From themuso at ubuntu.com Wed May 2 01:58:20 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Wed, 2 May 2012 11:58:20 +1000 Subject: Call for testing: Orca 3.4.1 in Ubuntu precise proposed updates. Message-ID: <20120502015820.GC3386@acapella> Hi folks, I am aware many of you are running Ubuntu precise at the moment, and are running orca 3.4.1 in some way or other, whether you built it yourself, or used packages from precise-proposed. However you are using it, I would ask that you please give your testing feedback on the following Launchpad bug, which is to get orca 3.4.1 into precise-updates. https://launchpad.net/bugs/988685. If you are using precise, and are not running orca 3.4.1 yet, there are instructions in the bug report as to how to install the proposed orca 3.4.1 package update. The more positive reports, the quicker we can get the update verified and pushed out to a wider audience. Thanks in advance for your time. Luke From themuso at ubuntu.com Wed May 2 05:37:42 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Wed, 2 May 2012 15:37:42 +1000 Subject: Call for testing, at-spi2 2.4.1. Message-ID: <20120502053742.GC3585@acapella> Hi folks, As per the previous mail about orca in precise, there is also at-spi2 2.4.1 that needs testing in precise-proposed. Instructions are found in the bug at https://launchpad.net/bugs/988652. Thanks. Luke From themuso at ubuntu.com Wed May 2 05:43:20 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Wed, 2 May 2012 15:43:20 +1000 Subject: Call for testing, at-spi2 2.4.1. Message-ID: <20120502054320.GD3585@acapella> Lets try that again, with correct addresses. :) Hi folks, As per the previous mail about orca in precise, there is also at-spi2 2.4.1 that needs testing in precise-proposed. Instructions are found in the bug at https://launchpad.net/bugs/988652. Thanks. Luke From ka1cey at gmail.com Wed May 2 13:45:15 2012 From: ka1cey at gmail.com (Dave Hunt) Date: Wed, 02 May 2012 09:45:15 -0400 Subject: orca immediately quitting in login screen. Message-ID: <4FA13A6B.50600@gmail.com> Hi, Since updating the accessibility stack from Precise Proposed, Orca will, sometimes, quit immediately after announcing itself, on the login greeter. I can restart Orca by toggling the 'ctrl+s' key, and speech stays enabled for the duration of the login dialogue session. once I login, speech for my desktop session works as it should. Best, Dave Hunt From simon.eigeldinger at vol.at Wed May 2 17:29:08 2012 From: simon.eigeldinger at vol.at (Simon Eigeldinger) Date: Wed, 02 May 2012 19:29:08 +0200 Subject: orca immediately quitting in login screen. In-Reply-To: <4FA13A6B.50600@gmail.com> References: <4FA13A6B.50600@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4FA16EE4.7080201@vol.at> hi, can confirm that over here too. don't know if this just happening since the update though but its happenening. greetings, simon Am 02.05.2012 15:45, schrieb Dave Hunt: > Hi, > > Since updating the accessibility stack from Precise Proposed, Orca will, > sometimes, quit immediately after announcing itself, on the login > greeter. I can restart Orca by toggling the 'ctrl+s' key, and speech > stays enabled for the duration of the login dialogue session. once I > login, speech for my desktop session works as it should. > > > Best, > > > Dave Hunt > > > > -- Simon Eigeldinger Follow me on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/domasofan/ E-Mail: simon.eigeldinger at vol.at MSN: simon_eigeldinger at hotmail.com ICQ: 121823966 Jabber: domasofan at livejournal.com From alex.midence at gmail.com Wed May 2 13:36:06 2012 From: alex.midence at gmail.com (Alex Midence) Date: Wed, 2 May 2012 08:36:06 -0500 Subject: [orca-list] Call for testing: Orca 3.4.1 in Ubuntu precise proposed updates. In-Reply-To: <20120502015820.GC3386@acapella> References: <20120502015820.GC3386@acapella> Message-ID: I'll post on there. I am running Orca 3.4.1 from the proposed ppa. alex M On 5/1/12, Luke Yelavich wrote: > Hi folks, > I am aware many of you are running Ubuntu precise at the moment, and are > running orca 3.4.1 in some way or other, whether you built it yourself, or > used packages from precise-proposed. However you are using it, I would ask > that you please give your testing feedback on the following Launchpad bug, > which is to get orca 3.4.1 into precise-updates. > https://launchpad.net/bugs/988685. If you are using precise, and are not > running orca 3.4.1 yet, there are instructions in the bug report as to how > to install the proposed orca 3.4.1 package update. The more positive > reports, the quicker we can get the update verified and pushed out to a > wider audience. > > Thanks in advance for your time. > > Luke > _______________________________________________ > orca-list mailing list > orca-list at gnome.org > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list > Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. > The manual is at > http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html > The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions > Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org > Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp > From petra at access-for-all.ch Fri May 4 14:37:39 2012 From: petra at access-for-all.ch (Petra Ritter) Date: Fri, 04 May 2012 16:37:39 +0200 Subject: orca immediately quitting in login screen. In-Reply-To: <4FA16EE4.7080201@vol.at> References: <4FA13A6B.50600@gmail.com> <4FA16EE4.7080201@vol.at> Message-ID: <4FA3E9B3.90809@access-for-all.ch> Hi, Am 02.05.2012 19:29, schrieb Simon Eigeldinger: > hi, > > can confirm that over here too. > don't know if this just happening since the update though but its > happenening. > > greetings, > simon The same to me. First I thought it was because I rune Ubuntu 12.04 in VMware Player 4.0.2. I have to test it on my notebook where I have in meenteme uptaated to Ubuntu 12.04. Petra From hammera at pickup.hu Fri May 4 15:16:58 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Fri, 04 May 2012 17:16:58 +0200 Subject: orca immediately quitting in login screen. In-Reply-To: <4FA3E9B3.90809@access-for-all.ch> References: <4FA13A6B.50600@gmail.com> <4FA16EE4.7080201@vol.at> <4FA3E9B3.90809@access-for-all.ch> Message-ID: <4FA3F2EA.1090802@pickup.hu> Hy, Not full sure this, but I experienced this problem first with Orca 3.4.0, so I think this problem is independent the proposed update. I reported this issue with following report since april 2th: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/971316 Unfortunately Orca debug.out file not showing any interesting informations with help determining why happening this problem. I not known few informations: 1. When Orca exiting in Unity greeter, still checked the screen reader support in A11y related indicator menu? 2. When this problem are happening, temporary doesn't changing the LightDm user screen reader related GSettings key value? I think this is not happening, because if I logging in without screen reader support and log out, Orca launching fine without I need press CTRL+S keystroke. Attila From ka1cey at gmail.com Fri May 4 15:20:23 2012 From: ka1cey at gmail.com (Dave Hunt) Date: Fri, 04 May 2012 11:20:23 -0400 Subject: orca immediately quitting in login screen. In-Reply-To: <4FA3F2EA.1090802@pickup.hu> References: <4FA13A6B.50600@gmail.com> <4FA16EE4.7080201@vol.at> <4FA3E9B3.90809@access-for-all.ch> <4FA3F2EA.1090802@pickup.hu> Message-ID: <4FA3F3B7.1030703@gmail.com> The problem seems to have gone away as mysteriously as it first appeared. Also, the lightdm password entry field now behaves as it should--orca says "star" for characters typed into it. -D. H. On 05/04/2012 11:16 AM, Hammer Attila wrote: > Hy, > > Not full sure this, but I experienced this problem first with Orca > 3.4.0, so I think this > problem is independent the proposed update. > I reported this issue with following report since april 2th: From nadine.ledwig at googlemail.com Fri May 4 15:39:09 2012 From: nadine.ledwig at googlemail.com (Nadine Ledwig) Date: Fri, 04 May 2012 17:39:09 +0200 Subject: Unity-3D and accessibility Message-ID: <4FA3F81D.1060407@googlemail.com> Hello, I'm highly sight impaired, and the last two years, I was used to use ubuntu 10.4 with orca and the compiz plugins eZoom-Desktop and negativeplugin. Now, i installed ubuntu 12.04 on my desktop and I've some problems. In unity-2d, dash and louncher works well, but i can not zoom and invert colors. Without that two features, it is hard to use my computer for me. In unity-3d, i configured that two plugins and it works well. But, dash, louncher, and the alt+tab task switcher are not spoken by orca and not zoomed. That means, they are nearly unusable for me. I can only open the dash, starting to type and press enter, and hope the right application will start. Is there an aditional package to make unity-3d accessible for orca? Or is it possible to use unity-2d in conjunction with compiz? Hope for help, Nadine From pavarinboat at gmail.com Fri May 4 17:22:32 2012 From: pavarinboat at gmail.com (Pavarin Bhandtivej) Date: Sat, 5 May 2012 00:22:32 +0700 Subject: Unity-3D and accessibility In-Reply-To: <4FA3F81D.1060407@googlemail.com> References: <4FA3F81D.1060407@googlemail.com> Message-ID: <-3862742624882617549@unknownmsgid> Hi! I found a solution for you here. Hope it helps! http://ubuntuforums.org/printthread.php?t=1852041 Boat On 4 พ.ค. 2555, at 22:39, Nadine Ledwig wrote: > Hello, > > I'm highly sight impaired, and the last two years, I was used to use ubuntu 10.4 with orca and the compiz plugins eZoom-Desktop and negativeplugin. > > Now, i installed ubuntu 12.04 on my desktop and I've some problems. > In unity-2d, dash and louncher works well, but i can not zoom and invert colors. Without that two features, it is hard to use my computer for me. > In unity-3d, i configured that two plugins and it works well. But, dash, louncher, and the alt+tab task switcher are not spoken by orca and not zoomed. That means, they are nearly unusable for me. > I can only open the dash, starting to type and press enter, and hope the right application will start. > > Is there an aditional package to make unity-3d accessible for orca? Or is it possible to use unity-2d in conjunction with compiz? > > > > Hope for help, > Nadine > > > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility From alanbell at ubuntu.com Fri May 4 19:33:28 2012 From: alanbell at ubuntu.com (Alan Bell) Date: Fri, 04 May 2012 20:33:28 +0100 Subject: Unity-3D and accessibility In-Reply-To: <4FA3F81D.1060407@googlemail.com> References: <4FA3F81D.1060407@googlemail.com> Message-ID: <4FA42F08.2080201@ubuntu.com> On 04/05/12 16:39, Nadine Ledwig wrote: > Hello, > > I'm highly sight impaired, and the last two years, I was used to use > ubuntu 10.4 with orca and the compiz plugins eZoom-Desktop and > negativeplugin. > > Now, i installed ubuntu 12.04 on my desktop and I've some problems. > In unity-2d, dash and louncher works well, but i can not zoom and > invert colors. Without that two features, it is hard to use my > computer for me. > In unity-3d, i configured that two plugins and it works well. But, > dash, louncher, and the alt+tab task switcher are not spoken by orca > and not zoomed. That means, they are nearly unusable for me. > I can only open the dash, starting to type and press enter, and hope > the right application will start. > > Is there an aditional package to make unity-3d accessible for orca? Or > is it possible to use unity-2d in conjunction with compiz? > > > > Hope for help, > Nadine > > unity3d is somewhat accessible with orca, but as you note the dash and some other stuff isn't really working. Zooming doesn't work on the panel and launcher (except for the badly implemented and annoying top bar shadow . . .) because that is all drawn through the nux toolkit which is unaffected by any compiz transforms. I know this is really bad for a huge number of people with mild to moderate vision issues (almost certainly our largest group of users of assistive tools - basically anyone who might wear glasses and enjoy the large print section of the local library) and I will be raising this at the Ubuntu Developer summit next week. unity2d with compiz might be a better strategy, and in fact unity2d with the Wayland compositor might be the real way forward, I have been talking to the wayland developers about accessibility including orca and zoom and text cursor tracking zoom and colour filters, it is important to get this stuff in as early as possible and designed in, rather than tacked on afterwards. With features like the HUD landing broken and the global menus all being