgedatnbGYAi 6BDVqbuGvTEhRuahYvFoXFAf2v8XljE1eTTD6zKf7MBbLmM5faPaos1Zbzq5xNPq tjkfQFNaLG3h0bOtbvG8tkZ1SsxcVIGWAsIGxW4X01egqjLpFs8jl47YI+P26ibJ w5KdMeOku5NxNHp5K/ueBeL9Y1MRM+pPwrD2YXC7ce1YYEXj4OKAj5WTUGIWdPNy rAZ0GpLmQknmmiaC2wo5ldyyJE+pkyUsQLAM4XayBIa0OznX36ZqWXL+sGUXB1yK lGVbAzeuefVIjLQ6Ld8UTHq1jmoYe9gTwGLsCxdPkEqv0zqJjSKkyYeM/6Vjwgo= =rVuz -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From hammera at pickup.hu Thu Mar 8 07:03:58 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2012 08:03:58 +0100 Subject: An importanter GTK3 menues related bug Message-ID: <4F5859DE.6020609@pickup.hu> Hy, In Ubuntu level possible fixing following GTK3 bug until upstream level not fixed this bug? https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=654410 See the last comment of the developer. Attila From vilmar at informal.com.br Thu Mar 8 19:09:28 2012 From: vilmar at informal.com.br (=?UTF-8?B?Sm9zw6kgVmlsbWFyIEVzdMOhY2lvIGRlIFNvdXph?=) Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2012 16:09:28 -0300 Subject: ubuntu 12.04 and alt+tab Message-ID: <4F5903E8.1030403@informal.com.br> Hi all. Seems that I can not use alt+tab to change to another window. Is there a workaround? Thanks. From themuso at ubuntu.com Thu Mar 8 21:32:00 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2012 08:32:00 +1100 Subject: ubuntu 12.04 and alt+tab In-Reply-To: <4F5903E8.1030403@informal.com.br> References: <4F5903E8.1030403@informal.com.br> Message-ID: <20120308213200.GA4067@acapella> On Fri, Mar 09, 2012 at 06:09:28AM EST, José Vilmar Estácio de Souza wrote: > Hi all. > Seems that I can not use alt+tab to change to another window. > > Is there a workaround? Yes, use unity-2d, and make sure you have the latest updates. Luke From themuso at ubuntu.com Thu Mar 8 21:37:26 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2012 08:37:26 +1100 Subject: An importanter GTK3 menues related bug In-Reply-To: <4F5859DE.6020609@pickup.hu> References: <4F5859DE.6020609@pickup.hu> Message-ID: <20120308213726.GB4067@acapella> On Thu, Mar 08, 2012 at 06:03:58PM EST, Hammer Attila wrote: > Hy, > > In Ubuntu level possible fixing following GTK3 bug until upstream > level not fixed this bug? > https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=654410 > See the last comment of the developer. Unfortunately that is dealing with GTK code that I know little to nothing about, and I don't have time to study the code to get it fixed. It really does sadden me that the bug has been put on the back burner, but at this point for precise, unless someone has a patch ready to go that I could possibly get into Ubuntu, then it will have to stay unresolved. Luke From vilmar at informal.com.br Fri Mar 9 00:51:38 2012 From: vilmar at informal.com.br (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jos=E9_Vilmar_Est=E1cio_de_Souza?=) Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2012 21:51:38 -0300 Subject: ubuntu 12.04 and alt+tab In-Reply-To: <20120308213200.GA4067@acapella> References: <4F5903E8.1030403@informal.com.br> <20120308213200.GA4067@acapella> Message-ID: <4F59541A.3010102@informal.com.br> Hi Luke. I am using unity2d with all updates. This is the default installation when installing using orca, isn't it? My test case is: Press alt+t to open a terminal and press alt+t to open another terminal. Now try to switch from one terminal to the other pressing alt+tab. In my environment it doesn't work. I am running 12.04 using a virtual machine and the VM is running under ubuntu 11.10 with all updates. Thanks. On 03/08/2012 06:32 PM, Luke Yelavich wrote: > On Fri, Mar 09, 2012 at 06:09:28AM EST, José Vilmar Estácio de Souza wrote: >> Hi all. >> Seems that I can not use alt+tab to change to another window. >> >> Is there a workaround? > > Yes, use unity-2d, and make sure you have the latest updates. > > Luke > From guyster104 at att.net Fri Mar 9 01:00:50 2012 From: guyster104 at att.net (Guy Schlosser) Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2012 20:00:50 -0500 Subject: ubuntu 12.04 and alt+tab In-Reply-To: <20120308213200.GA4067@acapella> References: <4F5903E8.1030403@informal.com.br> <20120308213200.GA4067@acapella> Message-ID: <4F595642.6060001@att.net> Actually, I just updated my system 20 minutes ago, and I still can't use alt+tab or alt+f4 in Unity 2d. The only way I can switch windows is to use the launcher. One thing I did notice though, is that the quick menus are now working. This is super cool for me, since I use my jump drive quite a bit, and can now easily eject it. Should these keys be working? Are the bindings still alt+tab and alt+f4? Any suggestions would be appreciated, and looking forward to 12.04 release. Thanks, Guy On 03/08/2012 04:32 PM, Luke Yelavich wrote:ncher. > On Fri, Mar 09, 2012 at 06:09:28AM EST, José Vilmar Estácio de Souza wrote: >> Hi all. >> Seems that I can not use alt+tab to change to another window. >> >> Is there a workaround? > Yes, use unity-2d, and make sure you have the latest updates. > > Luke > From vilmar at informal.com.br Fri Mar 9 01:10:07 2012 From: vilmar at informal.com.br (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jos=E9_Vilmar_Est=E1cio_de_Souza?=) Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2012 22:10:07 -0300 Subject: ubuntu 12.04 and alt+tab In-Reply-To: <4F595642.6060001@att.net> References: <4F5903E8.1030403@informal.com.br> <20120308213200.GA4067@acapella> <4F595642.6060001@att.net> Message-ID: <4F59586F.3090801@informal.com.br> Hi Guy, Please forgive my dumb question, but how can I switch windows using the launcher? Thanks. On 03/08/2012 10:00 PM, Guy Schlosser wrote: > Actually, I just updated my system 20 minutes ago, and I still can't use > alt+tab or alt+f4 in Unity 2d. The only way I can switch windows is to > use the launcher. One thing I did notice though, is that the quick menus > are now working. This is super cool for me, since I use my jump drive > quite a bit, and can now easily eject it. Should these keys be working? > Are the bindings still alt+tab and alt+f4? Any suggestions would be > appreciated, and looking forward to 12.04 release. > > Thanks, > > > Guy > > > On 03/08/2012 04:32 PM, Luke Yelavich wrote:ncher. >> On Fri, Mar 09, 2012 at 06:09:28AM EST, José Vilmar Estácio de Souza >> wrote: >>> Hi all. >>> Seems that I can not use alt+tab to change to another window. >>> >>> Is there a workaround? >> Yes, use unity-2d, and make sure you have the latest updates. >> >> Luke >> > > From guyster104 at att.net Fri Mar 9 01:46:06 2012 From: guyster104 at att.net (Guy Schlosser) Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2012 20:46:06 -0500 Subject: ubuntu 12.04 and alt+tab In-Reply-To: <4F59586F.3090801@informal.com.br> References: <4F5903E8.1030403@informal.com.br> <20120308213200.GA4067@acapella> <4F595642.6060001@att.net> <4F59586F.3090801@informal.com.br> Message-ID: <4F5960DE.3020702@att.net> Hi Jose, When you press alt+f1, if you're using Unity 2d, orca should say "shell filler". Then arrow down to the program you want (e.g. terminal). It should also say "one window open" for example, then just press enter. Definitely a pain, but works 'til alt+tab gets fixed. Thanks, Guy On 03/08/2012 08:10 PM, José Vilmar Estácio de Souza wrote: > Hi Guy, > Please forgive my dumb question, but how can I switch windows using > the launcher? > Thanks. > > On 03/08/2012 10:00 PM, Guy Schlosser wrote: >> Actually, I just updated my system 20 minutes ago, and I still can't use >> alt+tab or alt+f4 in Unity 2d. The only way I can switch windows is to >> use the launcher. One thing I did notice though, is that the quick menus >> are now working. This is super cool for me, since I use my jump drive >> quite a bit, and can now easily eject it. Should these keys be working? >> Are the bindings still alt+tab and alt+f4? Any suggestions would be >> appreciated, and looking forward to 12.04 release. >> >> Thanks, >> >> >> Guy >> >> >> On 03/08/2012 04:32 PM, Luke Yelavich wrote:ncher. >>> On Fri, Mar 09, 2012 at 06:09:28AM EST, José Vilmar Estácio de Souza >>> wrote: >>>> Hi all. >>>> Seems that I can not use alt+tab to change to another window. >>>> >>>> Is there a workaround? >>> Yes, use unity-2d, and make sure you have the latest updates. >>> >>> Luke >>> >> >> > From themuso at ubuntu.com Fri Mar 9 02:11:43 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2012 13:11:43 +1100 Subject: ubuntu 12.04 and alt+tab In-Reply-To: <4F5960DE.3020702@att.net> References: <4F5903E8.1030403@informal.com.br> <20120308213200.GA4067@acapella> <4F595642.6060001@att.net> <4F59586F.3090801@informal.com.br> <4F5960DE.3020702@att.net> Message-ID: <20120309021143.GA3570@acapella> On Fri, Mar 09, 2012 at 12:46:06PM EST, Guy Schlosser wrote: > Hi Jose, When you press alt+f1, if you're using Unity 2d, orca > should say "shell filler". Then arrow down to the program you want > (e.g. terminal). It should also say "one window open" for example, > then just press enter. Definitely a pain, but works 'til alt+tab > gets fixed. Hum ok, its working just fine for me with latest updates. Let me do a fresh install on another machine, and see if I can reproduce the issue there. Luke From hammera at pickup.hu Fri Mar 9 09:34:30 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2012 10:34:30 +0100 Subject: How can possible enable login sound an installed Precise system? Message-ID: <4F59CEA6.2050901@pickup.hu> Hy, I have got a possible trivial question: How can possible enable again the succesful login sound with an installed Precise system if an user using screen reader? I tryed the startup applications preference tool. GNOME login sound service is presented, but unfortunately I see only following columns the tree table: - Enable column (this is an empty column, nothing possible doing this column with keyboard), Orca says this column is empty. - Icon column (this column shows the application icon). - Name column (this column shows the application name). Oldest versions of the startup applications preference tool the first column is a check box with possible checking or unchecking the required services. Attila From ka1cey at gmail.com Fri Mar 9 19:55:22 2012 From: ka1cey at gmail.com (Dave Hunt) Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2012 14:55:22 -0500 Subject: [OT] compiz crash on Precise beta from cdimage.ubuntu.com/dailylive/current Message-ID: <4F5A602A.6010909@gmail.com> Hi, What is a better place to report this? When trying to start my copy of the subject release, from a thumbdrive, I got error messages about compiz unable to start, and could not get past them. Note: I use orca for accessibility, and could not get it speaking; messages paraphrased from having someone read the screen. Is the compiz issue a known problem with today's daily build of Precise Desktop 32-bit Edition? -Dave From guyster104 at att.net Fri Mar 9 23:21:40 2012 From: guyster104 at att.net (Guy Schlosser) Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2012 18:21:40 -0500 Subject: ubuntu 12.04 and alt+tab In-Reply-To: <20120309021143.GA3570@acapella> References: <4F5903E8.1030403@informal.com.br> <20120308213200.GA4067@acapella> <4F595642.6060001@att.net> <4F59586F.3090801@informal.com.br> <4F5960DE.3020702@att.net> <20120309021143.GA3570@acapella> Message-ID: <4F5A9084.9020108@att.net> Hey there Luke and Jose, I just wanted to write about what I've noticed with the alt+tab issue. It seems that whatever is wrong, is only wrong with Unity 2d. I installed the latest updates on my desktop, running Unity 3d, and alt+tab works just fine, along with alt+space for the minimize/maximize menu, and alt+f4. I then booted into Unity 2d on the same desktop machine, and have the same problems, as on my laptop running Unity 2d. On a more positive note though, I was glad to hear that the menus are now reading again after today's updates. For me, in Unity 2d and 3d both. I hope this helps narrow down the problem, and look forward to being able to use alt+tab again in Unity 2d. Thanks to all for all the hard work, Guy From vilmar at informal.com.br Fri Mar 9 23:50:57 2012 From: vilmar at informal.com.br (=?UTF-8?B?Sm9zw6kgVmlsbWFyIEVzdMOhY2lvIGRlIFNvdXph?=) Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2012 20:50:57 -0300 Subject: ubuntu 12.04 and alt+tab In-Reply-To: <4F5A9084.9020108@att.net> References: <4F5903E8.1030403@informal.com.br> <20120308213200.GA4067@acapella> <4F595642.6060001@att.net> <4F59586F.3090801@informal.com.br> <4F5960DE.3020702@att.net> <20120309021143.GA3570@acapella> <4F5A9084.9020108@att.net> Message-ID: <4F5A9761.8040804@informal.com.br> In addition what is happening in my environment is that when I press the alt key alone, ubuntu reacts as if I had pressed the super key. When I press the alt key, I hear shell filler. I need to press the escape key to use the system. How can I run unity-3d? Thanks. On 03/09/2012 08:21 PM, Guy Schlosser wrote: > Hey there Luke and Jose, I just wanted to write about what I've noticed > with the alt+tab issue. It seems that whatever is wrong, is only wrong > with Unity 2d. I installed the latest updates on my desktop, running > Unity 3d, and alt+tab works just fine, along with alt+space for the > minimize/maximize menu, and alt+f4. I then booted into Unity 2d on the > same desktop machine, and have the same problems, as on my laptop > running Unity 2d. On a more positive note though, I was glad to hear > that the menus are now reading again after today's updates. For me, in > Unity 2d and 3d both. I hope this helps narrow down the problem, and > look forward to being able to use alt+tab again in Unity 2d. > > Thanks to all for all the hard work, > > > Guy > > From hammera at pickup.hu Sat Mar 10 10:10:17 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2012 11:10:17 +0100 Subject: (In)Accessibility of Unity in current Precise In-Reply-To: <20120307222647.GB4259@acapella> References: <4F56196A.2000605@thewordnerd.info> <4F56201F.5040403@ubuntu.com> <4F562371.1000504@thewordnerd.info> <4F562AB5.2010908@ubuntu.com> <4F562CFA.2010405@thewordnerd.info> <4F57DCC6.4010609@ubuntu.com> <20120307222647.GB4259@acapella> Message-ID: <4F5B2889.9050301@pickup.hu> Hy, Menues after this day morning updates are mostly working, for example indicators under GNOME3 fallback session Orca now spokening menu item labels partialy right. If have a mnemonic letter of a menu, Orca spokening the underscore character and the mnemonic letter. Some Orca users reported following issue in Orca List: "Hi Krishnakant, It appears that with the latest update this morning menues are mostly working. I am now getting spoken feedback for all menus. I have noticed a few oddities and am not sure if it is my system or something ubuntu or orca related. Hopefully someone else can confirm this and then I can file appropriate bugs. 1. Menus are spoken with what appears to be "underscore" where spaces should be. Note that this doesn't always happen as expected, for example, in the firefox edit menu, I hear "underscore find" "pref underscore erences" "find underscore again". Perhaps this is underscores being sent where spaces should be, although the apparent random insertion of one in the middle of preferences is strange. Also the one preceding find." This issue are reproducable with indicators with hungarian locale in GNOME3 fallback session the indicator-applet-complete panel applet. Doesn't setted the use_underline property with true value when committed the fix? Attila From bhawkeslewis at googlemail.com Sat Mar 10 13:03:33 2012 From: bhawkeslewis at googlemail.com (Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2012 13:03:33 +0000 Subject: (In)Accessibility of Unity in current Precise In-Reply-To: <4F5637BA.6060304@thewordnerd.info> References: <4F56196A.2000605@thewordnerd.info> <4F56201F.5040403@ubuntu.com> <4F562371.1000504@thewordnerd.info> <4F562AB5.2010908@ubuntu.com> <20120306085003.46cde61c@teamcharliesangels.com> <4F5637BA.6060304@thewordnerd.info> Message-ID: On Tue, Mar 6, 2012 at 4:13 PM, Nolan Darilek wrote: > So how do we change this? Assistive technology relies on automation UIs. Automated testing can use automation UIs. End-user scripting can use automation UIs. If *nix environments used automation UIs to drive testability and scriptability, there'd be a lot less breakage for assistive technology. -- Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis From alanbell at ubuntu.com Sat Mar 10 13:22:30 2012 From: alanbell at ubuntu.com (Alan Bell) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2012 13:22:30 +0000 Subject: (In)Accessibility of Unity in current Precise In-Reply-To: References: <4F56196A.2000605@thewordnerd.info> <4F56201F.5040403@ubuntu.com> <4F562371.1000504@thewordnerd.info> <4F562AB5.2010908@ubuntu.com> <20120306085003.46cde61c@teamcharliesangels.com> <4F5637BA.6060304@thewordnerd.info> Message-ID: <4F5B5596.5090503@ubuntu.com> On 10/03/12 13:03, Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis wrote: > On Tue, Mar 6, 2012 at 4:13 PM, Nolan Darilek wrote: >> So how do we change this? > Assistive technology relies on automation UIs. > > Automated testing can use automation UIs. > > End-user scripting can use automation UIs. > > If *nix environments used automation UIs to drive testability and > scriptability, there'd be a lot less breakage for assistive > technology. > > -- > Benjamin Hawkes-Lewis > funnily enough they do use the LDTP stuff for testing some bits of Ubuntu http://ldtp.freedesktop.org/wiki/FAQ in particular ubiquity the installer. This caused a problem last cycle because they dynamically changed all the accessibility strings for the convenience of the test script and left a load of junk in for the screen reader to read out. After we pointed out how rude it was