checkbox menu items until we got the hint set right and the shortcut overlay being totally inaccessible it is clear that accessibility isn't being designed in early enough to new features and this is creating more unbudgeted work as people try to fix the broken stuff that was never designed to be accessible. Alan. -- I work at http://libertus.co.uk From rkcole72984 at gmail.com Sat May 5 08:35:21 2012 From: rkcole72984 at gmail.com (Robert Cole) Date: Sat, 05 May 2012 01:35:21 -0700 Subject: Unity-3D and accessibility In-Reply-To: <4FA42F08.2080201@ubuntu.com> References: <4FA3F81D.1060407@googlemail.com> <4FA42F08.2080201@ubuntu.com> Message-ID: <4FA4E649.4040004@gmail.com> I would strongly second Alan's suggestion of using Compiz under Unity 2D. This is actually what I do when I want and need to use magnification, and it works quite well. I have had little if any problems with this at all. The Negative plugin works as well. Also, if you get frustrated with the launcher popping up when you are reading things which are close to the left of the screen, you can right-click on your desktop, select Change Desktop Background, go to the Behavior tab in the window which appears, turn on the option labelled Auto-hide the Launcher, and set the option for Reveal location to "Top left corner". This will make it much more comfortable and hassle free when it comes to panning and reading documents. I hope that this is helpful to you. Take care. On 05/04/2012 12:33 PM, Alan Bell wrote: > On 04/05/12 16:39, Nadine Ledwig wrote: >> Hello, >> >> I'm highly sight impaired, and the last two years, I was used to >> use ubuntu 10.4 with orca and the compiz plugins eZoom-Desktop and >> negativeplugin. >> >> Now, i installed ubuntu 12.04 on my desktop and I've some problems. >> In unity-2d, dash and louncher works well, but i can not zoom and >> invert colors. Without that two features, it is hard to use my >> computer for me. >> In unity-3d, i configured that two plugins and it works well. But, >> dash, louncher, and the alt+tab task switcher are not spoken by orca >> and not zoomed. That means, they are nearly unusable for me. >> I can only open the dash, starting to type and press enter, and hope >> the right application will start. >> >> Is there an aditional package to make unity-3d accessible for orca? >> Or is it possible to use unity-2d in conjunction with compiz? >> >> >> >> Hope for help, >> Nadine >> >> > unity3d is somewhat accessible with orca, but as you note the dash and > some other stuff isn't really working. Zooming doesn't work on the > panel and launcher (except for the badly implemented and annoying top > bar shadow . . .) because that is all drawn through the nux toolkit > which is unaffected by any compiz transforms. I know this is really > bad for a huge number of people with mild to moderate vision issues > (almost certainly our largest group of users of assistive tools - > basically anyone who might wear glasses and enjoy the large print > section of the local library) and I will be raising this at the Ubuntu > Developer summit next week. > > unity2d with compiz might be a better strategy, and in fact unity2d > with the Wayland compositor might be the real way forward, I have been > talking to the wayland developers about accessibility including orca > and zoom and text cursor tracking zoom and colour filters, it is > important to get this stuff in as early as possible and designed in, > rather than tacked on afterwards. With features like the HUD landing > broken and the global menus all being checkbox menu items until we got > the hint set right and the shortcut overlay being totally inaccessible > it is clear that accessibility isn't being designed in early enough to > new features and this is creating more unbudgeted work as people try > to fix the broken stuff that was never designed to be accessible. > > Alan. > From milton at tomaatnet.nl Sat May 5 20:26:37 2012 From: milton at tomaatnet.nl (Milton) Date: Sat, 5 May 2012 22:26:37 +0200 Subject: Orca in Ubuntu Precise refuses the top panel Message-ID: <4D6E3B74CE5B49F3AE1F33B4EA891400@milton> Hello all, I did a fresh install of Precise with Orca and updated succesfully the system. So now Orca 3.4.1 is running. LibreOffice Calc has problems running well but after I quit Orca and start Orca again by using AltF2 and typing orca Calc runs well. But then Alt_F10 to go to the top panel will not work. Is this a known problem and how can I solve this? Milton -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From milton at tomaatnet.nl Sat May 5 20:29:59 2012 From: milton at tomaatnet.nl (Milton) Date: Sat, 5 May 2012 22:29:59 +0200 Subject: how can I activate the login sound in Precise? Message-ID: <5EF0D73329A745E0AA086F859C8F0A93@milton> Hello all, I went to the sound settings and also the startup settings but how can I activate the login sound? Milton -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chaltain at gmail.com Sat May 5 21:13:30 2012 From: chaltain at gmail.com (Christopher Chaltain) Date: Sat, 05 May 2012 16:13:30 -0500 Subject: how can I activate the login sound in Precise? In-Reply-To: <5EF0D73329A745E0AA086F859C8F0A93@milton> References: <5EF0D73329A745E0AA086F859C8F0A93@milton> Message-ID: <4FA597FA.6030802@gmail.com> Add the following command to startup applications: /usr/bin/canberra-gtk-play --id="desktop-login" --description="GNOME Login" On 05/05/12 15:29, Milton wrote: > Hello all, > I went to the sound settings and also the startup settings but how can I > activate the login sound? > Milton > -- Christopher (CJ) chaltain at gmail.com From milton at tomaatnet.nl Sun May 6 09:16:24 2012 From: milton at tomaatnet.nl (Milton) Date: Sun, 6 May 2012 11:16:24 +0200 Subject: [orca-list] Orca in Ubuntu Precise refuses the top panel References: <4D6E3B74CE5B49F3AE1F33B4EA891400@milton> <4FA5967F.2060209@gmail.com> Message-ID: <1C8C4C6758334DE8A4D21EF76C8C800A@milton> Unity 2D ----- Original Message ----- From: Alex Midence To: Milton Cc: Orca-list at gnome.org ; ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2012 11:07 PM Subject: Re: [orca-list] Orca in Ubuntu Precise refuses the top panel What desktop are you running? Is it unity 2d, gnome-classic, gnome-shell? What are you using? Alex M On 05/05/2012 03:26 PM, Milton wrote: Hello all, I did a fresh install of Precise with Orca and updated succesfully the system. So now Orca 3.4.1 is running. LibreOffice Calc has problems running well but after I quit Orca and start Orca again by using AltF2 and typing orca Calc runs well. But then Alt_F10 to go to the top panel will not work. Is this a known problem and how can I solve this? Milton _______________________________________________ orca-list mailing list orca-list at gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. The manual is at http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From milton at tomaatnet.nl Sun May 6 10:26:39 2012 From: milton at tomaatnet.nl (Milton) Date: Sun, 6 May 2012 12:26:39 +0200 Subject: how can I activate the login sound in Precise? References: <5EF0D73329A745E0AA086F859C8F0A93@milton> <4FA597FA.6030802@gmail.com> Message-ID: Many thanks, it works. Milton ----- Original Message ----- From: "Christopher Chaltain" To: Sent: Saturday, May 05, 2012 11:13 PM Subject: Re: how can I activate the login sound in Precise? > Add the following command to startup applications: > > /usr/bin/canberra-gtk-play --id="desktop-login" --description="GNOME > Login" > > On 05/05/12 15:29, Milton wrote: >> Hello all, >> I went to the sound settings and also the startup settings but how can I >> activate the login sound? >> Milton >> > > > -- > Christopher (CJ) > chaltain at gmail.com > > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility From simon.eigeldinger at vol.at Sun May 6 10:30:49 2012 From: simon.eigeldinger at vol.at (Simon Eigeldinger) Date: Sun, 06 May 2012 12:30:49 +0200 Subject: Issues with the keys Message-ID: <4FA652D9.6030301@vol.at> Hi all, I noticed the following issue after a while when working on the ubuntu 12.04 release. In Unity 2d and orca 3.4.1 and i also guess on orca 3.4.0. After working with the system a while the system starts doing weird things with the keyboard. the alt key stops working like key combinations like alt+f4 stop to work and all other alt combinations. the alt key to open the HUD seems to continue to act as normal. Then the next step often is that orca looses its orca modifier key and then you have just the chance to partly fix that by restarting the machine. Wonder if someone has the same problem and has a fix for that? greetings, simon From milton at tomaatnet.nl Sun May 6 10:35:19 2012 From: milton at tomaatnet.nl (Milton) Date: Sun, 6 May 2012 12:35:19 +0200 Subject: Issues with the keys References: <4FA652D9.6030301@vol.at> Message-ID: I have similar problems in Unity 2D with Orca 3.4.1. Sometimes control_alt_rightarrow to go to the second worksheet will not work. Milton ----- Original Message ----- From: "Simon Eigeldinger" To: ; Sent: Sunday, May 06, 2012 12:30 PM Subject: Issues with the keys > Hi all, > > I noticed the following issue after a while when working on the ubuntu > 12.04 release. > In Unity 2d and orca 3.4.1 and i also guess on orca 3.4.0. > > After working with the system a while the system starts doing weird things > with the keyboard. the alt key stops working like key combinations like > alt+f4 stop to work and all other alt combinations. the alt key to open > the HUD seems to continue to act as normal. > > Then the next step often is that orca looses its orca modifier key and > then you have just the chance to partly fix that by restarting the > machine. > > Wonder if someone has the same problem and has a fix for that? > > greetings, > simon > > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility From milton at tomaatnet.nl Sun May 6 10:41:48 2012 From: milton at tomaatnet.nl (Milton) Date: Sun, 6 May 2012 12:41:48 +0200 Subject: how to install gnome-classic in Precise? Message-ID: <7C9EAA3C538E401791AE9BAD52895EFB@milton> I did a fresh install of Preciese and have 2 options Unity and Unity 2D. I guess I miss on this list how to install gnome-classic so I can have this option to continue as I could work in Ubuntu Natty while keep trying to use Unity 2D. How can I install gnome-classic and will it appear in the session list? Milton -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From milton at tomaatnet.nl Sun May 6 10:47:15 2012 From: milton at tomaatnet.nl (Milton) Date: Sun, 6 May 2012 12:47:15 +0200 Subject: how to use alt-f10 while application is running? Message-ID: <2D45E8C6899D42628743731B243F09BF@milton> In Prcies and Orca 3.4.1 Unity 2d, when an application is on the desktop I cannot run alt_f10 to go to the top panel. I guess the application has to been minimized, how to minimize an application? Or do I have to go to an empty worksheet? There are 2 worksheets running, how can I get more worksheet as it was very simple to do in Natty. Milton -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hammera at pickup.hu Sun May 6 12:57:30 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Sun, 06 May 2012 14:57:30 +0200 Subject: Issues with the keys In-Reply-To: References: <4FA652D9.6030301@vol.at> Message-ID: <4FA6753A.1060603@pickup.hu> Hy, If anybody experiencing the described keybindings related issue, looks following: Existing your ~/.gconf/apps/metacity folder? If yes, remove the ~/.gconf/apps/metacity folder and restart the system. Before you doing this, what output seeing in terminal if you run gnome-control-center keyboard command? Some time Metacity or any importanter component possible doing wrong gconf/gsettings data conversion. Usual when my machine happening similar keybindings related problems in GNOME3 fallback session I see following similar output result the gnome-control-center keyboard command in terminal: GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_workspace_left GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_workspace_right GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_workspace_up GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_workspace_down GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_windows GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_group GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_panels GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/cycle_windows GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/cycle_group GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/cycle_panels GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/show_desktop GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_to_workspace_left GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_to_workspace_right GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_to_workspace_up GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_to_workspace_down GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/panel_run_dialog GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/panel_main_menu GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/activate_window_menu GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/toggle_fullscreen GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/toggle_maximized GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/maximize GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/unmaximize GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/toggle_shaded GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/close GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/minimize GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/begin_move GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/begin_resize GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/toggle_on_all_workspaces GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/raise_or_lower GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/raise GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/lower GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/maximize_vertically GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/maximize_horizontally I reported this issue oldest time with Metacity package since march 15th, report link is following: https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/955876 If you seeing similar output when you run gnome-control-center keyboard command in terminal, click following direct link to mark this bug affects you too, and click the change button: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/metacity/+bug/955876/+affectsmetoo If you not stored important custom settings with Metacity related, until this bug is not fixed, I suggest you add the startup manager a script with always remove the .gconf/apps/metacity folder if this folder are exist. Attila From milton at tomaatnet.nl Sun May 6 14:04:52 2012 From: milton at tomaatnet.nl (Milton) Date: Sun, 6 May 2012 16:04:52 +0200 Subject: how to install gnome-classic in Precise? References: <7C9EAA3C538E401791AE9BAD52895EFB@milton> Message-ID: <6E3193F5012441D0B6CFF739C7D46650@milton> Fortunately I find the answer on my question. I did in Ubuntu software center: gnome-session-fallback ----- Original Message ----- From: Milton To: ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com Sent: Sunday, May 06, 2012 12:41 PM Subject: how to install gnome-classic in Precise? I did a fresh install of Preciese and have 2 options Unity and Unity 2D. I guess I miss on this list how to install gnome-classic so I can have this option to continue as I could work in Ubuntu Natty while keep trying to use Unity 2D. How can I install gnome-classic and will it appear in the session list? Milton ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ -- Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From burt1iband at gmail.com Sun May 6 17:55:51 2012 From: burt1iband at gmail.com (bando?ers) Date: Sun, 6 May 2012 12:55:51 -0500 Subject: Issues with the keys In-Reply-To: <4FA6753A.1060603@pickup.hu> References: <4FA652D9.6030301@vol.at> <4FA6753A.1060603@pickup.hu> Message-ID: <20120506175549.GA16496@gmail.com> Aren these errors specific to gnome fallback, or do they occur with Unity 2d as well? Regards, -- B..H. On Sun, May 06, 2012 at 02:57:30PM +0200, Hammer Attila wrote: > Hy, > > If anybody experiencing the described keybindings related issue, > looks following: > Existing your ~/.gconf/apps/metacity folder? > If yes, remove the ~/.gconf/apps/metacity folder and restart the system. > Before you doing this, what output seeing in terminal if you run > gnome-control-center keyboard command? > Some time Metacity or any importanter component possible doing wrong > gconf/gsettings data conversion. Usual when my machine happening > similar keybindings related problems in GNOME3 fallback session I > see following similar output result the gnome-control-center > keyboard command in terminal: > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_workspace_left > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_workspace_right > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_workspace_up > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_workspace_down > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_windows > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_group > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_panels > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/cycle_windows > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/cycle_group > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/cycle_panels > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/show_desktop > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_to_workspace_left > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_to_workspace_right > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_to_workspace_up > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/switch_to_workspace_down > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/panel_run_dialog > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/global_keybindings/panel_main_menu > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/activate_window_menu > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/toggle_fullscreen > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/toggle_maximized > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/maximize > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/unmaximize > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/toggle_shaded > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/close > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/minimize > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/begin_move > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/begin_resize > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/toggle_on_all_workspaces > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/raise_or_lower > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/raise > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/lower > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/maximize_vertically > GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key > /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/maximize_horizontally > > I reported this issue oldest time with Metacity package since march > 15th, report link is following: > https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/955876 > If you seeing similar output when you run gnome-control-center > keyboard command in terminal, click following direct link to mark > this bug affects you too, and click the change button: > https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/metacity/+bug/955876/+affectsmetoo > > If you not stored important custom settings with Metacity related, > until this bug is not fixed, I suggest you add the startup manager a > script with always remove the .gconf/apps/metacity folder if this > folder are exist. > > Attila > > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility From rkcole72984 at gmail.com Sun May 6 23:56:29 2012 From: rkcole72984 at gmail.com (Robert Cole) Date: Sun, 06 May 2012 16:56:29 -0700 Subject: how to install gnome-classic in Precise? In-Reply-To: <7C9EAA3C538E401791AE9BAD52895EFB@milton> References: <7C9EAA3C538E401791AE9BAD52895EFB@milton> Message-ID: <4FA70FAD.7040402@gmail.com> Hello, Milton. I think you just need to run: sudo apt-get install gnome-session-fallback This will install the GNOME Classic environment. I hope that this helps. Take care. On 05/06/2012 03:41 AM, Milton wrote: > I did a fresh install of Preciese and have 2 options Unity and Unity > 2D. I guess I miss on this list how to install gnome-classic so I can > have this option to continue as I could work in Ubuntu Natty while > keep trying to use Unity 2D. How can I install gnome-classic and will > it appear in the session list? > Milton > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From krmane at gmail.com Mon May 7 07:15:46 2012 From: krmane at gmail.com (krishnakant Mane) Date: Mon, 7 May 2012 12:45:46 +0530 Subject: Issues with the keys In-Reply-To: <4FA652D9.6030301@vol.at> References: <4FA652D9.6030301@vol.at> Message-ID: The only thing I find irritating these days with 12.04 is that Orca has a hard time working with nautilus. If one has to browse through home folder or documents etc, Orca takes a lot of time to respond to the navigation using arrow keys. Else all is working fine, at least at my end. Happy hacking. Krishnakant. On 06/05/2012, Simon Eigeldinger wrote: > Hi all, > > I noticed the following issue after a while when working on the ubuntu > 12.04 release. > In Unity 2d and orca 3.4.1 and i also guess on orca 3.4.0. > > After working with the system a while the system starts doing weird > things with the keyboard. the alt key stops working like key > combinations like alt+f4 stop to work and all other alt combinations. > the alt key to open the HUD seems to continue to act as normal. > > Then the next step often is that orca looses its orca modifier key and > then you have just the chance to partly fix that by restarting the machine. > > Wonder if someone has the same problem and has a fix for that? > > greetings, > simon > > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility > From hammera at pickup.hu Mon May 7 07:30:00 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Mon, 07 May 2012 09:30:00 +0200 Subject: Issues with the keys In-Reply-To: References: <4FA652D9.6030301@vol.at> Message-ID: <4FA779F8.5060809@pickup.hu> Hy, Try you switch off the side pane in the view menu. My experiences if side pane is turned off, Nautilus presenting more faster for example the HOME folder content. I reported this issue with following report: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=673632 Attila From alex.midence at gmail.com Sat May 5 21:07:11 2012 From: alex.midence at gmail.com (Alex Midence) Date: Sat, 05 May 2012 16:07:11 -0500 Subject: [orca-list] Orca in Ubuntu Precise refuses the top panel In-Reply-To: <4D6E3B74CE5B49F3AE1F33B4EA891400@milton> References: <4D6E3B74CE5B49F3AE1F33B4EA891400@milton> Message-ID: <4FA5967F.2060209@gmail.com> What desktop are you running? Is it unity 2d, gnome-classic, gnome-shell? What are you using? Alex M On 05/05/2012 03:26 PM, Milton wrote: > Hello all, > I did a fresh install of Precise with Orca and updated succesfully the > system. So now Orca 3.4.1 is running. LibreOffice Calc has problems > running well but after I quit Orca and start Orca again by using AltF2 > and typing orca Calc runs well. But then Alt_F10 to go to the top > panel will not work. Is this a known problem and how can I solve this? > Milton > > > _______________________________________________ > orca-list mailing list > orca-list at gnome.org > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list > Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. > The manual is at http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html > The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions > Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org > Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From milton at tomaatnet.nl Tue May 8 15:46:34 2012 From: milton at tomaatnet.nl (Milton) Date: Tue, 8 May 2012 17:46:34 +0200 Subject: many thanks to you developers Message-ID: <06EB5AB2E08A4E9A8EAE20AF62A4B904@milton> Hi all, Many thanks to all Orca and Ubuntu devlopers. Today after updating my system and define the keys in the keyboard application for alt_f4 alt_tab etc I like to work in Precise Unity 2D with Orca 3.4.1. In LibreOffice Calc I can do my thing, Firefox etc. Milton -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From krmane at gmail.com Tue May 8 16:19:08 2012 From: krmane at gmail.com (Krishnakant mane) Date: Tue, 8 May 2012 21:49:08 +0530 Subject: [orca-list] many thanks to you developers In-Reply-To: <06EB5AB2E08A4E9A8EAE20AF62A4B904@milton> References: <06EB5AB2E08A4E9A8EAE20AF62A4B904@milton> Message-ID: <20120508161908.GA3262@kk-thinkpad> Hi Miltan, So what all keyboard commands you have set? happy hacking. Krishnakant. On Tue, May 08, 2012 at 05:46:34PM +0200, Milton wrote: > Hi all, > Many thanks to all Orca and Ubuntu devlopers. Today after updating my system