to break things like this a fix was quickly provided that allowed both the ldtp script to work and the screen reader to read the correct strings. The point being, it is used in places, and I would like to encourage more uses of accessibility technology like this. I would like to encourage the use of Orca scripts as part of the design process, alongside the visual storyboard - it is massively easier to write a script than it is to draw a user interface. Alan. -- The Open Learning Centre is rebranding, find out about our new name and look at http://libertus.co.uk From petra at access-for-all.ch Sat Mar 10 19:55:18 2012 From: petra at access-for-all.ch (Petra Ritter) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2012 20:55:18 +0100 Subject: (In)Accessibility of Unity in current Precise Message-ID: <4F5BB1A6.4090204@access-for-all.ch> Hello Attila, Am 10.03.2012 11:10, schrieb Hammer Attila: > > It appears that with the latest update this morning menues are mostly > working. I have just installed the Daily Build (in german) of Ubuntu 12.04 in Virtualbox and I finde the menus of the following programms still inaccessable. Mozilla Firefox Mozilla Thunderbird Terminal and the menu in the right top corner with the time and the Username on it. If I muve down with the arrow-key in the menü orca says allways something like Controll Menu subject not selectet. Oddly enough Orca recognizes the sort cuts for the menu item e. g for print it says CTRL+P or for paste it says CTRL+V. If there a menu item has a supmenu Orca says only menu If I go into the Supmenu Orca responds in the same way as in the menu item without submenu Forther I am not abel to go into the menu by pressing F10. In Unity 2D it is worse. In Unity 2D Orca don't recognizes the menus at all. Orca is mute in the Menu of above programms. Orca seem to be ok with the Menu of Libreoffice. I don't know wether the installation in the Virtualbox is cause the problem. If it is helpfull I can use ubuntu 12.04 of tuday as a live-CD to to be sure that Virtualbox don't cause the problems. best regards Petra Ritter PS: Sorry Attila I didn't want to send the latest mail to you. It should go to the list From doctormo at gmail.com Fri Mar 9 20:41:06 2012 From: doctormo at gmail.com (Martin Owens) Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2012 15:41:06 -0500 Subject: [ubuntu-us-ma] [OT] compiz crash on Precise beta from cdimage.ubuntu.com/dailylive/current In-Reply-To: <4F5A602A.6010909@gmail.com> References: <4F5A602A.6010909@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1331325666.18129.6.camel@delen> You're right, The best place to report this issue is on launchpad, the best place to bring the issue up as important is the ubuntu developers mailing list. Martin, On Fri, 2012-03-09 at 14:55 -0500, Dave Hunt wrote: > What is a better place to report this? When trying to start my copy > of > the subject release, from a thumbdrive, I got error messages about > compiz unable to start, and could not get past them. Note: I use > orca > for accessibility, and could not get it speaking; messages > paraphrased > from having someone read the screen. Is the compiz issue a known > problem with today's daily build of Precise Desktop 32-bit Edition? From hammera at pickup.hu Mon Mar 12 09:29:53 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 10:29:53 +0100 Subject: QT At-spi rolenames possible localizing before final Ubuntu 12.04 release? Message-ID: <4F5DC211.1060709@pickup.hu> Hy, Since rolename refactor happened in Orca side, Orca determining rolenames from At-Spi and atk. Of course this is absolute not matter, because not need own rolename translations with Orca side and not need redundant codes, atk already have translatable rolename strings. If Atk developers add new rolenames, enough translate one place the new rolename string, and Orca will be known the new rolename. Unfortunately with Ubuntu awailable qt-at-spi package the rolenames are passed Orca with english strings (check boxes, push buttons, edit boxes, etc), so the screen reader output is a mixed partialy translated output with non english languages. A typical example is a check box, Non english language visual impaired user hear english role type (check box), and the label and state hear he's own language, I verified this with Skype. In Unity 2d the situation is similar. Non english language visual impaired user hear own language a rolename label, and hear the role type with english. In Launchpad.net the translation strings are not awailable for qt-at-spi package yet, I don't no upstream project already supporting the localization or not: https://translations.launchpad.net/ubuntu/precise/+source/qt-at-spi Have a chance to this problem are possible resolving before final Ubuntu 12.04 release, and translators have enough time making the translations for qt-at-spi package to both two environment visual impaired users hear equals rolename related informations, or this task will be happening next development release? If this task not fit the remaining Ubuntu 12.04 development cicle, future possible resolving this problem with an update with a maintenance release (12.04.1, 12.04.2, etc)? Attila From hammera at pickup.hu Mon Mar 12 16:52:01 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 17:52:01 +0100 Subject: Indicators related bugs Message-ID: <4F5E29B1.2020906@pickup.hu> Hy, I now reported in indicator-power package with following bug, please anybody confirm the status: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-power/+bug/953176 The power indicator have a silent menu item with Orca identifying with "panel" role name. If I press ENTER this menu item, energy statistics application launch correct. Some this menu item the first menu item the power indicator, some time the last. Interesting, but Orca not say position index this menu item when the speak child position check box is checked. Have a similar issue with indicator-sound package, but I not reported yet this problem. In Sound indicator have a silent menu item, before and after the Rhitmbox menu item. Need reporting this issue, or already reported this problem? In Indicators main menu not all indicators have main menu label (for example messages indicator have message label and right spokening Orca this label). Need reporting this issue? Possible fixing this issue and have chance translators translate new added main menu labels before Ubuntu 12.04 release? Following indicators main menu not have label: Keyboard, Network, perhaps power, time and date indicator. Attila From lucasradaelli at gmail.com Mon Mar 12 17:58:12 2012 From: lucasradaelli at gmail.com (Lucas Radaelli) Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 14:58:12 -0300 Subject: innaccessible installer on ubuntu 12.04? Message-ID: Hello, I have been working on a project, and we are doing some tests over ubuntu 12.04. I found a problem that I coudn't install it by myself using orca. What happenned with the accessible installer? Thank you. From vilmar at informal.com.br Mon Mar 12 18:04:24 2012 From: vilmar at informal.com.br (=?UTF-8?B?Sm9zw6kgVmlsbWFyIEVzdMOhY2lvIGRlIFNvdXph?=) Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 15:04:24 -0300 Subject: innaccessible installer on ubuntu 12.04? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4F5E3AA8.8070604@informal.com.br> Hi Lucas, last time I installed 12.04, the installer was completely accessible. Did you press ctrl+s when you heard the drum sound? On 03/12/2012 02:58 PM, Lucas Radaelli wrote: > Hello, > > I have been working on a project, and we are doing some tests over > ubuntu 12.04. I found a problem that I coudn't install it by myself > using orca. > > What happenned with the accessible installer? > > Thank you. > From cjk at teamcharliesangels.com Mon Mar 12 18:35:23 2012 From: cjk at teamcharliesangels.com (Charlie Kravetz) Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 12:35:23 -0600 Subject: innaccessible installer on ubuntu 12.04? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20120312123523.14bee1ba@teamcharliesangels.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Mon, 12 Mar 2012 14:58:12 -0300 Lucas Radaelli wrote: > Hello, > > I have been working on a project, and we are doing some tests over > ubuntu 12.04. I found a problem that I coudn't install it by myself > using orca. > > What happenned with the accessible installer? > > Thank you. > We have changed it. The correct procedure to start the accessible installer for Ubuntu Precise, which will become 12.04, is to insert the cd, and allow it to run. When you hear the sound of the drums, hit Ctrl+s. If you do not hear orca start in a minute or so, hit Ctrl+s again. After orca starts, you can use Alt+Tab to change from orca preferences to the installer. - -- Charlie Kravetz Linux Registered User Number 425914 [http://counter.li.org/] Never let anyone steal your DREAM. [http://keepingdreams.com] -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJPXkHrAAoJEFNEIRz9dxbAbd8H/RAxrh64FHAmOCNNRipElsUc WUhUHNDbERcpQf4moPYDFoudUvRZzBUHkm37oqdU4I+9twbjSUgTw2pq9vQly7Qn PVGVY2Lbutz6hjYrqzB2Vz5xFcg+TjUqUN8jmvPwWZ++ZVHicomudKR9p59f8xKW vkKwhYnEzoFYbp7DdK40B0vWBtLm9HE4IeGYV0LBTPqERQKrnuyNXLBzDcP95f8C hbmdiDT7MBr3U5giELX8IRpE+HBHCx3PuzhjDtcPCBDwjGHUTAc10lmHN31XjnHu or5hHq8zkVh1IdSgzAT5GeMx3vTyKF2NO++6A4GXqXGVp3nqzkYhX0RPLw3KyJw= =huy4 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From lucasradaelli at gmail.com Mon Mar 12 18:57:54 2012 From: lucasradaelli at gmail.com (Lucas Radaelli) Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 15:57:54 -0300 Subject: innaccessible installer on ubuntu 12.04? In-Reply-To: <20120312123523.14bee1ba@teamcharliesangels.com> References: <20120312123523.14bee1ba@teamcharliesangels.com> Message-ID: Thank you all. I have read on a blog post about this procedure for 11.04, and didn't know that it would work on 12.04 too. I was waiting for the drumms, but as I didn't hear anything (I am on a noise place), I thought the procedure changed. Thank you. 2012/3/12, Charlie Kravetz : > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > On Mon, 12 Mar 2012 14:58:12 -0300 > Lucas Radaelli wrote: > >> Hello, >> >> I have been working on a project, and we are doing some tests over >> ubuntu 12.04. I found a problem that I coudn't install it by myself >> using orca. >> >> What happenned with the accessible installer? >> >> Thank you. >> > > We have changed it. The correct procedure to start the accessible > installer for Ubuntu Precise, which will become 12.04, is to insert the > cd, and allow it to run. When you hear the sound of the drums, hit > Ctrl+s. If you do not hear orca start in a minute or so, hit Ctrl+s > again. After orca starts, you can use Alt+Tab to change from orca > preferences to the installer. > > - -- > Charlie Kravetz > Linux Registered User Number 425914 [http://counter.li.org/] > Never let anyone steal your DREAM. [http://keepingdreams.com] > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) > > iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJPXkHrAAoJEFNEIRz9dxbAbd8H/RAxrh64FHAmOCNNRipElsUc > WUhUHNDbERcpQf4moPYDFoudUvRZzBUHkm37oqdU4I+9twbjSUgTw2pq9vQly7Qn > PVGVY2Lbutz6hjYrqzB2Vz5xFcg+TjUqUN8jmvPwWZ++ZVHicomudKR9p59f8xKW > vkKwhYnEzoFYbp7DdK40B0vWBtLm9HE4IeGYV0LBTPqERQKrnuyNXLBzDcP95f8C > hbmdiDT7MBr3U5giELX8IRpE+HBHCx3PuzhjDtcPCBDwjGHUTAc10lmHN31XjnHu > or5hHq8zkVh1IdSgzAT5GeMx3vTyKF2NO++6A4GXqXGVp3nqzkYhX0RPLw3KyJw= > =huy4 > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility > From themuso at ubuntu.com Mon Mar 12 22:01:14 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2012 09:01:14 +1100 Subject: QT At-spi rolenames possible localizing before final Ubuntu 12.04 release? In-Reply-To: <4F5DC211.1060709@pickup.hu> References: <4F5DC211.1060709@pickup.hu> Message-ID: <20120312220114.GA5117@acapella> On Mon, Mar 12, 2012 at 08:29:53PM EST, Hammer Attila wrote: > Unfortunately with Ubuntu awailable qt-at-spi package the rolenames > are passed Orca with english strings (check boxes, push buttons, > edit boxes, etc), so the screen reader output is a mixed partialy > translated output with non english languages. > A typical example is a check box, Non english language visual > impaired user hear english role type (check box), and the label and > state hear he's own language, I verified this with Skype. > In Unity 2d the situation is similar. Non english language visual > impaired user hear own language a rolename label, and hear the role > type with english. This is the job of qt-at-spi to translate role names, and I don't think qt-at-spi has translated role names yet. Please consider working with the QT at-spi devs to get translatable role names working. Luke From alanbell at ubuntu.com Mon Mar 12 22:10:42 2012 From: alanbell at ubuntu.com (Alan Bell) Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 22:10:42 +0000 Subject: innaccessible installer on ubuntu 12.04? In-Reply-To: References: <20120312123523.14bee1ba@teamcharliesangels.com> Message-ID: <4F5E7462.20806@ubuntu.com> On 12/03/12 18:57, Lucas Radaelli wrote: > Thank you all. I have read on a blog post about this procedure for > 11.04, and didn't know that it would work on 12.04 too. I was waiting > for the drumms, but as I didn't hear anything (I am on a noise place), > I thought the procedure changed. > > Thank you. it has been noticed sometimes that the installer starts muted. I have seen this happen, but I can't reproduce it reliably. If anyone can figure out the circumstances that makes it start muted that would be very interesting. Alan. From chaltain at gmail.com Mon Mar 12 22:52:36 2012 From: chaltain at gmail.com (Christopher Chaltain) Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2012 17:52:36 -0500 Subject: innaccessible installer on ubuntu 12.04? In-Reply-To: <4F5E7462.20806@ubuntu.com> References: <20120312123523.14bee1ba@teamcharliesangels.com> <4F5E7462.20806@ubuntu.com> Message-ID: <4F5E7E34.3070000@gmail.com> On 12/03/12 17:10, Alan Bell wrote: > On 12/03/12 18:57, Lucas Radaelli wrote: >> Thank you all. I have read on a blog post about this procedure for >> 11.04, and didn't know that it would work on 12.04 too. I was waiting >> for the drumms, but as I didn't hear anything (I am on a noise place), >> I thought the procedure changed. >> > it has been noticed sometimes that the installer starts muted. I have > seen this happen, but I can't reproduce it reliably. If anyone can > figure out the circumstances that makes it start muted that would be > very interesting. I opened up the following bug for this situation: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/alsa-driver/+bug/927459 I know Luke as been taking a look at it, and I'm pretty sure he told me he's also been able to reproduce it. -- Christopher (CJ) chaltain at gmail.com From themuso at ubuntu.com Mon Mar 12 23:46:20 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2012 10:46:20 +1100 Subject: innaccessible installer on ubuntu 12.04? In-Reply-To: <4F5E7E34.3070000@gmail.com> References: <20120312123523.14bee1ba@teamcharliesangels.com> <4F5E7462.20806@ubuntu.com> <4F5E7E34.3070000@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20120312234620.GA3478@acapella> On Tue, Mar 13, 2012 at 09:52:36AM EST, Christopher Chaltain wrote: > I opened up the following bug for this situation: > https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/alsa-driver/+bug/927459 > > I know Luke as been taking a look at it, and I'm pretty sure he told me > he's also been able to reproduce it. Yes thats correct, its specific to the emulated sound card hardware in VMWare. Luke From hammera at pickup.hu Tue Mar 13 06:42:49 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2012 07:42:49 +0100 Subject: QT At-spi rolenames possible localizing before final Ubuntu 12.04 release? In-Reply-To: <20120312220114.GA5117@acapella> References: <4F5DC211.1060709@pickup.hu> <20120312220114.GA5117@acapella> Message-ID: <4F5EEC69.20508@pickup.hu> Hy Luke, If I see right, in qt-at-spi source the src directory need marking translation the role names in src/constant_mappings.cpp file. Look some lines: qSpiRoleMapping.insert(QAccessible::NoRole, RoleNames(ATSPI_ROLE_INVALID, "invalid", QObject::tr("invalid role"))); qSpiRoleMapping.insert(QAccessible::TitleBar, RoleNames(ATSPI_ROLE_TEXT, "text", QObject::tr("title bar"))); qSpiRoleMapping.insert(QAccessible::MenuBar, RoleNames(ATSPI_ROLE_MENU_BAR, "menu bar", QObject::tr("menu bar"))); qSpiRoleMapping.insert(QAccessible::ScrollBar, RoleNames(ATSPI_ROLE_SCROLL_BAR, "scroll bar", QObject::tr("scroll bar"))); For example, look the menu bar related two strings: "menu bar", QObject::tr("menu bar" Need marking the first or the second string for translation? Unfortunately I not have experiences with C code localizing, usual I working more with Python. Attila From hammera at pickup.hu Tue Mar 13 08:22:39 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2012 09:22:39 +0100 Subject: Possible some time gsettings-data-convert doing mistake with keybinding preferences? Message-ID: <4F5F03CF.2000305@pickup.hu> Hy, Not often, but some time my Precise system forgot usual keybindings preferences. This situation usual GNOME Panel is crashed with following error, with already reported: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/851532 After this crash happening, impossible using general keybindings (ALT+F1, ALT+F2, ALT+TAB, ALT+F4, etc). I see an interesting error message when I try resetting this general keybindings in GNOME Control Center Keyboard preference tool in the keybindings page. I run simple gnome-control-center keyboard command, and see following error message: Gconf Error. Type mismatch. Waiting value: string, list coming from following