and define the keys in the keyboard application for alt_f4 alt_tab etc I like to work in Precise Unity 2D with Orca 3.4.1. In LibreOffice Calc I can do my thing, Firefox etc. > Milton > _______________________________________________ > orca-list mailing list > orca-list at gnome.org > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list > Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. > The manual is at http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html > The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions > Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org > Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp From milton at tomaatnet.nl Tue May 8 20:18:00 2012 From: milton at tomaatnet.nl (Milton) Date: Tue, 8 May 2012 22:18:00 +0200 Subject: [orca-list] many thanks to you developers References: <06EB5AB2E08A4E9A8EAE20AF62A4B904@milton> <20120508161908.GA3262@kk-thinkpad> Message-ID: Hi Krishnakant, alt_f4 for closing windows, alt_tab for switching between windows, control_super-d for minimizing windows. So I can use alt_f10 to get to the top panel. In the keyboard application you find the list for all options. Milton ----- Original Message ----- From: "Krishnakant mane" To: "Milton" Cc: ; Sent: Tuesday, May 08, 2012 6:19 PM Subject: Re: [orca-list] many thanks to you developers > Hi Miltan, > So what all keyboard commands you have set? > happy hacking. > Krishnakant. > On Tue, May 08, 2012 at 05:46:34PM +0200, Milton wrote: >> Hi all, >> Many thanks to all Orca and Ubuntu devlopers. Today after updating my >> system and define the keys in the keyboard application for alt_f4 alt_tab >> etc I like to work in Precise Unity 2D with Orca 3.4.1. In LibreOffice >> Calc I can do my thing, Firefox etc. >> Milton > >> _______________________________________________ >> orca-list mailing list >> orca-list at gnome.org >> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list >> Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. >> The manual is at >> http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html >> The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions >> Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org >> Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp > From ethanak at polip.com Wed May 9 06:03:56 2012 From: ethanak at polip.com (Bohdan R. Rau) Date: Wed, 09 May 2012 07:03:56 +0100 Subject: Funny bug :) Message-ID: <9c8124e47bf74ce67906b7c640a45e26@mail.setia.pl> Current Ubuntu 12.04 on VirtualBox, all yesterdays updates installed... 1) In the evening log into "gnome classic no effects" session. Do something whatever you want. Do not logout, simply leave your machine turned on and go to sleep before midnight. 2) In the morning, when you wake up and eat good breakfast, go to your machine. Screen probably will be locked, so enter your password to unlock it. 3) Ctrl-alt tab to upper panel, tab twice to indicator, right some times to current hour. Surprize! Orca reads current time, but yesterdays date! Is it possible to reproduce this behaviour? ethanak -- http://milena.polip.com/ - Pa pa, Ivonko! From tony.bernedal at gmail.com Wed May 9 17:24:09 2012 From: tony.bernedal at gmail.com (Tony Bernedal) Date: Wed, 9 May 2012 19:24:09 +0200 Subject: Keybindings completely gone Message-ID: <05B0BEF6-1A5E-44D6-B3BA-669C1CB27CD2@gmail.com> Hi everyone. I tried gnome classic and after a while I dicided to go back to unity 2d. After going back all keybindings are totaly gone. I have on my laptop a running version of ubuntu with unity 2d so my question is, where is the keybindings stored and can I copy them over to my desktop and get all back again? Regards Tony Med vänlig hälsning Tony Bernedal tony.bernedal at gmail.com Twitter @sm5xgp Blogg samt tips och trix om it, datorer och andra tekniska prylar för synskadade www.tbteknik.se From vilmar at informal.com.br Wed May 9 18:18:56 2012 From: vilmar at informal.com.br (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jos=E9_Vilmar_Est=E1cio_de_Souza?=) Date: Wed, 09 May 2012 15:18:56 -0300 Subject: Keybindings completely gone In-Reply-To: <05B0BEF6-1A5E-44D6-B3BA-669C1CB27CD2@gmail.com> References: <05B0BEF6-1A5E-44D6-B3BA-669C1CB27CD2@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4FAAB510.1030801@informal.com.br> Hi Tony. I had a similar problem but it was solved removing the folloing folder: .gconf/apps/metacity It is present in your home directory. I think that you need reboot the system after remove the folder. Probably a good idea is to do a backup of the folder before the remove. On 05/09/2012 02:24 PM, Tony Bernedal wrote: > Hi everyone. > I tried gnome classic and after a while I dicided to go back to unity 2d. > After going back all keybindings are totaly gone. > I have on my laptop a running version of ubuntu with unity 2d so my question is, where is the keybindings stored and can I copy them over to my desktop and get all back again? > Regards Tony > > Med vänlig hälsning > Tony Bernedal > tony.bernedal at gmail.com > Twitter @sm5xgp > Blogg samt tips och trix om it, datorer och andra tekniska prylar > för synskadade > www.tbteknik.se > > > > > From themuso at ubuntu.com Wed May 9 21:25:47 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Wed, 9 May 2012 14:25:47 -0700 Subject: Ubuntu 12.10 and beyond, Unity 2D will no longer be maintained. Message-ID: <20120509212547.GB4660@acapella> Hi all, So as some of you may have heard, Canonical has plans to stop maintaining unity 2D in future development cycles. This makes sense because spending double the resources trying to keep 2 desktops in feature parity is a lot of work, and those resources can be used much better elsewhere. The downside of course, is accessibility. Unity 3D accessibility still needs some work to get to feature parity with Unity 2D, but once this work is done, it shouldn't be a problem keeping things working in the future. So, i will be working on improving Unity 3D accessibility in the future development cycles. I am not going to promise that it will be done by 12.10, although I would like it to be, but thats not my goal. My goal is to get Unity 3D accessibility ready for 14.04 LTS. I feel that unless you really understand how to get set up, and unbreak your system, and deal with accessibility bugs, you should stick to the ubuntu LTS releases. Once Vinux 4 gets released, there will be a distro based on Ubuntu LTS, that will be kept up to date with all the latest in accessibility fixes, so that you don't need to keep updating to the interim Ubuntu releases, and risk breaking your usable system. Luke From luke.yelavich at canonical.com Wed May 9 22:14:21 2012 From: luke.yelavich at canonical.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Wed, 9 May 2012 15:14:21 -0700 Subject: [orca-list] Ubuntu 12.10 and beyond, Unity 2D will no longer be maintained. In-Reply-To: <006401cd2e2e$dce71f00$96b55d00$@gmail.com> References: <20120509212547.GB4660@acapella> <006401cd2e2e$dce71f00$96b55d00$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20120509221420.GA14687@acapella> On Wed, May 09, 2012 at 02:58:25PM PDT, Alex Midence wrote: > Hi, Luke, > > Do you or, for that matter, any of the other members on this list know if the terminal is accessible from Unity 3d? yes, GNOME terminal is accessible from Unity 3D, assuming the shortcut to load GNOME terminal is set and working, i.e press Control + Alt + T to load the terminal. Luke From themuso at ubuntu.com Wed May 9 22:56:26 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Wed, 9 May 2012 15:56:26 -0700 Subject: More on desktop shells, 2D vs 3D, and the future. Message-ID: <20120509225626.GB14687@acapella> Hi all, I've seen much discussion recently about the various desktop shells that are available on Linux, particularly those that are accessible, or will be accessible in the future. I think its worth outlining what shells we have, their accessibility status, and their graphical hardware requirements. Unity: Till now, there have been 2 flavours of Unity, a 2D flavour built on QT, and a 3D flavour, using a custom developed graphical widget toolkit sitting on compiz. As per my previous mail, Unity 2D development is being discontinued. Unity 2D has more forgiving graphics hardware requirements. It doesn't perform any 3D rendering of onscreen elements by default, and can therefore work on graphics hardware that is several years old, and can work on video hardware that doesn't have a 3D driver present on the system, i.e proprietary NVIDIA and AMD/ATI video drivers. Unity 3D performs a lot of 3D graphics rendering. The launcher, the dash, and the top panel are all rendered in real time using 3D enabled graphics hardware. For unity 3D to work, you need to have 3D drivers present, either open source drivers for Intel/AMD and for some NVIDIA hardware, Nouveau. Unity 3D will work on all NVIDIA hardware if you install the proprietary NVIDIA drivers. Unity 2D accessibility is almost 100% complete, however again as per my previous mail, Unity 2D development is being discontinued. unity 3D accessibility works partially, althogh I believe some of that is broken at the moment. I will be workin to improve Unity 3D accessibility by the next LTS release of Ubuntu. Unity 2D development is not only being stopped to reallocate resources. There are technical reasons why Unity 3D will be the focus from here on out. See the end of this email for my explanation. GNOME shell: Very similar to Unity 3D in terms of hardware requirements and rendering. It renders UI elements in 3D using 3D capable graphics hardware, and needs the same drivers to be present to work. There is no non-3D version of GNOME shell. As of GNOME shell 3.4, GNOME shell is quite usable with Orca. Some areas, particularly the top panel still need work, but users are able to launch and search for applications. GNOME classic, aka GNOME fallback: Classic GNOME is used in GNOME distributions as a fallback for those who do not have a hardware and software combination that allows 3D graphics rendering to work. Classic GNOME has a very similar look and feel to GNOME 2. This environment is still just as accessible as GNOME 2 was. I believe that GNOME classic/GNOME fallback is also going away in the longer term. My technical explanation at the end of this email outlines why. KDE: KDE uses the QT widget toolkit. I believe that KDE does use 3D rendering by default, although this may be incorrect. It also may be possible to disable 3D graphics rendering, although again I am not 100% sure. Whilst QT accessibility is improving, more work is needed to improve KDE's accessibility, as KDE has many custom elements that need to be enabled for accessibility. We will have accessible KDe applications before we have the whole desktop accessible, which is still good enough, given our other desktop shell choices. XFCE: XFCE is a light weight desktop environment, that does not use 3D graphics rendering by default, although this may be incorrect, and may change in the future. XFCE has a similar look and feel to Classic GNOME/GNOME 2. XFCE is already somewhat accessible with Orca, as it uses GTK2, however much work is needed to improve keyboard navigation and better present custom widgets to Orca. 3D desktop rendering is the future, whether we like it or not. This is being done because today's graphics hardware can do quite powerful and complex rendering, and taking advantage of this for the desktop means less work is put onto the CPU to show the desktop, and it is much more pleasant visually to see a window gradually fade/slide onto the screen, rather than watch a flickery display update as the desktop is used. Windows and Mac OS X have rendered their desktops using 3D for many years now, and all mobile devices based on Android and IOS use 3D rendering for interface display. So why are Unity 2D and possibly GNOME fallback/Classic going away? The short answer is that thanks to new developments, it will be possible to use the CPu to render the same 3D effects and UI elements. Yes, this will put more work onto the CPU, but the thinking is that this will be satisfactory for the user to then go ahead and update/install the required drivers for their hardware, thereby offloading the 3D rendering work to the hardware, as originally desired by the desktop shell developers. These desktops will not be requiring very new graphics hardware just yet. In fact Unity 3D can be run on graphics hardware that is 7 to 8 years old, maybe even earlier, depending on the amount of video memory present on the hardware in question. For a practicle example, I have successfully run Unity 3D on a Radeon 9000 mobile GPU with 64MB of video memory, which is from 2003-2004, give or take. it wasn't fast, but it worked and everything appeared to be rendered without issue. I also think certain Radeon 7500 chips can also render Unity 3D, but am not 100% sure. We can't keep supporting really old hardware forever, and compliant hardware from the last 6 years is quite easily available now at cheap prices if you are willing to buy second hand hardware, hense the move to 3D, and the desire to make our desktop shells more efficient in their hardware use. I hope this helps clear a few things up for people who are wondering. Any questions, feel free to ask, and if you have any corrections, please feel free to reply and correct me. Luke From cjk at teamcharliesangels.com Wed May 9 23:12:17 2012 From: cjk at teamcharliesangels.com (Charlie Kravetz) Date: Wed, 9 May 2012 17:12:17 -0600 Subject: Ubuntu 12.10 and beyond, Unity 2D will no longer be maintained. In-Reply-To: <20120509212547.GB4660@acapella> References: <20120509212547.GB4660@acapella> Message-ID: <20120509171217.135407a4@teamcharliesangels.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Wed, 9 May 2012 14:25:47 -0700 Luke Yelavich wrote: > Hi all, > So as some of you may have heard, Canonical has plans to stop maintaining unity 2D in future development cycles. This makes sense because spending double the resources trying to keep 2 desktops in feature parity is a lot of work, and those resources can be used much better elsewhere. The downside of course, is accessibility. Unity 3D accessibility still needs some work to get to feature parity with Unity 2D, but once this work is done, it shouldn't be a problem keeping things working in the future. > > So, i will be working on improving Unity 3D accessibility in the future development cycles. I am not going to promise that it will be done by 12.10, although I would like it to be, but thats not my goal. My goal is to get Unity 3D accessibility ready for 14.04 LTS. > > I feel that unless you really understand how to get set up, and unbreak your system, and deal with accessibility bugs, you should stick to the ubuntu LTS releases. Once Vinux 4 gets released, there will be a distro based on Ubuntu LTS, that will be kept up to date with all the latest in accessibility fixes, so that you don't need to keep updating to the interim Ubuntu releases, and risk breaking your usable system. > > Luke > Thank you for these updates, Luke. I will be ready to test any updates during the normal development cycle that you tested. Since I have more than one system, I will always have a working system to fall back on. - -- Charlie Kravetz Linux Registered User Number 425914 [http://counter.li.org/] Never let anyone steal your DREAM. [http://keepingdreams.com] -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJPqvnSAAoJEFNEIRz9dxbAOrcH/3TYkVPygXLhrZF35TNyvfm1 i17basybKquv0ED9EIuUocMUIlID+iUEwZPunjeO2ANr/R4z/Hiwh7SBiLNWtvLx nuc3pOHleEICg3cuTiC0M4jE9472u86XeCgHQhpIa608upRo+Fuolx7cD3X5VWFf TacCsZxIdf33lurgJBKL9Xz5OBzJLuvx8j1dqj2F/+mj93whaRf8JEQhSt8aokSO I3FFzbZXPJBdauQxRc1ERJuu4vKdC8vtYtsqwoqpwHoap4GIUdbTU07cb5dTXx3Y etfYGn1rZ4F+zE3D+LfQyrc3E8eEx4yMwXDU/DyXf0OhtdK0R8mOHbLa2HfKQRw= =iggf -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From alex.midence at gmail.com Wed May 9 21:58:25 2012 From: alex.midence at gmail.com (Alex Midence) Date: Wed, 9 May 2012 16:58:25 -0500 Subject: [orca-list] Ubuntu 12.10 and beyond, Unity 2D will no longer be maintained. In-Reply-To: <20120509212547.GB4660@acapella> References: <20120509212547.GB4660@acapella> Message-ID: <006401cd2e2e$dce71f00$96b55d00$@gmail.com> Hi, Luke, Do you or, for that matter, any of the other members on this list know if the terminal is accessible from Unity 3d? If so, all someone would have to do if they want to keep up with the latest developments would be to install gnome shell or, who knows, even KDE by that time using the terminal. That way, you aren't stuck in the lts's and can take advantage of other accessibility fixes that come about in gnome itself where the developers of a particular app fix something that was making their app non Orca friendly. Br, Alex M -----Original Message----- From: orca-list-bounces at gnome.org [mailto:orca-list-bounces at gnome.org] On Behalf Of Luke Yelavich Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2012 4:26 PM To: Orca-list at gnome.org; Ubuntu Accessibility Mailing List Subject: [orca-list] Ubuntu 12.10 and beyond, Unity 2D will no longer be maintained. Hi all, So as some of you may have heard, Canonical has plans to stop maintaining unity 2D in future development cycles. This makes sense because spending double the resources trying to keep 2 desktops in feature parity is a lot of work, and those resources can be used much better elsewhere. The downside of course, is accessibility. Unity 3D accessibility still needs some work to get to feature parity with Unity 2D, but once this work is done, it shouldn't be a problem keeping things working in the future. So, i will be working on improving Unity 3D accessibility in the future development cycles. I am not going to promise that it will be done by 12.10, although I would like it to be, but thats not my goal. My goal is to get Unity 3D accessibility ready for 14.04 LTS. I feel that unless you really understand how to get set up, and unbreak your system, and deal with accessibility bugs, you should stick to the ubuntu LTS releases. Once Vinux 4 gets released, there will be a distro based on Ubuntu LTS, that will be kept up to date with all the latest in accessibility fixes, so that you don't need to keep updating to the interim Ubuntu releases, and risk breaking your usable system. Luke _______________________________________________ orca-list mailing list orca-list at gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. The manual is at http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp From luke.yelavich at canonical.com Thu May 10 00:28:44 2012 From: luke.yelavich at canonical.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Wed, 9 May 2012 17:28:44 -0700 Subject: Ubuntu 12.10 and beyond, Unity 2D will no longer be maintained. In-Reply-To: <20120509220923.GB2245@gmail.com> References: <20120509212547.GB4660@acapella> <20120509220923.GB2245@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20120510002844.GC14687@acapella> On Wed, May 09, 2012 at 03:09:25PM PDT, bando?ers wrote: > So, while I agree that there's no great need for most people to use the transitional, (between LTS), releases, but am left with a question. > Does this mean that those who don't have 3d graphics support will be forever restricted to precise and back? > Again I don't see this as much of an issue for people now that LTS releases will be supported for 5years, and of course hardware is aging as am I. I just want to make sure I understand. How old is the hardware you are currently using? Chances are that you indeed do have graphics hardware that has 3D graphics support, and you haven't needed to set it up, i.e you have an NVIDIA card that is not capable of rendering 3D graphics without installing the proprietary NVIDIA drivers. There are some edge cases for specific hardware released in the last 10 years like a handfull of netbooks, but modern Linux desktop shells are doing their best to support 3D graphics hardware that is 8-9 years old. See my recent email about desktop shells and their graphical requirements for more information. If you are still using hardware that is more than 9 years old, then yes you will need to upgrade, unless you switch to XFCE or LXDE, as chances are your CPu won't be fast enough to render any desktop at a sufficient speed to be usable. Luke From krmane at gmail.com Thu May 10 04:26:03 2012 From: krmane at gmail.com (Krishnakant Mane) Date: Thu, 10 May 2012 09:56:03 +0530 Subject: Ubuntu 12.10 and beyond, Unity 2D will no longer be maintained. In-Reply-To: <20120510002844.GC14687@acapella> References: <20120509212547.GB4660@acapella> <20120509220923.GB2245@gmail.com> <20120510002844.GC14687@acapella> Message-ID: <4FAB435B.4020408@gmail.com> On 05/10/2012 05:58 AM, Luke Yelavich wrote: > On Wed, May 09, 2012 at 03:09:25PM PDT, bando?ers wrote: >> So, while I agree that there's no great need for most people to use the transitional, (between LTS), releases, but am left with a question. >> Does this mean that those who don't have 3d graphics support will be forever restricted to precise and back? >> Again I don't see this as much of an issue for people now that LTS releases will be supported for 5years, and of course hardware is aging as am I. I just want to make sure I understand. > How old is the hardware you are currently using? Chances are that you indeed do have graphics hardware that has 3D graphics support, and you haven't needed to set it up, i.e you have an NVIDIA card that is not capable of rendering 3D graphics without installing the proprietary NVIDIA drivers. There are some edge cases for specific hardware released in the last 10 years like a handfull of netbooks, but modern Linux desktop shells are doing their best to support 3D graphics hardware that is 8-9 years old. See my recent email about desktop shells and their graphical requirements for more information. > > If you are still using hardware that is more than 9 years old, then yes you will need to upgrade, unless you switch to XFCE or LXDE, as chances are your CPu won't be fast enough to render any desktop at a sufficient speed to be usable. > > Luke > Hi all, I strongly believe that Unity 2D should have existed for much longer. I guess people are aware that tablets would need such a thing that takes less memory. In any case, if accessibility is broken in Unity 3D? then it is Ubuntu's responsibility to fix it up. For Unity 2D I can only say one thing. Some one aught to have a ppa for Unity 2D and since Unity is licensed under gpl, a community driven team can surely maintain it. Talking about 3D support, my Thinkpad was taken in 2007 and I am not sure if it has 3D card. Happy hacking. Krishnakant. From krmane at gmail.com Thu May 10 04:40:45 2012 From: krmane at gmail.com (Krishnakant mane) Date: Thu, 10 May 2012 10:10:45 +0530 Subject: [orca-list] Ubuntu 12.10 and beyond, Unity 2D will no longer be maintained. In-Reply-To: <000001cd2e5f$87fa6fc0$97ef4f40$@gmail.com> References: <20120509212547.GB4660@acapella> <20120509220923.GB2245@gmail.com> <20120510002844.GC14687@acapella> <000001cd2e5f$87fa6fc0$97ef4f40$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20120510044044.GB5000@kk-thinkpad> Hi Alex, In that case it is more likely that some one would maintain it afterall. Because if tablet manufacturers have an insentive to keep this going then there maybe some hope for Unity 2D. Happy hacking. Krishnakant.On Wed, May 09, 2012 at 10:46:47PM -0500, Alex Midence wrote: > What of the new devices coming out that are Android phones that become Ubuntu desktops when plugged in? I figured they'd use Unity 2d and that 3d would be too much for that hardware. I also hoped it'd be Unity 2d since so much progress was made on its accessibility. > > Alex M > > > -----Original Message----- > From: orca-list-bounces at gnome.org [mailto:orca-list-bounces at gnome.org] On Behalf Of Luke Yelavich > Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2012 7:29 PM > To: bando?ers; orca-list at gnome.org; Ubuntu Accessibility Mailing List > Subject: Re: [orca-list] Ubuntu 12.10 and beyond, Unity 2D will no longer be maintained. > > On Wed, May 09, 2012 at 03:09:25PM PDT, bando?ers wrote: > > So, while I agree that there's no great need for most people to use the transitional, (between LTS), releases, but am left with a question. > > Does this mean that those who don't have 3d graphics support will be forever restricted to precise and back? > > Again I don't see this as much of an issue for people now that LTS releases will be supported for 5years, and of course hardware is aging as am I. I just want to make sure I understand. > > How old is the hardware you are currently using? Chances are that you indeed do have graphics hardware that has 3D graphics support, and you haven't needed to set it up, i.e you have an NVIDIA card that is not capable of rendering 3D graphics without installing the proprietary NVIDIA drivers. There are some edge cases for specific hardware released in the last 10 years like a handfull of netbooks, but modern Linux desktop shells are doing their best to support 3D graphics hardware that is 8-9 years old. See my recent email about desktop shells and their graphical requirements for more information. > > If you are still using hardware that is