key: /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_workspace_left) Have lot of other Metacity related keybindings with producing similar error. I possible not full right translated english the error message. Before GNOME Panel not crash my system, not existed the .gconf/apps/metacity folder. Already reported this issue? Some time when I delete entire this folder, next restart the directory again creating, and the problem begin again. This situation need entire remove the .gconf folder and the .config/dconf/user file. In the /usr/share/GConf/gsettings/wm-schemas.convert file have following Metacity Keybindings related conversions: # From org.gnome.desktop.wm.keybindings [org.gnome.desktop.wm.keybindings] switch-to-workspace-1 = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch-to-workspace-1 switch-to-workspace-2 = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch-to-workspace-2 switch-to-workspace-3 = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch-to-workspace-3 switch-to-workspace-4 = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch-to-workspace-4 switch-to-workspace-5 = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch-to-workspace-5 switch-to-workspace-6 = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch-to-workspace-6 switch-to-workspace-7 = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch-to-workspace-7 switch-to-workspace-8 = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch-to-workspace-8 switch-to-workspace-9 = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch-to-workspace-9 switch-to-workspace-10 = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch-to-workspace-10 switch-to-workspace-11 = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch-to-workspace-11 switch-to-workspace-12 = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch-to-workspace-12 switch-to-workspace-left = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_to_workspace_left switch-to-workspace-right = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_to_workspace_right switch-to-workspace-up = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_to_workspace_up switch-to-workspace-down = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_to_workspace_down switch-group = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_group switch-group-backward = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_group_backward switch-windows = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_windows switch-windows-backward = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_windows_backward switch-panels = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_panels switch-panels-backward = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_panels_backward cycle-group = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/cycle_group cycle-group-backward = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/cycle_group_backward cycle-windows = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/cycle_windows cycle-windows-backward = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/cycle_windows_backward cycle-panels = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/cycle_panels cycle-panels-backward = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/cycle_panels_backward show-desktop = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/show_desktop panel-main-menu = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/panel_main_menu panel-run-dialog = /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/panel_run_dialog set-spew-mark = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/set_spew_mark activate-window-menu = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/activate_window_menu toggle-fullscreen = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/toggle_fullscreen toggle-maximized = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/toggle_maximized toggle-above = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/toggle_above maximize = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/maximize unmaximize = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/unmaximize toggle-shaded = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/toggle_shaded minimize = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/minimize close = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/close begin-move = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/begin_move begin-resize = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/begin_resize toggle-on-all-workspaces = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/toggle_on_all_workspaces move-to-workspace-1 = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move-to-workspace-1 move-to-workspace-2 = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move-to-workspace-2 move-to-workspace-3 = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move-to-workspace-3 move-to-workspace-4 = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move-to-workspace-4 move-to-workspace-5 = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move-to-workspace-5 move-to-workspace-6 = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move-to-workspace-6 move-to-workspace-7 = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move-to-workspace-7 move-to-workspace-8 = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move-to-workspace-8 move-to-workspace-9 = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move-to-workspace-9 move-to-workspace-10 = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move-to-workspace-10 move-to-workspace-11 = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move-to-workspace-11 move-to-workspace-12 = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move-to-workspace-12 move-to-workspace-left = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_workspace_left move-to-workspace-right = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_workspace_right move-to-workspace-up = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_workspace_up move-to-workspace-down = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_workspace_down raise-or-lower = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/raise_or_lower raise = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/raise lower = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/lower maximize-vertically = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/maximize_vertically maximize-horizontally = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/maximize_horizontally move-to-corner-nw = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_corner_nw move-to-corner-ne = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_corner_ne move-to-corner-sw = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_corner_sw move-to-corner-se = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_corner_se move-to-side-n = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_side_n move-to-side-s = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_side_s move-to-side-e = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_side_e move-to-side-w = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_side_w move-to-center = /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_center I attaching the buggy created metacity folder with containing the converted .gconf style keybindings. Showing any errors the files? Attila -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: metacity.tar.gz Type: application/x-gzip Size: 1362 bytes Desc: not available URL: From hammera at pickup.hu Tue Mar 13 09:04:36 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2012 10:04:36 +0100 Subject: Possible some time gsettings-data-convert doing mistake with keybinding preferences? In-Reply-To: <4F5F03CF.2000305@pickup.hu> References: <4F5F03CF.2000305@pickup.hu> Message-ID: <4F5F0DA4.6000504@pickup.hu> Hy, I switch english language, and look the error messages when I run gnome-control-center keyboard command after I put back the buggy created .gconf/apps/metacity folder: GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_workspace_left GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_workspace_right GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_workspace_up GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_workspace_down GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_windows GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_group GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_panels GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/cycle_windows GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/cycle_group GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/cycle_panels GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/show_desktop GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_to_workspace_left GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_to_workspace_right GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_to_workspace_up GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_to_workspace_down GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/panel_run_dialog GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/panel_main_menu GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/activate_window_menu GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/toggle_fullscreen GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/toggle_maximized GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/maximize GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/unmaximize GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/toggle_shaded GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/close GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/minimize GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/begin_move GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/begin_resize GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/toggle_on_all_workspaces GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/raise_or_lower GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/raise GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/lower GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/maximize_vertically GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/maximize_horizontally Attila From ka1cey at gmail.com Tue Mar 13 17:12:30 2012 From: ka1cey at gmail.com (Dave Hunt) Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2012 13:12:30 -0400 Subject: Accessibility Meta-package or pp? Message-ID: <4F5F7FFE.4040208@gmail.com> Hi, Is there a single package or ppa containing the accessibility for Ubuntu 12.04? This would be handy for derivative distros, like Trisquel, to be sure their accessibility is the latest and complete. My question is prompted by an experience with the Trisquel 5.5 beta, in which orca was present, but without libgail-3. The lack of this library caused many objects, known to be accessible with orca, not to work properly. I added all things libgail-3 from the repositories, and my system is as accessible as any Ubuntu 11.10, running orca, and using Gnome Classic desktop. Just a thought, Dave Hunt From samuel.thibault at ens-lyon.org Tue Mar 13 17:23:40 2012 From: samuel.thibault at ens-lyon.org (Samuel Thibault) Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2012 18:23:40 +0100 Subject: Accessibility Meta-package or pp? In-Reply-To: <4F5F7FFE.4040208@gmail.com> References: <4F5F7FFE.4040208@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20120313172340.GI4466@type.bordeaux.inria.fr> Dave Hunt, le Tue 13 Mar 2012 13:12:30 -0400, a écrit : > Is there a single package or ppa containing the accessibility for Ubuntu > 12.04? This would be handy for derivative distros, like Trisquel, to be > sure their accessibility is the latest and complete. My question is > prompted by an experience with the Trisquel 5.5 beta, in which orca was > present, but without libgail-3. The lack of this library caused many > objects, known to be accessible with orca, not to work properly. I added > all things libgail-3 from the repositories, and my system is as accessible > as any Ubuntu 11.10, running orca, and using Gnome Classic desktop. Ideally gnome should just always depend on it, so that all desktops are accessible already without having to add anything else. Samuel From guyster104 at att.net Tue Mar 13 21:08:17 2012 From: guyster104 at att.net (Guy Schlosser) Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2012 17:08:17 -0400 Subject: ubuntu 12.04 and alt+tab In-Reply-To: <4F5A9761.8040804@informal.com.br> References: <4F5903E8.1030403@informal.com.br> <20120308213200.GA4067@acapella> <4F595642.6060001@att.net> <4F59586F.3090801@informal.com.br> <4F5960DE.3020702@att.net> <20120309021143.GA3570@acapella> <4F5A9084.9020108@att.net> <4F5A9761.8040804@informal.com.br> Message-ID: <4F5FB741.3030201@att.net> Hi all, is there any way to check key bindings in Unity-2d? The reason for my asking, is that I have suspition as to whether alt+tab, alt+f4 and alt+space are even bound to any actions in the 2d environment. I have tested other environments under Ubuntu 12.04, including Unity-3d, gnome-shell, and gnome fallback, and all three of the keystrokes I mentioned work as they're supposed to. I dist-upgraded my system a half hour ago, and still can't use any of those three keystrokes in Unity-2d. Any help or info would be greatly appreciated. As always, thanks much in advance. Guy From vilmar at informal.com.br Tue Mar 13 21:22:45 2012 From: vilmar at informal.com.br (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jos=E9_Vilmar_Est=E1cio_de_Souza?=) Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2012 18:22:45 -0300 Subject: ubuntu 12.04 and alt+tab In-Reply-To: <4F5FB741.3030201@att.net> References: <4F5903E8.1030403@informal.com.br> <20120308213200.GA4067@acapella> <4F595642.6060001@att.net> <4F59586F.3090801@informal.com.br> <4F5960DE.3020702@att.net> <20120309021143.GA3570@acapella> <4F5A9084.9020108@att.net> <4F5A9761.8040804@informal.com.br> <4F5FB741.3030201@att.net> Message-ID: <4F5FBAA5.4080502@informal.com.br> Hi, I don't have an answer, but can you test something please? 1. Launch terminal. 2. Press the alt key, only the alt key. What happens? In my environment orca reads shell filler. Thanks. On 03/13/2012 06:08 PM, Guy Schlosser wrote: > Hi all, is there any way to check key bindings in Unity-2d? The reason > for my asking, is that I have suspition as to whether alt+tab, alt+f4 > and alt+space are even bound to any actions in the 2d environment. I > have tested other environments under Ubuntu 12.04, including Unity-3d, > gnome-shell, and gnome fallback, and all three of the keystrokes I > mentioned work as they're supposed to. I dist-upgraded my system a half > hour ago, and still can't use any of those three keystrokes in Unity-2d. > Any help or info would be greatly appreciated. As always, thanks much in > advance. > > > Guy > > From alanbell at ubuntu.com Tue Mar 13 21:34:59 2012 From: alanbell at ubuntu.com (Alan Bell) Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2012 21:34:59 +0000 Subject: ubuntu 12.04 and alt+tab In-Reply-To: <4F5FBAA5.4080502@informal.com.br> References: <4F5903E8.1030403@informal.com.br> <20120308213200.GA4067@acapella> <4F595642.6060001@att.net> <4F59586F.3090801@informal.com.br> <4F5960DE.3020702@att.net> <20120309021143.GA3570@acapella> <4F5A9084.9020108@att.net> <4F5A9761.8040804@informal.com.br> <4F5FB741.3030201@att.net> <4F5FBAA5.4080502@informal.com.br> Message-ID: <4F5FBD83.40200@ubuntu.com> On 13/03/12 21:22, José Vilmar Estácio de Souza wrote: > Hi, I don't have an answer, but can you test something please? > 1. Launch terminal. > 2. Press the alt key, only the alt key. > > What happens? > In my environment orca reads shell filler. > Thanks. > I think this is because it has opened the HUD which is a thing a bit like the dash visually, it is a search box that searches through the menu of the current application. It is not correctly accessible at the moment which is a shame, it consists of a field and 5 suggestions below of what you might mean. For example if you have focus in gedit you can hit alt and type "insert" and the top option in the list of 5 will be "edit > insert date and time". It does some fuzzy matching and guesswork to come up with the suggestions. Last time I tested it read out all 5 suggestions in unity2d as "push button" and was silent in unity3d which is sub-optimal. this is bug 949445 https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-appmenu/+bug/949445 and I am sure that Ted and Gord will be right on to this soon Alan. -- The Open Learning Centre is rebranding, find out about our new name and look at http://libertus.co.uk From guyster104 at att.net Tue Mar 13 21:36:43 2012 From: guyster104 at att.net (Guy Schlosser) Date: Tue, 13 Mar 2012 17:36:43 -0400 Subject: ubuntu 12.04 and alt+tab In-Reply-To: <4F5FBAA5.4080502@informal.com.br> References: <4F5903E8.1030403@informal.com.br> <20120308213200.GA4067@acapella> <4F595642.6060001@att.net> <4F59586F.3090801@informal.com.br> <4F5960DE.3020702@att.net> <20120309021143.GA3570@acapella> <4F5A9084.9020108@att.net> <4F5A9761.8040804@informal.com.br> <4F5FB741.3030201@att.net> <4F5FBAA5.4080502@informal.com.br> Message-ID: <4F5FBDEB.7060008@att.net> Hi Jose, same behavior on my machine. Pressing alt by itself, now brings up the HUD (Head Up Display), which is not yet accessible. If you want the menu bar of terminal or any other app, press alt+f10. As for my suspition about key bindings, I'm thinking I'm right. I launched the keyboard applet under system settings, went to the shortcuts tab, and set up alt+f4 as a shortcut for close window, then alt+tab as a shortcut for switch