more than 9 years old, then yes you will need to upgrade, unless you switch to XFCE or LXDE, as chances are your CPu won't be fast enough to render any desktop at a sufficient speed to be usable. > > Luke > _______________________________________________ > orca-list mailing list > orca-list at gnome.org > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list > Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. > The manual is at http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html > The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions > Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp > > _______________________________________________ > orca-list mailing list > orca-list at gnome.org > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list > Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. > The manual is at http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html > The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions > Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org > Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp From krmane at gmail.com Thu May 10 05:02:15 2012 From: krmane at gmail.com (Krishnakant Mane) Date: Thu, 10 May 2012 10:32:15 +0530 Subject: Ubuntu 12.10 and beyond, Unity 2D will no longer be maintained. In-Reply-To: <20120509212547.GB4660@acapella> References: <20120509212547.GB4660@acapella> Message-ID: <4FAB4BD7.9040008@gmail.com> Hi Luke, So are we at least sure that Unity 2D will at least be maintained for the next 6 months? In that case we will have enough to use for next year or so on stable production machines. Talking about Vinux, I am just curious if we will have a ppa for 2D? May be some one can then take up the job of maintaining it? Lastly, if we have Vinux 4, will we get all future accessibility fixes to other software like thunderbird etc, even though Unity 2d might be kept constant? happy hacking. Krishnakant. On 05/10/2012 02:55 AM, Luke Yelavich wrote: > Hi all, > So as some of you may have heard, Canonical has plans to stop maintaining unity 2D in future development cycles. This makes sense because spending double the resources trying to keep 2 desktops in feature parity is a lot of work, and those resources can be used much better elsewhere. The downside of course, is accessibility. Unity 3D accessibility still needs some work to get to feature parity with Unity 2D, but once this work is done, it shouldn't be a problem keeping things working in the future. > > So, i will be working on improving Unity 3D accessibility in the future development cycles. I am not going to promise that it will be done by 12.10, although I would like it to be, but thats not my goal. My goal is to get Unity 3D accessibility ready for 14.04 LTS. > > I feel that unless you really understand how to get set up, and unbreak your system, and deal with accessibility bugs, you should stick to the ubuntu LTS releases. Once Vinux 4 gets released, there will be a distro based on Ubuntu LTS, that will be kept up to date with all the latest in accessibility fixes, so that you don't need to keep updating to the interim Ubuntu releases, and risk breaking your usable system. > > Luke > From luke.yelavich at canonical.com Thu May 10 05:36:53 2012 From: luke.yelavich at canonical.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Wed, 9 May 2012 22:36:53 -0700 Subject: Ubuntu 12.10 and beyond, Unity 2D will no longer be maintained. In-Reply-To: <4FAB435B.4020408@gmail.com> References: <20120509212547.GB4660@acapella> <20120509220923.GB2245@gmail.com> <20120510002844.GC14687@acapella> <4FAB435B.4020408@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20120510053653.GE14687@acapella> On Wed, May 09, 2012 at 09:26:03PM PDT, Krishnakant Mane wrote: > Hi all, > I strongly believe that Unity 2D should have existed for much longer. If you believe it should be around for longer, then you are most welcome to help maintain the code. Just because Canonical is discontinuing work on unity 2D, doesn't mean that someone from the community can't step up and maintain it. As for tablets, please read my other mail about desktop environments. It is more efficient, both in CPU/GPU usage and battery wise, to perform 3D graphics rendering for the tablet UI, so I think you will find that more tablets will use 3D rendering. Luke From alex.midence at gmail.com Thu May 10 03:46:47 2012 From: alex.midence at gmail.com (Alex Midence) Date: Wed, 9 May 2012 22:46:47 -0500 Subject: [orca-list] Ubuntu 12.10 and beyond, Unity 2D will no longer be maintained. In-Reply-To: <20120510002844.GC14687@acapella> References: <20120509212547.GB4660@acapella> <20120509220923.GB2245@gmail.com> <20120510002844.GC14687@acapella> Message-ID: <000001cd2e5f$87fa6fc0$97ef4f40$@gmail.com> What of the new devices coming out that are Android phones that become Ubuntu desktops when plugged in? I figured they'd use Unity 2d and that 3d would be too much for that hardware. I also hoped it'd be Unity 2d since so much progress was made on its accessibility. Alex M -----Original Message----- From: orca-list-bounces at gnome.org [mailto:orca-list-bounces at gnome.org] On Behalf Of Luke Yelavich Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2012 7:29 PM To: bando?ers; orca-list at gnome.org; Ubuntu Accessibility Mailing List Subject: Re: [orca-list] Ubuntu 12.10 and beyond, Unity 2D will no longer be maintained. On Wed, May 09, 2012 at 03:09:25PM PDT, bando?ers wrote: > So, while I agree that there's no great need for most people to use the transitional, (between LTS), releases, but am left with a question. > Does this mean that those who don't have 3d graphics support will be forever restricted to precise and back? > Again I don't see this as much of an issue for people now that LTS releases will be supported for 5years, and of course hardware is aging as am I. I just want to make sure I understand. How old is the hardware you are currently using? Chances are that you indeed do have graphics hardware that has 3D graphics support, and you haven't needed to set it up, i.e you have an NVIDIA card that is not capable of rendering 3D graphics without installing the proprietary NVIDIA drivers. There are some edge cases for specific hardware released in the last 10 years like a handfull of netbooks, but modern Linux desktop shells are doing their best to support 3D graphics hardware that is 8-9 years old. See my recent email about desktop shells and their graphical requirements for more information. If you are still using hardware that is more than 9 years old, then yes you will need to upgrade, unless you switch to XFCE or LXDE, as chances are your CPu won't be fast enough to render any desktop at a sufficient speed to be usable. Luke _______________________________________________ orca-list mailing list orca-list at gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. The manual is at http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp From luke.yelavich at canonical.com Thu May 10 05:47:00 2012 From: luke.yelavich at canonical.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Wed, 9 May 2012 22:47:00 -0700 Subject: Ubuntu 12.10 and beyond, Unity 2D will no longer be maintained. In-Reply-To: <4FAB4BD7.9040008@gmail.com> References: <20120509212547.GB4660@acapella> <4FAB4BD7.9040008@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20120510054700.GA20175@acapella> On Wed, May 09, 2012 at 10:02:15PM PDT, Krishnakant Mane wrote: > Hi Luke, > So are we at least sure that Unity 2D will at least be maintained > for the next 6 months? I don't know, you would have to ask the members of the Unity 2D team at canonical. > In that case we will have enough to use for next year or so on > stable production machines. Ubuntu 12.04 LTs is supported on the desktop for 5 years. This means that important fixes and security updates will be made to Unity 3D and 2D for the next 5 years. Where possible, this will include accessibility fixes. > Talking about Vinux, I am just curious if we will have a ppa for 2D? > May be some one can then take up the job of maintaining it? Vinux 4 will be based on Ubuntu 12.04 LTS, so Unity 2D will be supported by Canonical for the next 5 years, likely longer than Vinux 4 will be supported. > Lastly, if we have Vinux 4, will we get all future accessibility > fixes to other software like thunderbird etc, even though Unity 2d > might be kept constant? Thunderbird and Firefox will be updated to the latest stable relesaes during the 5 year support lifecycle of Ubuntu 12.04 LTS. For Vinux 4, I will do my best to make sure we have the latest orca and other necessary accessibility stack code so that users can take advantage of the latest accessiblity fixes in thunderbird and firefox, for the length of the Vinux 4 support lifecycle. Luke From themuso at ubuntu.com Thu May 10 05:53:44 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Wed, 9 May 2012 22:53:44 -0700 Subject: [orca-list] Ubuntu 12.10 and beyond, Unity 2D will no longer be maintained. In-Reply-To: <000001cd2e5f$87fa6fc0$97ef4f40$@gmail.com> References: <20120509212547.GB4660@acapella> <20120509220923.GB2245@gmail.com> <20120510002844.GC14687@acapella> <000001cd2e5f$87fa6fc0$97ef4f40$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20120510055344.GB20175@acapella> On Wed, May 09, 2012 at 08:46:47PM PDT, Alex Midence wrote: > What of the new devices coming out that are Android phones that become Ubuntu desktops when plugged in? I figured they'd use Unity 2d and that 3d would be too much for that hardware. I also hoped it'd be Unity 2d since so much progress was made on its accessibility. I am pretty sure that Ubuntu on android does not have any of the required accessibility components as part of the image, although I could be wrong. Unity 2D is convenient for that hardwar,e because Unity 3D and its underlying stack does not yet have full support for OpenGLES, the 3D rendering technology that is used on embedded hardware. Unity 2D will also be supported fo r5 years as part of 12.04 LTS, and by that time, most manufacturers of phones have dropped support for many devices and have moved onto bigger and better things. Luke From krmane at gmail.com Thu May 10 08:05:20 2012 From: krmane at gmail.com (Krishnakant Mane) Date: Thu, 10 May 2012 13:35:20 +0530 Subject: more on thunderbird accessibility review Message-ID: <4FAB76C0.6070102@gmail.com> hello all, I have started to review accessibility of Thunderbird again. As reported yesterday, I did start browsing the emails offline. Now I have another problem which is known for quite some time. Yesterday Thunderbird was opening very fast. But today It has slowed down. Infact I feel it should have speeded up because now since my inbox is off list it does not have to cache every thing at startup. I have about 5000 mails in my inbox. Now I get Orca's response about 2 minutes after I start thunderbird. I have other folders such as archive_2011 which contains 15000 emails but I did not choose to download this folder. Further I have 150 emails in my sent folder and it is downloaded to the local machine just like my inbox. Any suggestions or explanations? Lastly, I try sending emails from tb during which I hear the to: field properly, but I don't here the cc: when I choose it from the dropdown. I write an email address in to: then hit enter. Now Orca should announce the current focus which is the dropdown for to: cc: etc. But nothing is spoken. I do a guess and press down arrow and then tab. I type another email id in cc: and tab over to subject. This time, while I shift + tab to cc: field, Orca not just announces cc: but also reads the email address present there. Can some one reproduce this? Is some work going on with tb accessibility? happy hacking. Krishnakant. From krmane at gmail.com Thu May 10 08:17:23 2012 From: krmane at gmail.com (Krishnakant Mane) Date: Thu, 10 May 2012 13:47:23 +0530 Subject: [orca-list] Ubuntu 12.10 and beyond, Unity 2D will no longer be maintained. In-Reply-To: <20120510071811.GB2558@mail.jobva.nl> References: <20120509212547.GB4660@acapella> <4FAB4BD7.9040008@gmail.com> <20120510054700.GA20175@acapella> <20120510071811.GB2558@mail.jobva.nl> Message-ID: <4FAB7993.1020708@gmail.com> Mallory, +1 Myself and a huge amount of people like me care a shit about 3d. And Mind you here I am talking about sighted people who would rather wish their work happens in the most straight forward way possible and given that machines might not have all the power to run the dainty 3D desktops, I agree with you. I know many who even today don't think desktop cube is of any use, althought I am not that extreme. happy