applications, and both are now working as expected. Did someone forget to bind them by default in Unity 2d? Just my curiosity, and I hope this helps. Later, Guy From themuso at ubuntu.com Tue Mar 13 23:52:10 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2012 10:52:10 +1100 Subject: ubuntu 12.04 and alt+tab In-Reply-To: <4F5FBD83.40200@ubuntu.com> References: <20120308213200.GA4067@acapella> <4F595642.6060001@att.net> <4F59586F.3090801@informal.com.br> <4F5960DE.3020702@att.net> <20120309021143.GA3570@acapella> <4F5A9084.9020108@att.net> <4F5A9761.8040804@informal.com.br> <4F5FB741.3030201@att.net> <4F5FBAA5.4080502@informal.com.br> <4F5FBD83.40200@ubuntu.com> Message-ID: <20120313235210.GA3341@acapella> On Wed, Mar 14, 2012 at 08:34:59AM EST, Alan Bell wrote: > Last time I tested it read out all 5 suggestions in unity2d as "push > button" and was silent in unity3d which is sub-optimal. > this is bug 949445 > https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-appmenu/+bug/949445 Its likely to be easier to fix in unity-2d than it will be for Unity 3D. I hope to find time to try and address the Unity 2D side, but my knowledge of QML is currently limited. Luke From themuso at ubuntu.com Tue Mar 13 23:57:28 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Wed, 14 Mar 2012 10:57:28 +1100 Subject: ubuntu 12.04 and alt+tab In-Reply-To: <4F5FBDEB.7060008@att.net> References: <20120308213200.GA4067@acapella> <4F595642.6060001@att.net> <4F59586F.3090801@informal.com.br> <4F5960DE.3020702@att.net> <20120309021143.GA3570@acapella> <4F5A9084.9020108@att.net> <4F5A9761.8040804@informal.com.br> <4F5FB741.3030201@att.net> <4F5FBAA5.4080502@informal.com.br> <4F5FBDEB.7060008@att.net> Message-ID: <20120313235728.GB3341@acapella> On Wed, Mar 14, 2012 at 08:36:43AM EST, Guy Schlosser wrote: > Hi Jose, same behavior on my machine. Pressing alt by itself, now > brings up the HUD (Head Up Display), which is not yet accessible. > If you want the menu bar of terminal or any other app, press > alt+f10. As for my suspition about key bindings, I'm thinking I'm > right. I launched the keyboard applet under system settings, went > to the shortcuts tab, and set up alt+f4 as a shortcut for close > window, then alt+tab as a shortcut for switch applications, and both > are now working as expected. Did someone forget to bind them by > default in Unity 2d? Just my curiosity, and I hope this helps. They are indeed bound by default, but something must have messed them up in your settings somehow. Luke From hammera at pickup.hu Thu Mar 15 09:16:01 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2012 10:16:01 +0100 Subject: Accessible Login in 12.04? In-Reply-To: <4F54107E.1080709@informal.com.br> References: <4F54005B.3010209@gmail.com> <4F540D76.3080803@gmail.com> <4F54107E.1080709@informal.com.br> Message-ID: <4F61B351.3020606@pickup.hu> Hy, I see happened an upgrade with Casper package, to migrate LightDm a11y settings with GSettings, because Unity Greeter using GSettings. When I try use an installed system in terminal the sudo -u lightdm gsettings set com.canonical.unity-greeter screen-reader false command, I get following error: hammera at hammera-Satellite-L300:~$ sudo -u lightdm gsettings set com.canonical.unity-greeter screen-reader false ** WARNING **: Command line `dbus-launch --autolaunch=57457bea3de3d18c6e5b50340000000d --binary-syntax --close-stderr' exited with non-zero exit status 1: No protocol specified\nNo protocol specified\nAutolaunch error: X11 initialization failed.\n ** WARNING **: Command line `dbus-launch --autolaunch=57457bea3de3d18c6e5b50340000000d --binary-syntax --close-stderr' exited with non-zero exit status 1: No protocol specified\nNo protocol specified\nAutolaunch error: X11 initialization failed.\n hammera at hammera-Satellite-L300:~$ Look what the result if I run sudo -u lightdm gsettings get com.canonical.unity-greeter screen-reader command: hammera at hammera-Satellite-L300:~$ sudo -u lightdm gsettings get com.canonical.unity-greeter screen-reader false During installation this GSettings key with LightDm are setting properly? How can possible enable an installed Ubuntu 12.04 system the screen reader support in login screen if this error is present? Temporary need sighted assistance? Alan, when you tested the accessible login with screen reader when you reported the proper bug, how can enabled this function? Attila From hammera at pickup.hu Thu Mar 15 10:47:24 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2012 11:47:24 +0100 Subject: Possible some time gsettings-data-convert doing mistake with keybinding preferences? In-Reply-To: <4F5F0DA4.6000504@pickup.hu> References: <4F5F03CF.2000305@pickup.hu> <4F5F0DA4.6000504@pickup.hu> Message-ID: <4F61C8BC.1080102@pickup.hu> Hy, Because I haven't got other ydea some time why stored invalid keybinding settings in .gconf/apps/metacity folder, I reported the prewious wrote problem with Metacity related: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/metacity/+bug/955876 If anybody known the right component, please change the report. For example now again forgotted Metacity the general keybindings, and the described error is present. I again removed the .gconf/apps/metacity folder, and next restart keybindings works again. Attila From terryjones130 at msn.com Thu Mar 15 18:02:57 2012 From: terryjones130 at msn.com (Terry Jones) Date: Thu, 15 Mar 2012 13:02:57 -0500 Subject: No subject Message-ID: http://pere.xprecords.net/themes/bartik/templates/eyt.html Terry Jones terryjones130 at msn.com Veronica McKinney 3/15/2012 7:02:51 PM -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From themuso at ubuntu.com Fri Mar 16 02:14:25 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 13:14:25 +1100 Subject: Accessible Login in 12.04? In-Reply-To: <4F61B351.3020606@pickup.hu> References: <4F54005B.3010209@gmail.com> <4F540D76.3080803@gmail.com> <4F54107E.1080709@informal.com.br> <4F61B351.3020606@pickup.hu> Message-ID: <20120316021425.GD4550@acapella> On Thu, Mar 15, 2012 at 08:16:01PM EST, Hammer Attila wrote: > Hy, > > I see happened an upgrade with Casper package, to migrate LightDm > a11y settings with GSettings, because Unity Greeter using GSettings. > > When I try use an installed system in terminal the sudo -u lightdm > gsettings set com.canonical.unity-greeter screen-reader false > command, I get following error: > hammera at hammera-Satellite-L300:~$ sudo -u lightdm gsettings set > com.canonical.unity-greeter screen-reader false > > ** WARNING **: Command line `dbus-launch > --autolaunch=57457bea3de3d18c6e5b50340000000d --binary-syntax > --close-stderr' exited with non-zero exit status 1: No protocol > specified\nNo protocol specified\nAutolaunch error: X11 > initialization failed.\n > > ** WARNING **: Command line `dbus-launch > --autolaunch=57457bea3de3d18c6e5b50340000000d --binary-syntax > --close-stderr' exited with non-zero exit status 1: No protocol > specified\nNo protocol specified\nAutolaunch error: X11 > initialization failed.\n > hammera at hammera-Satellite-L300:~$ The reason why that doesn't work is due to the way gsettings works. Gsettings supports multiple backend data storage formats, one of which is dconf. Dconf is the default data storage format, which is a database stored at the system/user level. When gsettings wants to use dconf, it communicates via dbus to a dconf service process that runs as the user. This dconf service process makes the requested changes. So the above doesn't work, because there is no dconf service running as the lightdm user when you are logged into the system as another user. > Look what the result if I run sudo -u lightdm gsettings get > com.canonical.unity-greeter screen-reader command: > hammera at hammera-Satellite-L300:~$ sudo -u lightdm gsettings get > com.canonical.unity-greeter screen-reader > false I have seen this myself. I suspect either there is some caching going on somewhere, or the gsettings dconf backend can read the database itself, but cannot write. > During installation this GSettings key with LightDm are setting properly? Yes, when the screen reader profile is enabled, this key now gets set. That was one of the changes in the updated casper package. > How can possible enable an installed Ubuntu 12.04 system the screen > reader support in login screen if this error is present? Temporary > need sighted assistance? Control + S should work in the unity-greeter, however there are some weird focus issues when unity-greeter first loads, which for some reason prevent control + S from working. If you tab to the session selection box, and shift-tab back to the password prompt or login button, and then press Control + S, Orca should load. When you press Control + S, the screen reader will be active for every subsequent use of unity-greeter, until its turned off again. Luke From themuso at ubuntu.com Fri Mar 16 02:23:29 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 13:23:29 +1100 Subject: RFC, disable the HUD for accessible installs. Message-ID: <20120316022329.GE4550@acapella> Hi all, With all the discussion recently about the hud, and how its not accessible, I've been looking at the hud code for Unity 2D, investigating why its not accessible. It turns out that the Unity 2D devs did indeed do their part in making sure the hud is accessible as possible, however the results, whilst being indicated as buttons, do not have any text spoken. This is because the Unity 2D devs decided to use a text string different to what visually gets shown, for various reasons. The problem is, that this text string coming from the hud service process is currently always an empty string. Setting about working out an alternative, I realized that at this late stage of precise development, this could not be properly solved without getting a fair number of exceptions in the form of feature freeze exceptions, UI freeze exceptions, as well as getting strings translated. In addition, I have not yet been able to come up with a way to audibly indicate hud search results. Sure I have an idea, but I am not sure if there should be more detail. So at this point, I think we'd be better off disabling the hud for screen reader installs, due to the above. I.e, since we don't have time to work out an audible representation of hud results, and get it implemented and tested, I think disabling the hud is a better course of action. I'd rather have the hud available when its fully accessible with results that Orca users can understand, than have a half-baked accessible implementation that could confuse users. I will start a discussion about how we could best represent hud results in another thread. Luke From hammera at pickup.hu Fri Mar 16 06:55:45 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 07:55:45 +0100 Subject: Accessible Login in 12.04? In-Reply-To: <20120316021425.GD4550@acapella> References: <4F54005B.3010209@gmail.com> <4F540D76.3080803@gmail.com> <4F54107E.1080709@informal.com.br> <4F61B351.3020606@pickup.hu> <20120316021425.GD4550@acapella> Message-ID: <4F62E3F1.3050100@pickup.hu> Hy Luke, CTRL+S works correct, thank you the answer. I have got some question and experiences, sorri if my questions is trivial, but I now using first LightDM with accessible login feature. 1. How can possible choosing different user? If I press arrow keys, usual hear give my username password, or hear a button. Or this function is not full accessible yet? Need enabling a GDM style user list in LightDm configuration? Possible doing this? Oldest time in GDM login screen all awailable users present default a list, with possible choose required user to log in. If pressed ENTER key the selected user, possible write password, and switch session. 2. If I try using flat review in the Unity greeter, I think Orca is freezing. I unable to debug Orca level this situation yet. Possible changing local Orca execution command to generate Orca a debug.out file, or this is already known issue? 3. If I activate indicator menu in Unity greeter with F10 key, choosing some menu items and press ESCAPE key, the menue is doesn't leave, or Orca not refresh the screen content. My braille display this is absolute presenting. 4. What the difference with Unity Greeter and LightDm gtk greeter? LightDm Gtk greeter is possible using, this greeter more accessible? Attila From vilmar at informal.com.br Fri Mar 16 20:03:45 2012 From: vilmar at informal.com.br (=?UTF-8?B?Sm9zw6kgVmlsbWFyIEVzdMOhY2lvIGRlIFNvdXph?=) Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 17:03:45 -0300 Subject: any chance of an accessible login on 11.10? Message-ID: <4F639CA1.7070000@informal.com.br> Hi all. Is there something that I can do to obtain an accessible login in ubuntu 11.10? Sometimes I need a sighted assistance to login my machine. Thanks. From chaltain at gmail.com Fri Mar 16 23:24:59 2012 From: chaltain at gmail.com (Christopher Chaltain) Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 18:24:59 -0500 Subject: any chance of an accessible login on 11.10? In-Reply-To: <4F639CA1.7070000@informal.com.br> References: <4F639CA1.7070000@informal.com.br> Message-ID: <4F63CBCB.6000505@gmail.com> Just going from memory, I know I've seen instructions on installing GDM and using it in place of LightDB. I haven't done it myself, but maybe you can find those instructions. I'm sure they were either on this list, the Orca list or the Vinux support list. On 16/03/12 15:03, José Vilmar Estácio de Souza wrote: > Hi all. > Is there something that I can do to obtain an accessible login in ubuntu > 11.10? Sometimes I need a sighted assistance to login my machine. > Thanks. > -- Christopher (CJ) chaltain at gmail.com From hammera at pickup.hu Wed Mar 21 05:35:01 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2012 06:35:01 +0100 Subject: An importanter GTK3 menues related bug In-Reply-To: <20120308213726.GB4067@acapella> References: <4F5859DE.6020609@pickup.hu> <20120308213726.GB4067@acapella> Message-ID: <4F696885.3090205@pickup.hu> Hy Luke, You remember, I wrote following bugreport with main menu focus issues related: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=654410 If an user pressed F10 key, Orca don't spokened the first main menue. I installed now all awailable updates my Ubuntu 12.04 system, GTK3 components are upgraded with 3.3.20 version. The surprise happened me after I restart my system: menues right speaking in all applications (Gedit, Terminal, etc). Very thank you the bug fix. What components happened a fix this error related? The fix awailable with upstream too? I ask this, because the linked bugreport not happened status change. Attila From hammera at pickup.hu Wed Mar 21 09:37:18 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2012 10:37:18 +0100 Subject: Indicators related bugs In-Reply-To: <4F5E29B1.2020906@pickup.hu> References: <4F5E29B1.2020906@pickup.hu> Message-ID: <4F69A14E.6070203@pickup.hu> Hy, I reported two other indicators related bugs: 1. In user menu after guest session menu item have a silent menu item with Orca not possible identifying: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/indicator-session/+bug/960999 2. Default network indicator main menu not have label or accessible description, Orca only spokening "menu" role name: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/960200 I attached a video in the last bug with I created the recordmydesktop application, to demonstrate the bug and prowide possibility developers to compare visual output and screen reader produced output. Now I will be make the indicator-session related video. Attila From hammera at pickup.hu Wed Mar 21 15:17:06 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2012 16:17:06 +0100 Subject: Some indicator menues and menu items now not have mnemonic letters Message-ID: <4F69F0F2.2030900@pickup.hu> Hy, Now, some indicator main menues and menu items not have mnemonic letters, but mnemonic letters some time fasting the navigation with screen reader and keyboard with visual impaired users. Some examples the future advantages: If future have a mnemonic key for example the messages indicator main menu (need doing this with indicator-messages package), not need pressing two right arrow and one left arrow to activate the messages indicator and access the menu items. An another example is the sound indicator. Now need pressing I think five right arrow to access this indicator. Future this is not need, if have mnemonic letter the sound indicator main menu (need doing this in indicator-sound package). Look the actual state: A typical example is in indicator-session package the device menu and user menu. In the device menu all menu items not have mnemonic letters (system settings, displays, startup applications, lock screen, suspend, restart, shutdown, etc). In the network indicator all menu items have mnemonic letters, except disconnect and edit connections menu items. Of course the awailable hotspots full acceptable why not have mnemonic letters. I looked possible associate this menu items with mnemonic letters with translation side, usual yes. If the translated string containing _ simbol, after the underscore character have letter will be the mnemonic letter of the proper menu item. This is a temporary workaround to non english language translators if want possible associate mnemonic letters with importanter menu items of the indicators, but future better doing this task with general in source level. I have got a question: I very would like working this task to prowide better and easyest keyboard access of indicators. If I doing general patches with the required source packages, have chance to land this change before final release the proper packages? Or better scheduling this task general with next