hacking. Krishnakant. On 05/10/2012 12:48 PM, Mallory van Achterberg wrote: > I remember being told how all movies some day will be 3D because "it's > what the public wants" yet all I hear around me personally is headaches > and a strong desire to find "2d glasses" (which we now have, yay... where > I live, movies are usually from America and so have subtitles so reading > them is imperative. You could watch a movie without the 3d glasses but > you can't read the subtitles). > > So I'm going to sit back and wait to see if everyone *really* wants > stuff to swish and fade and slide and whatever as the user interacts > with the GUI. Showing movement or that something is gradual is a known > UI improvement as far as letting users know where things go or where > they came from and reduces disorientation (mostly for new users), and > I understand the lowered CPU use (similar things are happening in > the web world, where CSS3 transitions and animations can use the GPU > whereas Javascript is still relying on CPU... for phones and tablets > this makes a big difference)... > > But sometimes I wonder if this heavy "style" of interaction will truly > last, or if it's like skinny jeans: a juggernaut fad. Perhaps > specifically a fad started by Apple. > > Just a thought. Interfaces with fluff should ideally be as accessible > as any other of course. > > -Mallory From tony.bernedal at gmail.com Thu May 10 09:27:44 2012 From: tony.bernedal at gmail.com (Tony Bernedal) Date: Thu, 10 May 2012 11:27:44 +0200 Subject: twitterclients Message-ID: Hi all. What twitter clients is accessible out there and wich can you recommend? I tried gwibber but it's feels not so accessible to me. a lot of unlabeled buttons for example. I red somewhere about twitux but it looks like it's no longer developed. Even ttytter is a alternative if there is no alternative for the graphical interface. All The best Regards Tony -- --------------------------------------- Tony Bernedal tony.bernedal at gmail.com Blog och info om it och teknik för synskadade. www.tbteknik.se From burt1iband at gmail.com Thu May 10 09:50:03 2012 From: burt1iband at gmail.com (bando?ers) Date: Thu, 10 May 2012 04:50:03 -0500 Subject: twitterclients In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20120510095001.GF16503@gmail.com> The most all around powerful now is TTYtter, but it is commandline only. It runs nicely from a gnome terminal, and there are sound packs, and several extensions for it. For an easy to use GUI access to twitter try the pidgin microblogging plug-in. I don't know if this comes by default when you install pidgin these days or not, but go to the pidgin site, click on the plug-ins link and you will find it there. There was, probably still is an old twitter plug-in as well, but it doesn' work with the current auth system used by twitter. When you have the plug-in installed go to the plugins menu and it will be called something like twitgen. Make sure it's enabled, and accept all of its capibilities. It won't follow, unfollow,or even directly DM someone,but you can click on urls, favorite a tweet, and rt very easily and tweets can be read as than come in. You can of course just write a standard tweet yourself as well. TTYtter can do much more, but it requires more typing, and more initial configuration. There are .deb packages for pnew versions of ttytter in the Vinux repos, as well as a very useful helper package. Pidgin is in standard Ubuntu repos, but some plugins must be downloaded from the web, or installed from third party repos. There's also a program called twidge, but I';'ve not heard so much about it. I regularly use both ttytter and the pidgin microblogger plugin, so if you get stuck some where I can likely help you if you get a hold of me off list. There was a ttytter version in standard Ubuntu repos I heard, but I think it was not so new, and this is one little program worth keeping updated. When twitter changed there authorization system a year and a half ago the accessible GUI twitter aps broke never to be fixed as far as I know, and they were not very good anyway. Regards, -- Burt On Thu, May 10, 2012 at 11:27:44AM +0200, Tony Bernedal wrote: > Hi all. > What twitter clients is accessible out there and wich can you recommend? > I tried gwibber but it's feels not so accessible to me. a lot of > unlabeled buttons for example. > I red somewhere about twitux but it looks like it's no longer > developed. Even ttytter is a alternative if there is no alternative > for the graphical interface. > All The best > Regards Tony > > > -- > --------------------------------------- > Tony Bernedal > tony.bernedal at gmail.com > Blog och info om it och teknik för synskadade. > www.tbteknik.se > > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility From simon.eigeldinger at vol.at Thu May 10 11:49:54 2012 From: simon.eigeldinger at vol.at (simon.eigeldinger at vol.at) Date: Thu, 10 May 2012 13:49:54 +0200 Subject: twitterclients In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: hi, so. let's fix that that this message reaches the list. i used turpial for a while. its not completely accessible but there are some workarounds. but i guess if we contact the software devs we might get an accessible twitter client. greetings, simon On Thu, 10 May 2012 11:27:44 +0200 Tony Bernedal wrote: > Hi all. > What twitter clients is accessible out there and wich can you >recommend? > I tried gwibber but it's feels not so accessible to me. a lot of > unlabeled buttons for example. > I red somewhere about twitux but it looks like it's no longer > developed. Even ttytter is a alternative if there is no alternative > for the graphical interface. > All The best > Regards Tony > > > -- > --------------------------------------- > Tony Bernedal > tony.bernedal at gmail.com > Blog och info om it och teknik för synskadade. > www.tbteknik.se > > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility -- Simon Eigeldinger simon.eigeldinger at vol.at From ka1cey at gmail.com Thu May 10 12:55:24 2012 From: ka1cey at gmail.com (Dave Hunt) Date: Thu, 10 May 2012 08:55:24 -0400 Subject: twitterclients In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4FABBABC.4000101@gmail.com> You can use pidgin as a twitter client, with the pidgin-microblog plugin. When this is connected, your timeline becomes a 'conversation' in pidgin, with a few irc-style commands available. I briefly tried another gui client for twitter and identica called turpial, and didn't like it much. Cheers, Dave On 05/10/2012 05:27 AM, Tony Bernedal wrote: > Hi all. > What twitter clients is accessible out there and wich can you recommend? > I tried gwibber but it's feels not so accessible to me. a lot of > unlabeled buttons for example. > I red somewhere about twitux but it looks like it's no longer > developed. Even ttytter is a alternative if there is no alternative > for the graphical interface. > All The best > Regards Tony > > From luke.yelavich at canonical.com Thu May 10 15:46:11 2012 From: luke.yelavich at canonical.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Thu, 10 May 2012 08:46:11 -0700 Subject: [orca-list] More on desktop shells, 2D vs 3D, and the future. In-Reply-To: <009401cd2e9a$981b9c40$c852d4c0$@gmail.com> References: <20120509225626.GB14687@acapella> <009401cd2e9a$981b9c40$c852d4c0$@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20120510154611.GA5081@acapella> On Thu, May 10, 2012 at 03:49:35AM PDT, Andy B. wrote: > In Windows, my graphics card is listed as "Intel HD Graphics family video > adaptor" For some reason I can't get the exact model. What would need to be > done to support 3d graphics? I'd need to know your CPU or motherboard modelsw and the age of your machine, but at a guess, 3D graphics should just work in Linux using the Intel X driver. Luke From stommepoes at stommepoes.nl Thu May 10 07:18:11 2012 From: stommepoes at stommepoes.nl (Mallory van Achterberg) Date: Thu, 10 May 2012 09:18:11 +0200 Subject: [orca-list] Ubuntu 12.10 and beyond, Unity 2D will no longer be maintained. In-Reply-To: <20120510054700.GA20175@acapella> References: <20120509212547.GB4660@acapella> <4FAB4BD7.9040008@gmail.com> <20120510054700.GA20175@acapella> Message-ID: <20120510071811.GB2558@mail.jobva.nl> I remember being told how all movies some day will be 3D because "it's what the public wants" yet all I hear around me personally is headaches and a strong desire to find "2d glasses" (which we now have, yay... where I live, movies are usually from America and so have subtitles so reading them is imperative. You could watch a movie without the 3d glasses but you can't read the subtitles). So I'm going to sit back and wait to see if everyone *really* wants stuff to swish and fade and slide and whatever as the user interacts with the GUI. Showing movement or that something is gradual is a known UI improvement as far as letting users know where things go or where they came from and reduces disorientation (mostly for new users), and I understand the lowered CPU use (similar things are happening in the web world, where CSS3 transitions and animations can use the GPU whereas Javascript is still relying on CPU... for phones and tablets this makes a big difference)... But sometimes I wonder if this heavy "style" of interaction will truly last, or if it's like skinny jeans: a juggernaut fad. Perhaps specifically a fad started by Apple. Just a thought. Interfaces with fluff should ideally be as accessible as any other of course. -Mallory From juanjomarin96 at yahoo.es Thu May 10 10:17:20 2012 From: juanjomarin96 at yahoo.es (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Juanjo_Mar=EDn?=) Date: Thu, 10 May 2012 11:17:20 +0100 (BST) Subject: [orca-list] Ubuntu 12.10 and beyond, Unity 2D will no longer be maintained. In-Reply-To: <20120510071811.GB2558@mail.jobva.nl> References: <20120509212547.GB4660@acapella> <4FAB4BD7.9040008@gmail.com> <20120510054700.GA20175@acapella> <20120510071811.GB2558@mail.jobva.nl> Message-ID: <1336645040.32686.YahooMailNeo@web171401.mail.ir2.yahoo.com> The evolution of software is linked to the evolution of hardware.  For example, GNOME Shell uses relatively primitive 3D  capabilities that have been available from essentially all  computing devices made in the last five years . No using such  capabilities means not delivering a user experience according  to the potential that the machines provide. My machine at work  is nearly 7 years old and I have also an atom N270 netbook r unning both Gnome 3 with that in a more than adequate way. I think that, at least in part, this movement from GNOME and  Unity of using these capabilities have helped to improve the  support of many graphic card drivers and now it is  even  possible to have software rendering.  Developing two separate code paths for accelerated and  non-accelerated graphics is a large increase in development  resources. The transition was not easy, but we should  appreciate whe have been provided ways to alleviate the  transition, with the fallback mode in GNOME and Unity 2D.  