development cicle, because now already have UI freeze, near beta2 and final release, etc? Have advantage to schedule this task with next development cicle, this change not risk already full translated indicators localized outputs before final release with more languages. If need changing more strings in indicator source packages, translators possible not have enough time to verify the changed strings, doing the translation corrections before final release. I doed a fast calculation. Need changing first impression with 30 strings, but this is an estimated value, because I only possible lookup my system the awailable indicators. Attila From terryjones130 at msn.com Wed Mar 21 16:37:48 2012 From: terryjones130 at msn.com (Terry Jones) Date: Wed, 21 Mar 2012 11:37:48 -0500 Subject: No subject Message-ID: http://uxerdesign.com/wp-content/themes/uxer2/av1.php Terry Jones terryjones130 at msn.com Veronica McKinney 3/21/2012 9:37:37 AM "The graveyards are full of indispensable men." Charles de Gaulle -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From themuso at ubuntu.com Wed Mar 21 21:51:57 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 08:51:57 +1100 Subject: An importanter GTK3 menues related bug In-Reply-To: <4F696885.3090205@pickup.hu> References: <4F5859DE.6020609@pickup.hu> <20120308213726.GB4067@acapella> <4F696885.3090205@pickup.hu> Message-ID: <20120321215157.GA4627@acapella> On Wed, Mar 21, 2012 at 04:35:01PM EST, Hammer Attila wrote: > Hy Luke, > > You remember, I wrote following bugreport with main menu focus > issues related: > https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=654410 > If an user pressed F10 key, Orca don't spokened the first main menue. > I installed now all awailable updates my Ubuntu 12.04 system, GTK3 > components are upgraded with 3.3.20 version. The surprise happened > me after I restart my system: menues right speaking in all > applications (Gedit, Terminal, etc). > Very thank you the bug fix. What components happened a fix this > error related? The fix awailable with upstream too? > I ask this, because the linked bugreport not happened status change. I am pretty sure something was done upstrea to work around, if not fix this issue. You'd be better off asking GNOME devs as to what has changed to allow this to work again, it certainly was nothing to do with me. Luke From ka1cey at gmail.com Fri Mar 23 03:47:58 2012 From: ka1cey at gmail.com (Dave Hunt) Date: Thu, 22 Mar 2012 23:47:58 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Latest orca for 11.10 and its accessibility stack? Message-ID: Hi, I'm running the Trisquel 5.5 beta, which is derived from Ubuntu 11.10, and orca 3.3.4, which I built from the stable sources. I think I can go later, but how much? Thanks, Dave From hammera at pickup.hu Sat Mar 24 08:39:45 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2012 09:39:45 +0100 Subject: If com.canonical.indicator.datetime show-calendar key value is true, keyboard focus grab when the caret lands the Date indicator second menu item Message-ID: <4F6D8851.1070000@pickup.hu> Hy, Hopefuly following information not too later sharing: If the com.canonical.indicator.datetime show-calendar value is true, after the caret lands in the Date indicator second unlabelled menu item, keyboard focus is grabbed. I don't no visualy the caret moving up or not, but Orca keyboard commands entire locked until I not clicking flat review for example a separator, or not clicking braille display the first cursor routing cell to resume indicator menus. Reproducation steps: 1. Present indicators, and move the date time indicator. 2. Pull down the indicator menu, and move arrow keys. After you hear a silent menu item (factory configuration settings this is the second awailable menu item), Orca keyboard commands are not work, not possible to switch another window, etc. If I run gsettings set com.canonical.indicator.datetime show-calendar false command, all awailable date indicator menu items are accessible with keyboard, and Orca wonderful spokening all awailable menu items. Default the date and time indicator two awailable accessible menu items presenting, actual date, time and date settings menu items. The true value is the default value the showing calendar setting, but this menu item now not have an accessible label or description. Luke, your openion what the better way fix in Precise? 1. Report this problem temporary with Casper package, and making a patch to setting the wrote value with false in blindness profiles? Unfortunately calendar menu item we not showing now important informations, because if screen reader users browsing for example the screen with Orca flat review commands, Orca spokening only "menu item" text the calendar related menu item. This modification temporary hide this keyboard focus grabbing related problem, and date time indicator will be full usable with screen reader. 2. Report this problem with indicator-datetime package, and associate accessible description the required informations the calendar related menu item? For example, a default Ubuntu screen reader installation what the purpose this calendar menu item? Possible associate events, meetings if any user using this now inaccessible menu item? Attila From hammera at pickup.hu Sat Mar 24 08:43:04 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Sat, 24 Mar 2012 09:43:04 +0100 Subject: If com.canonical.indicator.datetime show-calendar key value is true, keyboard focus grab when the caret lands the Date indicator second menu item In-Reply-To: <4F6D8851.1070000@pickup.hu> References: <4F6D8851.1070000@pickup.hu> Message-ID: <4F6D8918.5070502@pickup.hu> Hy, Sorry, but I forgot wrote: I experienced this keyboard focus grabbing related issue Under GNOME3 fallback session, I using Indicators presenting with indicator-applet-complete package. Attila From hackingkk at gmail.com Fri Mar 23 14:33:01 2012 From: hackingkk at gmail.com (hackingKK) Date: Fri, 23 Mar 2012 20:03:01 +0530 Subject: [orca-list] Latest orca for 11.10 and its accessibility stack? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4F6C899D.9070408@gmail.com> Hi Dave, On 23/03/12 09:17, Dave Hunt wrote: > Hi, > > I'm running the Trisquel 5.5 beta, which is derived from Ubuntu 11.10, > and orca 3.3.4, which I built from the stable sources. I think I can > go later, but how much? > What are the differences between Trisquel and Ubuntu? And When was the said version of Orca released? Can we go uptill 3.5 X? Happy hacking. Krishnakant. From guyster104 at att.net Sun Mar 25 22:35:20 2012 From: guyster104 at att.net (Guy Schlosser) Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2012 18:35:20 -0400 Subject: [orca-list] Problems with Orca and pidgin...seems to be an at-spi2-core issue In-Reply-To: <4F6F7251.1000806@infosprinter.com> References: <4F6F7251.1000806@infosprinter.com> Message-ID: <4F6F9DA8.9000104@att.net> Hi Jakob, yes, I can confirm the issue with pidgin as far as speech goes. Whenever I press enter after typing in a message, orca does not read it. The other thing I've noticed, is that some times I cannot see new messages from others, until I've already started typing again. I am however, happy to see the other accessibility bugs worked out. Hud is working in Unity 2d, and for the most part, I'm able to use skype. I'm a happy user/tester, and can't wait to recommend Ubuntu Precise to my friends and family using Ubuntu, after final release. Hopefully the pidgin bug can be ironed out before final release, or shortly after as perhaps a service update. Loving the progress, Guy On 03/25/2012 03:30 PM, Jakob Herrmann wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > Hi, > > as I told yesterday, many accessibility issues have been fixed with > the recent update of Orca and related components, i.e. according to > Firefox. The only problem I am facing now so far: i m not able to chat > with Pidgin any more (without using flat review or chat history to > view messages, of course). Incoming messages are neither read via tts > nore displayed on braille. It works again when I restart orca, > however, restarting orca makes braille output stop completely in X on > my system (=another quite old issue to be checked later), so this is > currently no solution for me. Can somebody confirm this? Pidgin works > without trouble again when I downgrade at-spi2-core to stable, which > restores some of the bugs fixed in the latest git branch, however. > > Cheers, > Jakob > From david at rustytelephone.net Mon Mar 26 00:36:27 2012 From: david at rustytelephone.net (David Sexton) Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2012 06:06:27 +0530 Subject: [orca-list] Problems with Orca and pidgin...seems to be an at-spi2-core issue In-Reply-To: <4F6F9DA8.9000104@att.net> References: <4F6F7251.1000806@infosprinter.com> <4F6F9DA8.9000104@att.net> Message-ID: <4F6FBA0B.5010300@rustytelephone.net> Hi, If you go to plugins and add the one which says append a newline to incomming messages... you'lll see first messages. David On 26/03/12 04:05, Guy Schlosser wrote: > Hi Jakob, yes, I can confirm the issue with pidgin as far as speech > goes. Whenever I press enter after typing in a message, orca does not > read it. The other thing I've noticed, is that some times I cannot > see new messages from others, until I've already started typing > again. I am however, happy to see the other accessibility bugs worked > out. Hud is working in Unity 2d, and for the most part, I'm able to > use skype. I'm a happy user/tester, and can't wait to recommend > Ubuntu Precise to my friends and family using Ubuntu, after final > release. Hopefully the pidgin bug can be ironed out before final > release, or shortly after as perhaps a service update. > > Loving the progress, > > > Guy > > > On 03/25/2012 03:30 PM, Jakob Herrmann wrote: >> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- >> Hash: SHA1 >> >> Hi, >> >> as I told yesterday, many accessibility issues have been fixed with >> the recent update of Orca and related components, i.e. according to >> Firefox. The only problem I am facing now so far: i m not able to chat >> with Pidgin any more (without using flat review or chat history to >> view messages, of course). Incoming messages are neither read via tts >> nore displayed on braille. It works again when I restart orca, >> however, restarting orca makes braille output stop completely in X on >> my system (=another quite old issue to be checked later), so this is >> currently no solution for me. Can somebody confirm this? Pidgin works >> without trouble again when I downgrade at-spi2-core to stable, which >> restores some of the bugs fixed in the latest git branch, however. >> >> Cheers, >> Jakob >> > > From thomasward1978 at gmail.com Mon Mar 26 00:48:59 2012 From: thomasward1978 at gmail.com (Thomas Ward) Date: Sun, 25 Mar 2012 20:48:59 -0400 Subject: [orca-list] Problems with Orca and pidgin...seems to be an at-spi2-core issue In-Reply-To: <4F6F9DA8.9000104@att.net> References: <4F6F7251.1000806@infosprinter.com> <4F6F9DA8.9000104@att.net> Message-ID: <4F6FBCFB.6090409@gmail.com> Hi, Same here. So far the way Precise is going I am strongly planning on upgrading all my 10.04 LTS systems to 12.04 LTS as other than some annoyances I can live with Unity 2D and some of the access issues as they stand. I'm sure after 12.04 is released many of these things will get fixed upstream anyway as patches become available. On 3/25/2012 6:35 PM, Guy Schlosser wrote: > Hi Jakob, yes, I can confirm the issue with pidgin as far as speech > goes. Whenever I press enter after typing in a message, orca does not > read it. The other thing I've noticed, is that some times I cannot > see new messages from others, until I've already started typing > again. I am however, happy to see the other accessibility bugs worked > out. Hud is working in Unity 2d, and for the most part, I'm able to > use skype. I'm a happy user/tester, and can't wait to recommend > Ubuntu Precise to my friends and family using Ubuntu, after final > release. Hopefully the pidgin bug can be ironed out before final > release, or shortly after as perhaps a service update. > > Loving the progress, > > > Guy > > On 03/25/2012 03:30 PM, Jakob Herrmann wrote: >> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- >> Hash: SHA1 >> >> Hi, >> >> as I told yesterday, many accessibility issues have been fixed with >> the recent update of Orca and related components, i.e. according to >> Firefox. The only problem I am facing now so far: i m not able to chat >> with Pidgin any more (without using flat review or chat history to >> view messages, of course). Incoming messages are neither read via tts >> nore displayed on braille. It works again when I restart orca, >> however, restarting orca makes braille output stop completely in X on >> my system (=another quite old issue to be checked later), so this is >> currently no solution for me. Can somebody confirm this? Pidgin works >> without trouble again when I downgrade at-spi2-core to stable, which >> restores some of the bugs fixed in the latest git branch, however. >> >> Cheers, >> Jakob >> > > _______________________________________________ > orca-list mailing list > orca-list at gnome.org > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list > Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. > The manual is at > http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html > The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions > Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org > Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp From hammera at pickup.hu Mon Mar 26 07:09:41 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2012 09:09:41 +0200 Subject: If com.canonical.indicator.datetime show-calendar key value is true, keyboard focus grab when the caret lands the Date indicator second menu item In-Reply-To: <4F6D8918.5070502@pickup.hu> References: <4F6D8851.1070000@pickup.hu> <4F6D8918.5070502@pickup.hu> Message-ID: <4F701635.8090006@pickup.hu> Hy, I reported the saturday wrote problem from casper package, attached a video with demonstrate what happening if com.canonical.indicator.datetime show-calendar setting value is true. I attached a patch with change the setting value from true to false with low vision and blindness profiles. Report link is following: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/casper/+bug/965015 Attila From ka1cey at gmail.com Mon Mar 26 22:09:22 2012 From: ka1cey at gmail.com (Dave Hunt) Date: Mon, 26 Mar 2012 18:09:22 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Which image to use for testing? Message-ID: Hi, List, I downloaded an image of Precise from ftp:cdimage.ubuntu.com/cdimage/dialylive dated 25 March, and burned to a flash drive. When I booted, no drums ever played, nor did I get the usual Ubuntu music for the startup. I started orca manually, set the preferences, and tried to launch apps. I think the system was in Unity 3d. Alt+tab did not seem to work. Orca never spoke in the 'run' dialogue. When I hit alt+f1, the launcher never spoke, nor could I launch apps with super+0 through super+9. The menu, accessible with a press of alt+f10, does work, with items spoken with their proper types (menus were indicated as such, items no longer named as 'checkbox not checked'). I noticed, also, that the menu of wifi points now shows signal strength and whether the points are secured, very nice! To try fixing the desktop session for next time I use the flash drive, I opened a terminal, and edited the files: /var/log/AccountsService/users/ubuntu and /etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf, changing the user session to ubuntu-2d from ubuntu. Now, I have an unusable system on this flash drive. It boots, but I don't think it logs in as anyone, or there is no ubuntu-2d desktop on this particular image. Cheers, Dave From guyster104 at att.net Tue Mar 27 05:49:31 2012 From: guyster104 at att.net (Guy Schlosser) Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2012 01:49:31 -0400 Subject: weirdness between systems Message-ID: <4F7154EB.7030502@att.net> Hi all, I have a problem with Ubuntu Precise on my laptop, that does not seem to exist on my desktop. On my laptop, I'm not getting notifications read to me (i.e. new mail notifications in Thunderbird or message notifications from Pidgin, etc. I have both systems set to Ubuntu 2d, and am not sure why one computer is reading them, and the other is not. Any ideas for getting spoken notifications on my laptop? Is there something I should look for that may not be present? I definitely appreciate any ideas or suggestions. Thanks in advance. Guy From guyster104 at att.net Tue Mar 27 17:29:37 2012 From: guyster104 at att.net (Guy Schlosser) Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2012 13:29:37 -0400 Subject: weirdness between systems In-Reply-To: <4F7154EB.7030502@att.net> References: <4F7154EB.7030502@att.net> Message-ID: <4F71F901.1090200@att.net> Hi all, I have a problem with Ubuntu Precise on my laptop, that does not seem to exist on my desktop. On my laptop, I'm not getting notifications read to me (i.e. new mail notifications in Thunderbird or message notifications from Pidgin, etc. I have both systems set to Ubuntu 2d, and am not sure why one computer is reading them, and the other is not. Any ideas for getting spoken notifications on my laptop? Is there something I should look for that may not be present? I definitely appreciate any ideas or suggestions. Thanks in advance. Guy -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chaltain at gmail.com Wed Mar 28 13:52:05 2012 From: chaltain at gmail.com (Christopher Chaltain) Date: Wed, 28 Mar 2012 08:52:05 -0500 Subject: [orca-list] Shortcuts got disabled in Unity-2d on installing latest update In-Reply-To: <4F730328.3080703@gmail.com> References: <000001cd0cd1$d7679380$8636ba80$@gmail.com> <4F730328.3080703@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4F731785.1000703@gmail.com> I'll forward this to the Ubuntu Accessibility list. The Ubuntu Accessibility list is a pretty low traffic list, so I'd encourage people to join that list and discuss Ubuntu specific accessibility issues there as well as on this list. Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility On 28/03/12 07:25, hackingKK wrote: > This is very sad and serious at the same time. > Some one should urgently update the Ubuntu guys. > I think Luke is on this list as well and he has rescued us many times > from such issues. > Unless they have decided that this is going to be final due to what ever > reasons, this disabling of shortcuts must be reverced in any case. > Happy hacking. > Krishnakant. > > On 28/03/12 16:29, Andy B. wrote: >> I did an update sometime yesterday. It included an update to Unity-2d 5.0.x. >> After the update, it started acting exactly like Unity-3d. I couldn't figure >> out what happened until I looked at the shortcuts. The only shortcuts >> enabled now are the ones in the general list; mail, browser, help, home >> folder, and there might be a few more. Otherwise the entire list is >> disabled. Why do they do this to us? J (grin). Any way of getting a bug >> report in for something like this? >> >> I also want to report the menubar not being accessable. How do you do that? >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> orca-list mailing list >> orca-list at gnome.org >> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list >> Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. >> The manual is at http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html >> The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions >> Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org >> Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp > > > > _______________________________________________ > orca-list mailing list > orca-list at gnome.org > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list > Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. > The manual is at http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html > The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions > Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org > Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp -- Christopher (CJ) chaltain at gmail.com From themuso at ubuntu.com Wed Mar 28 21:13:11 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2012 08:13:11 +1100 Subject: [orca-list] Shortcuts got disabled in Unity-2d on installing latest update In-Reply-To: <000001cd0cd1$d7679380$8636ba80$@gmail.com> References: <000001cd0cd1$d7679380$8636ba80$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20120328211311.GA4428@acapella> On Wed, Mar 28, 2012 at 09:59:24PM EST, Andy B. wrote: > I did an update sometime yesterday. It included an update to Unity-2d 5.0.x. > After the update, it started acting exactly like Unity-3d. I couldn't figure > out what happened until I looked at the shortcuts. The only shortcuts > enabled now are the ones in the general list; mail, browser, help, home > folder, and there might be a few more. Otherwise the entire list is > disabled. Ok for starters,w aht shortcuts are you referring to when you say they are disabled? Secondly, what do you mean when you say that Unity 2D is acting like Unity 3D? I am running Ubuntu 12.04 in a virtual machine, separate from my main setup so I can test changes on a vanilla install, as my own settings are rather customized. I don't see any loss of functionality what soever. I am able to get to the menu bar with Alt + F10 (yes this was changed, and for good reason). I am still able to access the launcher and dash. If you could fioll me in with a few more details, that would be much appreciated. Thanks. Luke From hammera at pickup.hu Thu Mar 29 05:24:27 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2012 07:24:27 +0200 Subject: An at-spi2 Registrid crash Message-ID: <4F73F20B.8000809@pickup.hu> Hy, I now reported with apport an at-spi2 registrid crash: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/at-spi2-core/+bug/967991 I don't no this issue are valid or not, because I not possible saying reproducation steps unfortunately. I experienced only following issue in Unity Greeter in LightDm: Some time Orca loading correctly, some time not. If Orca not loaded correctly, I hear only "Welcome to Orca" message and "Good bye" message. Random time happening this issue my system. Anybody experienced similar issue? Attila From hammera at pickup.hu Thu Mar 29 05:47:37 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2012 07:47:37 +0200 Subject: Password request not working when a machine resume from suspend? Message-ID: <4F73F779.4020003@pickup.hu> Hy, Some time I suspending my laptop when I goto a short time an another office, or lock the screen. When my machine resume from suspend, not happening password request. Of course, importanter check boxes in GNOME Control Center/brightness and lock preference tool is checked. After I archived my .gconf folder and .config/dconf/user file, I tryed remove my home folder the entire .gconf folder and .config/dconf/user file. Unfortunately nothing changed. This is not a security bug? Already reported similar issue with Precise related? Look following GSettings values, I generated a full list of settings with gsettings list-recursively command and search possible lock related settings: org.gnome.desktop.screensaver lock-enabled true org.gnome.desktop.screensaver logout-command '' org.gnome.desktop.screensaver logout-delay uint32 7200 org.gnome.desktop.screensaver logout-enabled false org.gnome.desktop.screensaver status-message-enabled true org.gnome.desktop.screensaver ubuntu-lock-on-suspend true org.gnome.desktop.screensaver user-switch-enabled true org.gnome.desktop.lockdown disable-application-handlers false org.gnome.desktop.lockdown disable-command-line false org.gnome.desktop.lockdown disable-lock-screen false org.gnome.desktop.lockdown disable-log-out false org.gnome.desktop.lockdown disable-print-setup false org.gnome.desktop.lockdown disable-printing false org.gnome.desktop.lockdown disable-save-to-disk false org.gnome.desktop.lockdown disable-user-switching false I experienced first this issue under GNOME3 fallback session, but I tryed this problem with Unity 2d too. Anybody have any ydea what setting key need setting to happening password request both resume from lock screen and resume from suspend operation? Attila From hackingkk at gmail.com Thu Mar 29 09:14:59 2012 From: hackingkk at gmail.com (hackingKK) Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2012 14:44:59 +0530 Subject: [orca-list] Shortcuts got disabled in Unity-2d on installing latest update In-Reply-To: <20120328211311.GA4428@acapella> References: <000001cd0cd1$d7679380$8636ba80$@gmail.com> <20120328211311.GA4428@acapella> Message-ID: <4F742813.2000709@gmail.com> Hi Luke, I just tryed the latest daily build. It is there on my pen drive. I did not see any change in the accessibility. What Andi might be facing as I can make out is a situation where he presses alt + f1 and can't hear orca giving audio feedback by announcing the menu items. Same might be the case with the launch bar that comes up with Super key. I had faced this some time back but no more with latest daily builds. But I will still recommend we do a check. Happy hacking. Krishnakant. On 29/03/12 02:43, Luke Yelavich wrote: > On Wed, Mar 28, 2012 at 09:59:24PM EST, Andy B. wrote: >> I did an update sometime yesterday. It included an update to Unity-2d 5.0.x. >> After the update, it started acting exactly like Unity-3d. I couldn't figure >> out what happened until I looked at the shortcuts. The only shortcuts >> enabled now are the ones in the general list; mail, browser, help, home >> folder, and there might be a few more. Otherwise the entire list is >> disabled. > Ok for starters,w aht shortcuts are you referring to when you say they are disabled? Secondly, what do you mean when you say that Unity 2D is acting like Unity 3D? > > I am running Ubuntu 12.04 in a virtual machine, separate from my main setup so I can test changes on a vanilla install, as my own settings are rather customized. I don't see any loss of functionality what soever. I am able to get to the menu bar with Alt + F10 (yes this was changed, and for good reason). I am still able to access the launcher and dash. > > If you could fioll me in with a few more details, that would be much appreciated. > > Thanks. > > Luke > _______________________________________________ > orca-list mailing list > orca-list at gnome.org > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list > Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. > The manual is at http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html > The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions > Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org > Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp > From kd7cyu at gmail.com Thu Mar 29 20:25:39 2012 From: kd7cyu at gmail.com (Tom Masterson) Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2012 13:25:39 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Oneirc unity-2ed question Message-ID: For some reason my computer has decided to turn on airplane mode and not let me turn it off. I go to the system panel, select network, turjn off airplane mode, press all settings and when I look again airplane mode is back on. In theory if I read correctly I should be able to show this in the network menu but I can't find any place to do that. Also it doesn't find any of the wireless in the area including my own. How can I fix this? Tom From themuso at ubuntu.com Thu Mar 29 20:39:35 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2012 07:39:35 +1100 Subject: Oneirc unity-2ed question In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20120329203935.GB4574@acapella> On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 07:25:39AM EST, Tom Masterson wrote: > For some reason my computer has decided to turn on airplane mode and > not let me turn it off. I go to the system panel, select network, > turjn off airplane mode, press all settings and when I look again > airplane mode is back on. In theory if I read correctly I should be > able to show this in the network menu but I can't find any place to > do that. Also it doesn't find any of the wireless in the area > including my own. First, are you on a laptop? If so, you may have accidentally turned off all radios either with a switch, or with a shortcut key. If a shortcut key, you need to press it again to turn things back on. I don't know what shortcut key that would be, since all machines are different. Have you checked the options in the network menu, enabling wireless networking, and networking etc? Have you also checked to see if bluetooth is turned on from the bluetooth menu? Luke From kd7cyu at gmail.com Thu Mar 29 21:33:43 2012 From: kd7cyu at gmail.com (Tom Masterson) Date: Thu, 29 Mar 2012 14:33:43 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Oneirc unity-2ed question In-Reply-To: <20120329203935.GB4574@acapella> References: <20120329203935.GB4574@acapella> Message-ID: Thanks Luke. There is a slide switch on the side of the computer that I didn't even know was there that got moved at some point. FYI it did not appear to turn off bluetooth but I didn't have anything connected that way so I can't verify that. Tom On Fri, 30 Mar 2012, Luke Yelavich wrote: > On Fri, Mar 30, 2012 at 07:25:39AM EST, Tom Masterson wrote: >> For some reason my computer has decided to turn on airplane mode and >> not let me turn it off. I go to the system panel, select network, >> turjn off airplane mode, press all settings and when I look again >> airplane mode is back on. In theory if I read correctly I should be >> able to show this in the network menu but I can't find any place to >> do that. Also it doesn't find any of the wireless in the area >> including my own. > > First, are you on a laptop? If so, you may have accidentally turned off all radios either with a switch, or with a shortcut key. If a shortcut key, you need to press it again to turn things back on. I don't know what shortcut key that would be, since all machines are different. > > Have you checked the options in the network menu, enabling wireless networking, and networking etc? Have you also checked to see if bluetooth is turned on from the bluetooth menu? > > Luke > > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility > From krmane at gmail.com Fri Mar 30 07:13:33 2012 From: krmane at gmail.com (Krishnakant Mane) Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2012 12:43:33 +0530 Subject: any review for Orca with Ubuntu precise beta 2 Message-ID: <4F755D1D.5090807@gmail.com> Has any one tryed the latest Ubuntu precise beta2? I remember that people had reported Unity 2d having issues with Orca not reading out the menus with alt + f1 and the launcher? Is it a reality, did somme one manage to reproduce the issue? if yes, what is the current status? Happy hacking. Krishnakant. From hammera at pickup.hu Fri Mar 30 07:34:12 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2012 09:34:12 +0200 Subject: Possible Casper ubiquity-hooks/30-accessibility script doesn't copying existing user customized Orca settings in the target system /var/lib/lightdm folder Message-ID: <4F7561F4.9070409@pickup.hu> Hy, I looked casper source package the ubiquity-hooks/30-accessibility script. I see the script not copying existing user already customized Orca settings in the target system /var/lib/lightdm/.local/share folder, new created username home directory the copying happening right. I reported this issue, and attach a small patch with doing this function, similar with oldest casper packages with /var/lib/gdm folder. Report link is following: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/casper/+bug/968929 If anybody would like, please give this bug with confirmed status, or click the does this bug affect you direct link and click the change button the form: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/casper/+bug/968929/+affectsmetoo Have possibility to commit this patch after beta freeze is lifted? Attila From hammera at pickup.hu Fri Mar 30 09:11:30 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2012 11:11:30 +0200 Subject: I need debugging Orca eoutput when Unity greeter start the screen reader. It is possible? Message-ID: <4F7578C2.7050808@pickup.hu> Hy, Because my machine random time Orca launching and exiting in Unity Greeter, I very would like making a debug.out file to correct determining what happening this situation in Orca level before I report a bug with proper place, Launchpad or upstream. When this problem is happening, this situation Orca only read following messages: "Welcome to Orca. Good bye." After this, if I press two time the CTRL+S keystroke, Orca launch correctly, and the login screen are usable, except the user list default selected item is not focused. Unfortunately in /var/crash directory not have any crash file to send automaticaly a report with apport-cli or ubuntu-bug commands. How can possible change running Unity Greeter Orca command to pass the --debug-file=anydebugfile.out parameter? Technical this is possible? Prewious, with oldest GNOME releases possible change Orca launch command with gconftool-2 -s -t string /desktop/gnome/applications/at/visual/exec 'orca' command. Attila From hammera at pickup.hu Fri Mar 30 09:58:24 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2012 11:58:24 +0200 Subject: I need debugging Orca eoutput when Unity greeter start the screen reader. It is possible? In-Reply-To: <4F7578C2.7050808@pickup.hu> References: <4F7578C2.7050808@pickup.hu> Message-ID: <4F7583C0.9000401@pickup.hu> Hy, Because I not known better possibility, I change temporary with running hardcoded Orca command in unity-greeter source package with src/menubar.vala file and recompiled Unity Greeter package. Look what showing the debug.out file when this problem are happening. Don't surprise, I not choosed english language: Trying to use speech server factory: orca.speechdispatcherfactory Using speech server factory: orca.speechdispatcherfactory Speech module has been initialized. Braille module has been initialized using tty=7 braille display size = (70, 1) NEW SCRIPT: default (module=orca.scripts.default) ACTIVE SCRIPT: default (module=orca.scripts.default) (reason=activate) SPEECH OUTPUT: 'Üdvözöljük az Orkában.' voice=system BRAILLE LINE: '${dvq2qlj{k a2 $ork"ban.' VISIBLE: '${dvq2qlj{k a2 $ork"ban.', cursor=0 knownApplications... ...knownApplications LOCUS OF FOCUS: app='unity-greeter' name='Bejelentkező képernyő' role='frame' event=None PREPARATION TIME: 0.0097 generate braille for focused app.name='unity-greeter' name='Bejelentkező képernyő' role='frame' state='active enabled resizable sensitive showing visible' relations='' (args={'formatType': 'focused', 'role': , 'mode': 'braille', 'recursing': True}) using '(includeContext and (ancestors + (rowHeader and [Region(" " + asString(rowHeader))]) + (columnHeader and [Region(" " + asString(columnHeader))]) + (radioButtonGroup and [Region(" " + asString(radioButtonGroup))]) + [Region(" ")]) or []) + [Component(obj, asString(((label + displayedText) or name) + value + roleName + alertAndDialogCount))] + (nodeLevel and [Region(" " + asString(nodeLevel))])' GENERATION TIME: 0.0015 ----> includeContext=True PREPARATION TIME: 0.0071 generate braille for focused app.name='unity-greeter' name='unity-greeter' role='application' state='' relations='' (args={'formatType': 'focused', 'role': , 'mode': 'braille', 'includeContext': False, 'recursing': True}) using '[Component(obj, asString(label + displayedText + value + roleName + required))]' GENERATION TIME: 0.0030 ----> label=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0016 ----> displayedText=[u'unity-greeter'] GENERATION TIME: 0.0013 ----> value=[''] GENERATION TIME: 0.0013 ----> roleName=['alkalmaz\xc3\xa1s'] GENERATION TIME: 0.0012 ----> required=[] COMPLETION TIME: 0.0164 generate braille results: Component: 'uni8-greeter alkalma2"s', 0 GENERATION TIME: 0.0261 ----> ancestors=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0057 ----> rowHeader=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0024 ----> columnHeader=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0011 ----> radioButtonGroup=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0078 ----> label=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0028 ----> displayedText=[u'Bejelentkez\u0151 k\xe9perny\u0151'] GENERATION TIME: 0.0019 ----> value=[''] GENERATION TIME: 0.0019 ----> roleName=['keret'] GENERATION TIME: 0.0149 ----> alertAndDialogCount=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0021 ----> nodeLevel=[] COMPLETION TIME: 0.0803 generate braille results: Component: 'uni8-greeter alkalma2"s', 0 Region: ' ', 0 Component: '$bejelentke27 k1per67 keret', 1 BRAILLE LINE: 'uni8-greeter alkalma2"s $bejelentke27 k1per67 keret' VISIBLE: 'uni8-greeter alkalma2"s $bejelentke27 k1per67 keret', cursor=26 PREPARATION TIME: 0.0102 generate speech for unfocused app.name='unity-greeter' name='Bejelentkező képernyő' role='frame' state='active enabled resizable sensitive showing visible' relations='' (args={'recursing': True, 'priorObj': None, 'role': , 'mode': 'speech', 'formatType': 'unfocused'}) using 'newAncestors + newRowHeader + newColumnHeader + newRadioButtonGroup + labelAndName + allTextSelection + roleName + unfocusedDialogCount + availability + newNodeLevel + unselectedCell + (tutorial and (pause + tutorial) or [])' GENERATION TIME: 0.0003 ----> newAncestors=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0020 ----> newRowHeader=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0022 ----> newColumnHeader=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0009 ----> newRadioButtonGroup=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0044 ----> labelAndName=['Bejelentkez\xc5\x91 k\xc3\xa9perny\xc5\x91', {u'average-pitch': 3.0, u'rate': 90.0, u'family': {u'locale': u'hu', u'name': u'magyar'}}] GENERATION TIME: 0.0011 ----> allTextSelection=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0013 ----> roleName=['keret', {}] GENERATION TIME: 0.0079 ----> unfocusedDialogCount=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0010 ----> availability=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0003 ----> newNodeLevel=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0059 ----> unselectedCell=[] GENERATOR: _getTutorialForFrame obj = Bejelentkező képernyő role = frame alreadyFocused = False utterances: GENERATOR: getTutorial obj = Bejelentkező képernyő role = frame alreadyFocused = False utterances: () GENERATION TIME: 0.0149 ----> tutorial=[''] GENERATION TIME: 0.0003 ----> pause=[] COMPLETION TIME: 0.0537 generate speech results: Bejelentkező képernyő {u'average-pitch': 3.0, u'rate': 90.0, u'family': {u'locale': u'hu', u'name': u'magyar'}} keret {} SPEECH OUTPUT: 'Bejelentkező képernyő keret.' Trying to use speech server factory: orca.speechdispatcherfactory Using speech server factory: orca.speechdispatcherfactory Speech module has been initialized. Braille module has been initialized using tty=7 braille display size = (70, 1) NEW SCRIPT: default (module=orca.scripts.default) ACTIVE SCRIPT: default (module=orca.scripts.default) (reason=activate) SPEECH OUTPUT: 'Viszontlátásra.' voice=system BRAILLE LINE: '$vi5ontl"t"sra.' VISIBLE: '$vi5ontl"t"sra.', cursor=0 I sending debug.out file with attachment. What direction we going forward? Possible fixing this problem before final release? Attila -------------- next part -------------- Trying to use speech server factory: orca.speechdispatcherfactory Using speech server factory: orca.speechdispatcherfactory Speech module has been initialized. Braille module has been initialized using tty=7 braille display size = (70, 1) NEW SCRIPT: default (module=orca.scripts.default) ACTIVE SCRIPT: default (module=orca.scripts.default) (reason=activate) SPEECH OUTPUT: 'Üdvözöljük az Orkában.' voice=system BRAILLE LINE: '${dvq2qlj{k a2 $ork"ban.' VISIBLE: '${dvq2qlj{k a2 $ork"ban.', cursor=0 knownApplications... ...knownApplications LOCUS OF FOCUS: app='unity-greeter' name='Bejelentkező képernyő' role='frame' event=None PREPARATION TIME: 0.0097 generate braille for focused app.name='unity-greeter' name='Bejelentkező képernyő' role='frame' state='active enabled resizable sensitive showing visible' relations='' (args={'formatType': 'focused', 'role': , 'mode': 'braille', 'recursing': True}) using '(includeContext and (ancestors + (rowHeader and [Region(" " + asString(rowHeader))]) + (columnHeader and [Region(" " + asString(columnHeader))]) + (radioButtonGroup and [Region(" " + asString(radioButtonGroup))]) + [Region(" ")]) or []) + [Component(obj, asString(((label + displayedText) or name) + value + roleName + alertAndDialogCount))] + (nodeLevel and [Region(" " + asString(nodeLevel))])' GENERATION TIME: 0.0015 ----> includeContext=True PREPARATION TIME: 0.0071 generate braille for focused app.name='unity-greeter' name='unity-greeter' role='application' state='' relations='' (args={'formatType': 'focused', 'role': , 'mode': 'braille', 'includeContext': False, 'recursing': True}) using '[Component(obj, asString(label + displayedText + value + roleName + required))]' GENERATION TIME: 0.0030 ----> label=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0016 ----> displayedText=[u'unity-greeter'] GENERATION TIME: 0.0013 ----> value=[''] GENERATION TIME: 0.0013 ----> roleName=['alkalmaz\xc3\xa1s'] GENERATION TIME: 0.0012 ----> required=[] COMPLETION TIME: 0.0164 generate braille results: Component: 'uni8-greeter alkalma2"s', 0 GENERATION TIME: 0.0261 ----> ancestors=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0057 ----> rowHeader=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0024 ----> columnHeader=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0011 ----> radioButtonGroup=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0078 ----> label=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0028 ----> displayedText=[u'Bejelentkez\u0151 k\xe9perny\u0151'] GENERATION TIME: 0.0019 ----> value=[''] GENERATION TIME: 0.0019 ----> roleName=['keret'] GENERATION TIME: 0.0149 ----> alertAndDialogCount=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0021 ----> nodeLevel=[] COMPLETION TIME: 0.0803 generate braille results: Component: 'uni8-greeter alkalma2"s', 0 Region: ' ', 0 Component: '$bejelentke27 k1per67 keret', 1 BRAILLE LINE: 'uni8-greeter alkalma2"s $bejelentke27 k1per67 keret' VISIBLE: 'uni8-greeter alkalma2"s $bejelentke27 k1per67 keret', cursor=26 PREPARATION TIME: 0.0102 generate speech for unfocused app.name='unity-greeter' name='Bejelentkező képernyő' role='frame' state='active enabled resizable sensitive showing visible' relations='' (args={'recursing': True, 'priorObj': None, 'role': , 'mode': 'speech', 'formatType': 'unfocused'}) using 'newAncestors + newRowHeader + newColumnHeader + newRadioButtonGroup + labelAndName + allTextSelection + roleName + unfocusedDialogCount + availability + newNodeLevel + unselectedCell + (tutorial and (pause + tutorial) or [])' GENERATION TIME: 0.0003 ----> newAncestors=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0020 ----> newRowHeader=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0022 ----> newColumnHeader=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0009 ----> newRadioButtonGroup=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0044 ----> labelAndName=['Bejelentkez\xc5\x91 k\xc3\xa9perny\xc5\x91', {u'average-pitch': 3.0, u'rate': 90.0, u'family': {u'locale': u'hu', u'name': u'magyar'}}] GENERATION TIME: 0.0011 ----> allTextSelection=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0013 ----> roleName=['keret', {}] GENERATION TIME: 0.0079 ----> unfocusedDialogCount=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0010 ----> availability=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0003 ----> newNodeLevel=[] GENERATION TIME: 0.0059 ----> unselectedCell=[] GENERATOR: _getTutorialForFrame obj = Bejelentkező képernyő role = frame alreadyFocused = False utterances: GENERATOR: getTutorial obj = Bejelentkező képernyő role = frame alreadyFocused = False utterances: () GENERATION TIME: 0.0149 ----> tutorial=[''] GENERATION TIME: 0.0003 ----> pause=[] COMPLETION TIME: 0.0537 generate speech results: Bejelentkező képernyő {u'average-pitch': 3.0, u'rate': 90.0, u'family': {u'locale': u'hu', u'name': u'magyar'}} keret {} SPEECH OUTPUT: 'Bejelentkező képernyő keret.' Trying to use speech server factory: orca.speechdispatcherfactory Using speech server factory: orca.speechdispatcherfactory Speech module has been initialized. Braille module has been initialized using tty=7 braille display size = (70, 1) NEW SCRIPT: default (module=orca.scripts.default) ACTIVE SCRIPT: default (module=orca.scripts.default) (reason=activate) SPEECH OUTPUT: 'Viszontlátásra.' voice=system BRAILLE LINE: '$vi5ontl"t"sra.' VISIBLE: '$vi5ontl"t"sra.', cursor=0 From krmane at gmail.com Fri Mar 30 15:38:35 2012 From: krmane at gmail.com (Krishnakant Mane) Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2012 21:08:35 +0530 Subject: [orca-list] any review for Orca with Ubuntu precise beta 2 In-Reply-To: References: <4F755D1D.5090807@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4F75D37B.5000300@gmail.com> This is very serious and I think Canonical is really letting us down. It seems they are not as serious about accessibility as they used to be. I won't download the beta2 in this case. Actually I am in some rural part of India and bandwidth is not good enough for downloading the ISO. That's why I asked for the review and if this is what it comes to then I think I and many others will have to give up Ubuntu unless these crutial things are taken care of. I guess many blind users had infact liked Unity2d and were prepared to shift. But if accessibility is really broken to this extent then I wonder what to expect. I have a daily build of Ubuntu 12.04 on a pen drive and it really works so well that I was hoping to use a very accessible desktop from this summer. Hope this is taken care of soon before the release. It gives me a feeling that this is a very trivial issue for the developers of Unity to solve, because it was all working perfectly just a few days back. Happy hacking. Krishnakant. On 30/03/12 20:32, Dave Hunt wrote: > Hi, > > I tried the Precise beta 2, and could not get the thing to use > Unity-2d. When I boot the thing, the login prompt drums never sound, > and I never hear the music one is supposed to hear on the Gnome > session start. I can start orca manually. Once I have orca running, > I discover that the 'alt-f1' keystroke is silent, and there is no > apparent navigation in the launcher. A press of 'alt-tab' is also > silent. Focus does switch apps, but there is no way to know until I > release the keys, and, even then, orca may get confused or go silent. > The 'alt-f2' keyboard shortcut for 'show run dialogue' is disabled, as > shown in the gnome-control-center 'keyboard' page. I think a press of > 'alt+f2' actually puts focus in the heads-up display, and my typing > 'orca' into the search area just happened to start the app. Enabling > the 'run' dialogue, in keyboard shortcuts, does not help. So, I > opened terminal on my flash drive session, and edited > '/var/lib/AccountsService/users/ubuntu' and > '/etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf', changing 'ubuntu' to 'ubuntu-2d', as I > could do on an installed system, and tried a reboot. This results in > a system that will not boot. True to form, for Canonical, they broke > accessibility for this up-coming release. > > > > Cheers, > > > > Dave > > > > > > On Fri, 30 Mar 2012, Krishnakant Mane wrote: > >> Has any one tryed the latest Ubuntu precise beta2? >> I remember that people had reported Unity 2d having issues with Orca >> not reading out the menus with alt + f1 and the launcher? >> Is it a reality, did somme one manage to reproduce the issue? >> if yes, what is the current status? >> Happy hacking. >> Krishnakant. >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> orca-list mailing list >> orca-list at gnome.org >> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list >> Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. >> The manual is at >> http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html >> The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions >> Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org >> Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp >> > From chaltain at gmail.com Fri Mar 30 16:03:06 2012 From: chaltain at gmail.com (Christopher Chaltain) Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2012 11:03:06 -0500 Subject: [orca-list] any review for Orca with Ubuntu precise beta 2 In-Reply-To: <4F75D37B.5000300@gmail.com> References: <4F755D1D.5090807@gmail.com> <4F75D37B.5000300@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4F75D93A.8000605@gmail.com> Remember this is still a beta. I'm not familiar with the Ubuntu development team or community, but if it's similar to other development projects I've been involved with, there's probably a big push to get things fixed and addressed right up until beta 2 is released, so there will be an initial up tick in bugs. This isn't accessibility related but just naturally what happens when any significant amount of code is changed. Now we need to ensure issues are reported, bugs are opened and these issues get addressed before Ubuntu 12.04 is released. On 30/03/12 10:38, Krishnakant Mane wrote: > This is very serious and I think Canonical is really letting us down. > It seems they are not as serious about accessibility as they used to be. > I won't download the beta2 in this case. > Actually I am in some rural part of India and bandwidth is not good > enough for downloading the ISO. > That's why I asked for the review and if this is what it comes to then I > think I and many others will have to give up Ubuntu unless these crutial > things are taken care of. > I guess many blind users had infact liked Unity2d and were prepared to > shift. > But if accessibility is really broken to this extent then I wonder what > to expect. > I have a daily build of Ubuntu 12.04 on a pen drive and it really works > so well that I was hoping to use a very accessible desktop from this > summer. > Hope this is taken care of soon before the release. > It gives me a feeling that this is a very trivial issue for the > developers of Unity to solve, because it was all working perfectly just > a few days back. > Happy hacking. > Krishnakant. > > On 30/03/12 20:32, Dave Hunt wrote: >> Hi, >> >> I tried the Precise beta 2, and could not get the thing to use >> Unity-2d. When I boot the thing, the login prompt drums never sound, >> and I never hear the music one is supposed to hear on the Gnome >> session start. I can start orca manually. Once I have orca running, >> I discover that the 'alt-f1' keystroke is silent, and there is no >> apparent navigation in the launcher. A press of 'alt-tab' is also >> silent. Focus does switch apps, but there is no way to know until I >> release the keys, and, even then, orca may get confused or go silent. >> The 'alt-f2' keyboard shortcut for 'show run dialogue' is disabled, as >> shown in the gnome-control-center 'keyboard' page. I think a press of >> 'alt+f2' actually puts focus in the heads-up display, and my typing >> 'orca' into the search area just happened to start the app. Enabling >> the 'run' dialogue, in keyboard shortcuts, does not help. So, I >> opened terminal on my flash drive session, and edited >> '/var/lib/AccountsService/users/ubuntu' and >> '/etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf', changing 'ubuntu' to 'ubuntu-2d', as I >> could do on an installed system, and tried a reboot. This results in >> a system that will not boot. True to form, for Canonical, they broke >> accessibility for this up-coming release. >> >> >> >> Cheers, >> >> >> >> Dave >> >> >> >> >> >> On Fri, 30 Mar 2012, Krishnakant Mane wrote: >> >>> Has any one tryed the latest Ubuntu precise beta2? >>> I remember that people had reported Unity 2d having issues with Orca >>> not reading out the menus with alt + f1 and the launcher? >>> Is it a reality, did somme one manage to reproduce the issue? >>> if yes, what is the current status? >>> Happy hacking. >>> Krishnakant. >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> orca-list mailing list >>> orca-list at gnome.org >>> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list >>> Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. >>> The manual is at >>> http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html >>> The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions >>> Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org >>> Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp >>> >> > > _______________________________________________ > orca-list mailing list > orca-list at gnome.org > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list > Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. > The manual is at > http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html > The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions > Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org > Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp -- Christopher (CJ) chaltain at gmail.com From krmane at gmail.com Fri Mar 30 16:43:05 2012 From: krmane at gmail.com (Krishnakant Mane) Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2012 22:13:05 +0530 Subject: [orca-list] any review for Orca with Ubuntu precise beta 2 In-Reply-To: <4F75D93A.8000605@gmail.com> References: <4F755D1D.5090807@gmail.com> <4F75D37B.5000300@gmail.com> <4F75D93A.8000605@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4F75E299.9030009@gmail.com> This is quite possible and I really hope it is the case. As a matter of fact, all things were so well that I can hardly believe that it could be broken. 'But yes, there is a lot of hast during the final beta release, because after this one, we will just have the Rc before the final version. So hope things will get better. We have a very dedicated Luke who has almost always got things right when it came to Ubuntu. Happy hacking. Krishnakant. On 30/03/12 21:33, Christopher Chaltain wrote: > Remember this is still a beta. I'm not familiar with the Ubuntu > development team or community, but if it's similar to other development > projects I've been involved with, there's probably a big push to get > things fixed and addressed right up until beta 2 is released, so there > will be an initial up tick in bugs. This isn't accessibility related but > just naturally what happens when any significant amount of code is > changed. Now we need to ensure issues are reported, bugs are opened and > these issues get addressed before Ubuntu 12.04 is released. > > On 30/03/12 10:38, Krishnakant Mane wrote: >> This is very serious and I think Canonical is really letting us down. >> It seems they are not as serious about accessibility as they used to be. >> I won't download the beta2 in this case. >> Actually I am in some rural part of India and bandwidth is not good >> enough for downloading the ISO. >> That's why I asked for the review and if this is what it comes to then I >> think I and many others will have to give up Ubuntu unless these crutial >> things are taken care of. >> I guess many blind users had infact liked Unity2d and were prepared to >> shift. >> But if accessibility is really broken to this extent then I wonder what >> to expect. >> I have a daily build of Ubuntu 12.04 on a pen drive and it really works >> so well that I was hoping to use a very accessible desktop from this >> summer. >> Hope this is taken care of soon before the release. >> It gives me a feeling that this is a very trivial issue for the >> developers of Unity to solve, because it was all working perfectly just >> a few days back. >> Happy hacking. >> Krishnakant. >> >> On 30/03/12 20:32, Dave Hunt wrote: >>> Hi, >>> >>> I tried the Precise beta 2, and could not get the thing to use >>> Unity-2d. When I boot the thing, the login prompt drums never sound, >>> and I never hear the music one is supposed to hear on the Gnome >>> session start. I can start orca manually. Once I have orca running, >>> I discover that the 'alt-f1' keystroke is silent, and there is no >>> apparent navigation in the launcher. A press of 'alt-tab' is also >>> silent. Focus does switch apps, but there is no way to know until I >>> release the keys, and, even then, orca may get confused or go silent. >>> The 'alt-f2' keyboard shortcut for 'show run dialogue' is disabled, as >>> shown in the gnome-control-center 'keyboard' page. I think a press of >>> 'alt+f2' actually puts focus in the heads-up display, and my typing >>> 'orca' into the search area just happened to start the app. Enabling >>> the 'run' dialogue, in keyboard shortcuts, does not help. So, I >>> opened terminal on my flash drive session, and edited >>> '/var/lib/AccountsService/users/ubuntu' and >>> '/etc/lightdm/lightdm.conf', changing 'ubuntu' to 'ubuntu-2d', as I >>> could do on an installed system, and tried a reboot. This results in >>> a system that will not boot. True to form, for Canonical, they broke >>> accessibility for this up-coming release. >>> >>> >>> >>> Cheers, >>> >>> >>> >>> Dave >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Fri, 30 Mar 2012, Krishnakant Mane wrote: >>> >>>> Has any one tryed the latest Ubuntu precise beta2? >>>> I remember that people had reported Unity 2d having issues with Orca >>>> not reading out the menus with alt + f1 and the launcher? >>>> Is it a reality, did somme one manage to reproduce the issue? >>>> if yes, what is the current status? >>>> Happy hacking. >>>> Krishnakant. >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> orca-list mailing list >>>> orca-list at gnome.org >>>> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list >>>> Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. >>>> The manual is at >>>> http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html >>>> The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions >>>> Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org >>>> Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp >>>> >> _______________________________________________ >> orca-list mailing list >> orca-list at gnome.org >> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list >> Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. >> The manual is at >> http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html >> The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions >> Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org >> Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp > From krmane at gmail.com Sat Mar 31 05:08:47 2012 From: krmane at gmail.com (Krishnakant Mane) Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2012 10:38:47 +0530 Subject: [orca-list] any review for Orca with Ubuntu precise beta 2 In-Reply-To: <4F7604BE.1010004@gmail.com> References: <4F755D1D.5090807@gmail.com> <4F75D37B.5000300@gmail.com> <4F7604BE.1010004@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4F76915F.3090602@gmail.com> Hi Thomas, I have a little confusion when talking about Gnome3. I wish to know if we set the default to Gnome3, do we get the gnome shell or the old time menu of application, places and system like in Gnome2? What is exactly Gnome classic? Happy hacking. Krishnakant. On 31/03/12 00:38, Thomas Ward wrote: > > Hi, > > Well, I think the accessibility issues in beta 2 are temporary. As > long as we file bugs with launchpad and let them know what has > happened they should be able to correct the problem as access was > working with beta 1 fairly well. Assuming they fix said bugs I'll > probably switch to Unity 2D as the access we had a few days ago was > acceptable if not exceptional. > > Even if they don't fix Unity 2D its not the end of the world. Gnome 3 > is working decently and it is a fairly simple matter to install and > configure Gnome for Ubuntu 12.04. Just set your default desktop to > gnome-classic and you are in business. > > Cheers! > > On 3/30/2012 11:38 AM, Krishnakant Mane wrote: >> This is very serious and I think Canonical is really letting us down. >> It seems they are not as serious about accessibility as they used to be. >> I won't download the beta2 in this case. >> Actually I am in some rural part of India and bandwidth is not good >> enough for downloading the ISO. >> That's why I asked for the review and if this is what it comes to >> then I think I and many others will have to give up Ubuntu unless >> these crutial things are taken care of. >> I guess many blind users had infact liked Unity2d and were prepared >> to shift. >> But if accessibility is really broken to this extent then I wonder >> what to expect. >> I have a daily build of Ubuntu 12.04 on a pen drive and it really >> works so well that I was hoping to use a very accessible desktop from >> this summer. >> Hope this is taken care of soon before the release. >> It gives me a feeling that this is a very trivial issue for the >> developers of Unity to solve, because it was all working perfectly >> just a few days back. >> Happy hacking. >> Krishnakant. > > From ka1cey at gmail.com Sat Mar 31 05:18:49 2012 From: ka1cey at gmail.com (Dave Hunt) Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2012 01:18:49 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [orca-list] any review for Orca with Ubuntu precise beta 2 In-Reply-To: <4F76915F.3090602@gmail.com> References: <4F755D1D.5090807@gmail.com> <4F75D37B.5000300@gmail.com> <4F7604BE.1010004@gmail.com> <4F76915F.3090602@gmail.com> Message-ID: When ou use Gnome classic, you get the old-fashioned menus, like 'places', 'accessories', 'internet', 'sound and media', etc. a press of 'super+d' will minimize all apps, and put your on the desktop, which is just another folder under Gnome 3. For setting system preferences, you'll still use the gnome-control-center app; it's 'system settings' in Trisquel 5.5. I like having all these settings grouped in this way. Typing a filter string will show you only the icons with matching names. HTH, Dave On Sat, 31 Mar 2012, Krishnakant Mane wrote: > Hi Thomas, > I have a little confusion when talking about Gnome3. > I wish to know if we set the default to Gnome3, do we get the gnome shell or > the old time menu of application, places and system like in Gnome2? > What is exactly Gnome classic? > Happy hacking. > Krishnakant. > > On 31/03/12 00:38, Thomas Ward wrote: >> >> Hi, >> >> Well, I think the accessibility issues in beta 2 are temporary. As long as >> we file bugs with launchpad and let them know what has happened they should >> be able to correct the problem as access was working with beta 1 fairly >> well. Assuming they fix said bugs I'll probably switch to Unity 2D as the >> access we had a few days ago was acceptable if not exceptional. >> >> Even if they don't fix Unity 2D its not the end of the world. Gnome 3 is >> working decently and it is a fairly simple matter to install and configure >> Gnome for Ubuntu 12.04. Just set your default desktop to gnome-classic and >> you are in business. >> >> Cheers! >> >> On 3/30/2012 11:38 AM, Krishnakant Mane wrote: >>> This is very serious and I think Canonical is really letting us down. >>> It seems they are not as serious about accessibility as they used to be. >>> I won't download the beta2 in this case. >>> Actually I am in some rural part of India and bandwidth is not good enough >>> for downloading the ISO. >>> That's why I asked for the review and if this is what it comes to then I >>> think I and many others will have to give up Ubuntu unless these crutial >>> things are taken care of. >>> I guess many blind users had infact liked Unity2d and were prepared to >>> shift. >>> But if accessibility is really broken to this extent then I wonder what to >>> expect. >>> I have a daily build of Ubuntu 12.04 on a pen drive and it really works so >>> well that I was hoping to use a very accessible desktop from this summer. >>> Hope this is taken care of soon before the release. >>> It gives me a feeling that this is a very trivial issue for the developers >>> of Unity to solve, because it was all working perfectly just a few days >>> back. >>> Happy hacking. >>> Krishnakant. >> >> > > From krmane at gmail.com Sat Mar 31 05:23:54 2012 From: krmane at gmail.com (Krishnakant Mane) Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2012 10:53:54 +0530 Subject: [orca-list] any review for Orca with Ubuntu precise beta 2 In-Reply-To: References: <4F755D1D.5090807@gmail.com> <4F75D37B.5000300@gmail.com> <4F7604BE.1010004@gmail.com> <4F76915F.3090602@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4F7694EA.1010908@gmail.com> Hi Dave, On 31/03/12 10:48, Dave Hunt wrote: > When ou use Gnome classic, you get the old-fashioned menus, like > 'places', 'accessories', 'internet', 'sound and media', etc. a press > of 'super+d' will minimize all apps, and put your on the desktop, > which is just another folder under Gnome 3. For setting system > preferences, you'll still use the gnome-control-center app; it's > 'system settings' in Trisquel 5.5. I like having all these settings > grouped in this way. Typing a filter string will show you only the > icons with matching names. > So is this an enhancement in addition to the old menus? Typing a filter string is very much like the Unity's launcher I guess? And if so this means we have the best of all approaches. Happy hacking. Krishnakant. > > > HTH, > > > > Dave > > > > > > On Sat, 31 Mar 2012, Krishnakant Mane wrote: > >> Hi Thomas, >> I have a little confusion when talking about Gnome3. >> I wish to know if we set the default to Gnome3, do we get the gnome >> shell or the old time menu of application, places and system like in >> Gnome2? >> What is exactly Gnome classic? >> Happy hacking. >> Krishnakant. >> >> On 31/03/12 00:38, Thomas Ward wrote: >>> >>> Hi, >>> >>> Well, I think the accessibility issues in beta 2 are temporary. As >>> long as we file bugs with launchpad and let them know what has >>> happened they should be able to correct the problem as access was >>> working with beta 1 fairly well. Assuming they fix said bugs I'll >>> probably switch to Unity 2D as the access we had a few days ago was >>> acceptable if not exceptional. >>> >>> Even if they don't fix Unity 2D its not the end of the world. Gnome >>> 3 is working decently and it is a fairly simple matter to install >>> and configure Gnome for Ubuntu 12.04. Just set your default desktop >>> to gnome-classic and you are in business. >>> >>> Cheers! >>> >>> On 3/30/2012 11:38 AM, Krishnakant Mane wrote: >>>> This is very serious and I think Canonical is really letting us down. >>>> It seems they are not as serious about accessibility as they used >>>> to be. >>>> I won't download the beta2 in this case. >>>> Actually I am in some rural part of India and bandwidth is not good >>>> enough for downloading the ISO. >>>> That's why I asked for the review and if this is what it comes to >>>> then I think I and many others will have to give up Ubuntu unless >>>> these crutial things are taken care of. >>>> I guess many blind users had infact liked Unity2d and were prepared >>>> to shift. >>>> But if accessibility is really broken to this extent then I wonder >>>> what to expect. >>>> I have a daily build of Ubuntu 12.04 on a pen drive and it really >>>> works so well that I was hoping to use a very accessible desktop >>>> from this summer. >>>> Hope this is taken care of soon before the release. >>>> It gives me a feeling that this is a very trivial issue for the >>>> developers of Unity to solve, because it was all working perfectly >>>> just a few days back. >>>> Happy hacking. >>>> Krishnakant. >>> >>> >> >> > From kd7cyu at gmail.com Sat Mar 31 16:10:03 2012 From: kd7cyu at gmail.com (Tom Masterson) Date: Sat, 31 Mar 2012 09:10:03 -0700 (PDT) Subject: How to redo the gui desktop Message-ID: I have a Dell laptop (older). I have been upgrading it since something like Ubuntu 704 so it has been around awhile. It has developed a problem since the upgrade to 11.10. For some reason it has stopped runnig any of the GUIs. Primarily it seems to be a problem with nautilus blowing up regularily. Is there some way to remove everything and fix this? I don't really want to rebuild everything from scratch as I don't want to remember everything I had not to mention figure our where to back up everything so I don't loose things like my posfix settings and others I may not remember after all this time. Tom From thomasward1978 at gmail.com Fri Mar 30 19:08:46 2012 From: thomasward1978 at gmail.com (Thomas Ward) Date: Fri, 30 Mar 2012 15:08:46 -0400 Subject: [orca-list] any review for Orca with Ubuntu precise beta 2 In-Reply-To: <4F75D37B.5000300@gmail.com> References: <4F755D1D.5090807@gmail.com> <4F75D37B.5000300@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4F7604BE.1010004@gmail.com> Hi, Well, I think the accessibility issues in beta 2 are temporary. As long as we file bugs with launchpad and let them know what has happened they should be able to correct the problem as access was working with beta 1 fairly well. Assuming they fix said bugs I'll probably switch to Unity 2D as the access we had a few days ago was acceptable if not exceptional. Even if they don't fix Unity 2D its not the end of the world. Gnome 3 is working decently and it is a fairly simple matter to install and configure Gnome for Ubuntu 12.04. Just set your default desktop to gnome-classic and you are in business. Cheers! On 3/30/2012 11:38 AM, Krishnakant Mane wrote: > This is very serious and I think Canonical is really letting us down. > It seems they are not as serious about accessibility as they used to be. > I won't download the beta2 in this case. > Actually I am in some rural part of India and bandwidth is not good > enough for downloading the ISO. > That's why I asked for the review and if this is what it comes to then > I think I and many others will have to give up Ubuntu unless these > crutial things are taken care of. > I guess many blind users had infact liked Unity2d and were prepared to > shift. > But if accessibility is really broken to this extent then I wonder > what to expect. > I have a daily build of Ubuntu 12.04 on a pen drive and it really > works so well that I was hoping to use a very accessible desktop from > this summer. > Hope this is taken care of soon before the release. > It gives me a feeling that this is a very trivial issue for the > developers of Unity to solve, because it was all working perfectly > just a few days back. > Happy hacking. > Krishnakant.