But both of them are only temporally workarounds, the real  solution should be alaways provided in the main path of  development. I must confess I wasn't aware of the  transitional status of Unity 2D, mainly because it was started  from the scratch, but it makes sense that Canonical doesn't  have resources for both paths. GNOME Shell is quite accessible right now, and we can only  expect getting better, and I'm glad to hear that Luke keeps  committed in making Unity accessible and I'm sure he will  get it. Cheers,     -- Juanjo Marin ----- Mensaje original ----- > De: Mallory van Achterberg > Para: Luke Yelavich > CC: Ubuntu Accessibility Mailing List ; Orca-list at gnome.org > Enviado: Jueves 10 de Mayo de 2012 9:18 > Asunto: Re: [orca-list] Ubuntu 12.10 and beyond, Unity 2D will no longer be maintained. > > I remember being told how all movies some day will be 3D because "it's > what the public wants" yet all I hear around me personally is headaches > and a strong desire to find "2d glasses" (which we now have, yay... > where > I live, movies are usually from America and so have subtitles so reading > them is imperative. You could watch a movie without the 3d glasses but > you can't read the subtitles). > > So I'm going to sit back and wait to see if everyone *really* wants > stuff to swish and fade and slide and whatever as the user interacts > with the GUI. Showing movement or that something is gradual is a known > UI improvement as far as letting users know where things go or where > they came from and reduces disorientation (mostly for new users), and > I understand the lowered CPU use (similar things are happening in > the web world, where CSS3 transitions and animations can use the GPU > whereas Javascript is still relying on CPU... for phones and tablets > this makes a big difference)... > > But sometimes I wonder if this heavy "style" of interaction will truly > last, or if it's like skinny jeans: a juggernaut fad. Perhaps > specifically a fad started by Apple. > > Just a thought. Interfaces with fluff should ideally be as accessible > as any other of course. > From frederic at petra.fredericrobert.be Thu May 10 16:26:12 2012 From: frederic at petra.fredericrobert.be (Frederic Robert) Date: Thu, 10 May 2012 16:26:12 +0000 Subject: twitterclients In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20120510162612.GA4365@petra.fredericrobert.be> On Thu, May 10, 2012 at 11:27:44AM +0200, Tony Bernedal wrote: > Hi all. > What twitter clients is accessible out there and wich can you recommend? Hello Tony, I used twidge in command line. Greetings, -- Frederic Robert From burt1iband at gmail.com Fri May 11 16:58:03 2012 From: burt1iband at gmail.com (bando?ers) Date: Fri, 11 May 2012 11:58:03 -0500 Subject: [orca-list] More on desktop shells, 2D vs 3D, and the future. In-Reply-To: <20120510154611.GA5081@acapella> References: <20120509225626.GB14687@acapella> <009401cd2e9a$981b9c40$c852d4c0$@gmail.com> <20120510154611.GA5081@acapella> Message-ID: <20120511165800.GC5020@gmail.com> Andy, you should run lshw to get a good hardware overview, i.e. check out your motherboard and graphics chipset. Run as root sudo lshw I think it comes standard on Ubuntu, but if not it is a small download and in normal repositories. There's a graphical hardware information program as well, but accessibility is a bit confusing in the beginning and can be a bit sluggish at times as well. It's really nice though and runs some benchmarks. Hardinf or hardinfo I think It's called. I wouldn't be with out these programs, and having them on a usb Linux makes diagnosing and hopefully fixing other ppl's boxes a heck of a lot easier. Regards, -- B.H. On Thu, May 10, 2012 at 08:46:11AM -0700, Luke Yelavich wrote: > On Thu, May 10, 2012 at 03:49:35AM PDT, Andy B. wrote: > > In Windows, my graphics card is listed as "Intel HD Graphics family video > > adaptor" For some reason I can't get the exact model. What would need to be > > done to support 3d graphics? > > I'd need to know your CPU or motherboard modelsw and the age of your machine, but at a guess, 3D graphics should just work in Linux using the Intel X driver. > > Luke > > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility From krmane at gmail.com Sat May 12 05:26:52 2012 From: krmane at gmail.com (Krishnakant Mane) Date: Sat, 12 May 2012 10:56:52 +0530 Subject: interesting observation about Orca and thunderbird Message-ID: <4FADF49C.1040700@gmail.com> Hello all, I found an interesting fact about Thunderbird accessibility. I guess this might be fixed in the next update to tb although I don't know why this happens. When I have an active INTERNET connection, it is but natural that tb will connect to the server, google in my case. After a few seconds the password prompt comes up, but Orca takes about a minute or 2 to read the password dialog. At first I was under the impression that it is thunderbird that takes time, but now I know it it is the Orca that reads it late. I also had a feeling that Orca might be taking time due to the huge list of emails in my inbox (6000) at present. But that might not be true, because once Orca announces the password prompt after that delay, I have no particular problems navigating the list of emails. Can any one reproduce this? Is there some way I can speed this up? Is this know and will Ubuntu 12.04 have the fix if any available as an update? I ask this because firefox offlate has been behaving so nicely. Happy hacking. Krishnakant. From krmane at gmail.com Sat May 12 15:06:55 2012 From: krmane at gmail.com (Krishnakant Mane) Date: Sat, 12 May 2012 20:36:55 +0530 Subject: a suggestion/ idea for a faster file manager Message-ID: <4FAE7C8F.6000504@gmail.com> Hello all, Off hand I can't really remember which file manager is used on Adriane Knoppix on lxde desktop, but an Idea crossed my mind? I am not into graphics based library although my programming brain can't find a way to unjustify this idea. Why can't we have that same file manager run on Gnome? If LXDE does use gtk based things and given that we can use KDE based apps on Gnome, why can't we run the lxde based file manager in Gnome? Infact if we can get KDE based apps on Gnome, LXDE seems to be a closer friend. Any suggestions? happy hacking. Krishnakant. From krmane at gmail.com Mon May 14 14:15:44 2012 From: krmane at gmail.com (Krishnakant Mane) Date: Mon, 14 May 2012 19:45:44 +0530 Subject: regarding file managers, pcmanfm is just perfect Message-ID: <4FB11390.6050006@gmail.com> Hello all, I have been using pcmanfm for last 2 days and I am more than happy with its performance. While it is very fast, I wondered how it handled pen drives and other stuff. I discovered that even that is pritty well managed. Further more, I have the rename edit fields accessible as well. I now wish that there was a way to make pcmanfm the default file browser? any ideas if this is possible and how? Happy hacking. Krishnakant. From milton at tomaatnet.nl Mon May 14 16:51:25 2012 From: milton at tomaatnet.nl (Milton) Date: Mon, 14 May 2012 18:51:25 +0200 Subject: how to get more applications in the launchbar? Message-ID: <45CDE8BBCBE64C08A1648C341A71EA92@milton> Hi all, I use Ubuntu Precise Unity 2D with Orca 3.4.1. With Alt_F1 I go to the launchbar and with arrow-down to the applications listed. With twice arrow-right a sub menu opens and I can delete an application from the launchbar. With the super key I go the Dash and find all applications. A sighted person can drag an appkication to the launchbar. Shift_F10 is not working to get the sub menu for to find the option to let an application present in the launchbar. Is there a way to do so? Milton -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From vilmar at informal.com.br Mon May 14 17:09:44 2012 From: vilmar at informal.com.br (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jos=E9_Vilmar_Est=E1cio_de_Souza?=) Date: Mon, 14 May 2012 14:09:44 -0300 Subject: how to get more applications in the launchbar? In-Reply-To: <45CDE8BBCBE64C08A1648C341A71EA92@milton> References: <45CDE8BBCBE64C08A1648C341A71EA92@milton> Message-ID: <4FB13C58.2030305@informal.com.br> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Hi. You can try the following: 1. Launch the application that you want get in launchbar. 2. Go to the launchbar pressing alt+f1. 3. Press the down arro until you find the application launched in the step 1. 4. Press right arrow at least two times. Two times is important, one time doesn't work and I don't know why. 5. Press down arrow until you hear something like lock to launcher. 6. Press the enter key. - From now one the application will be present in the lanchbar even if the application is not active. You can use similar procedure to remove an application from the launchbar. On 05/14/2012 01:51 PM, Milton wrote: > Hi all, I use Ubuntu Precise Unity 2D with Orca 3.4.1. With Alt_F1 > I go to the launchbar and with arrow-down to the applications > listed. With twice arrow-right a sub menu opens and I can delete an > application from the launchbar. With the super key I go the Dash > and find all applications. A sighted person can drag an appkication > to the launchbar. Shift_F10 is not working to get the sub menu for > to find the option to let an application present in the launchbar. > Is there a way to do so? Milton > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJPsTxYAAoJEPMEywZ3KXznC9EH/R7fjDocPfTb63XkKScmnq4Y cnjosCs9e1rw+AMkjSkZ/hDORYCGylxyYNXjxv5Rfn5J2fgQJ5zHRvwt3BX5yFBQ xB46g2ysZIuv7qzmLBerpXRN+HrcJMXzPcIRYrPdfFjtNbjl8okJ1RKdkUtzPyV6 e1vbr0IOrsLALoNFV/ivi2kOM2ZctS8XtNystsHRzykFkKCGn80novPBrUkCkmNw dN9P3ATnN0AU/8POuhCHSn6ekiFw1ODnYr/urIbxt9EXGXmPbS6qdvaJehTV0Kwd BL3ds/3J2gLyFCDHHtqOz1y+gPBXUdz9lTFGrX1Kutl8b0MK0DTMvhjnLkktmsg= =sEfU -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From milton at tomaatnet.nl Mon May 14 18:47:18 2012 From: milton at tomaatnet.nl (Milton) Date: Mon, 14 May 2012 20:47:18 +0200 Subject: how to get more applications in the launchbar? References: <45CDE8BBCBE64C08A1648C341A71EA92@milton> <4FB13C58.2030305@informal.com.br> Message-ID: <3A16541B8CFD474EA3FFAF1E628ABA75@milton> Hi José, Many, many thanks! Milton ----- Original Message ----- From: "José Vilmar Estácio de Souza" To: Sent: Monday, May 14, 2012 7:09 PM Subject: Re: how to get more applications in the launchbar? > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > Hi. > You can try the following: > > 1. Launch the application that you want get in launchbar. > 2. Go to the launchbar pressing alt+f1. > 3. Press the down arro until you find the application launched in the > step 1. > 4. Press right arrow at least two times. Two times is important, one > time doesn't work and I don't know why. > 5. Press down arrow until you hear something like lock to launcher. > 6. Press the enter key. > > - From now one the application will be present in the lanchbar even if > the application is not active. > > You can use similar procedure to remove an application from the > launchbar. > > On 05/14/2012 01:51 PM, Milton wrote: >> Hi all, I use Ubuntu Precise Unity 2D with Orca 3.4.1. With Alt_F1 >> I go to the launchbar and with arrow-down to the applications >> listed. With twice arrow-right a sub menu opens and I can delete an >> application from the launchbar. With the super key I go the Dash >> and find all applications. A sighted person can drag an appkication >> to the launchbar. Shift_F10 is not working to get the sub menu for >> to find the option to let an application present in the launchbar. >> Is there a way to do so? Milton >> >> >> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) > Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ > > iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJPsTxYAAoJEPMEywZ3KXznC9EH/R7fjDocPfTb63XkKScmnq4Y > cnjosCs9e1rw+AMkjSkZ/hDORYCGylxyYNXjxv5Rfn5J2fgQJ5zHRvwt3BX5yFBQ > xB46g2ysZIuv7qzmLBerpXRN+HrcJMXzPcIRYrPdfFjtNbjl8okJ1RKdkUtzPyV6 > e1vbr0IOrsLALoNFV/ivi2kOM2ZctS8XtNystsHRzykFkKCGn80novPBrUkCkmNw > dN9P3ATnN0AU/8POuhCHSn6ekiFw1ODnYr/urIbxt9EXGXmPbS6qdvaJehTV0Kwd > BL3ds/3J2gLyFCDHHtqOz1y+gPBXUdz9lTFGrX1Kutl8b0MK0DTMvhjnLkktmsg= > =sEfU > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility From pvdeejay at gmail.com Tue May 15 09:54:11 2012 From: pvdeejay at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?UGV0ZXIgVsOhZ25lcg==?=) Date: Tue, 15 May 2012 11:54:11 +0200 Subject: how to get more applications in the launchbar? In-Reply-To: <3A16541B8CFD474EA3FFAF1E628ABA75@milton> References: <45CDE8BBCBE64C08A1648C341A71EA92@milton> <4FB13C58.2030305@informal.com.br> <3A16541B8CFD474EA3FFAF1E628ABA75@milton> Message-ID: <4FB227C3.609@gmail.com> Hello, Is there a way for us using orca to rearrange icons on the launch bar? Because apps added using this method are ussually added to the bottom. if the only option available for now is to delete all icons and then add them in the order I would like to have then that's just a time consuming workaround. Greetings Peter Dňa 14.5.2012 20:47, Milton napísal: > Hi José, > Many, many thanks! > Milton > ----- Original Message ----- From: "José Vilmar Estácio de Souza" > > To: > Sent: Monday, May 14, 2012 7:09 PM > Subject: Re: how to get more applications in the launchbar? > > >> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- >> Hash: SHA1 >> >> Hi. >> You can try the following: >> >> 1. Launch the application that you want get in launchbar. >> 2. Go to the launchbar pressing alt+f1. >> 3. Press the down arro until you find the application launched in the >> step 1. >> 4. Press right arrow at least two times. Two times is important, one >> time doesn't work and I don't know why. >> 5. Press down arrow until you hear something like lock to launcher. >> 6. Press the enter key. >> >> - From now one the application will be present in the lanchbar even if >> the application is not active. >> >> You can use similar procedure to remove an application from the >> launchbar. >> >> On 05/14/2012 01:51 PM, Milton wrote: >>> Hi all, I use Ubuntu Precise Unity 2D with Orca 3.4.1. With Alt_F1 >>> I go to the launchbar and with arrow-down to the applications >>> listed. With twice arrow-right a sub menu opens and I can delete an >>> application from the launchbar. With the super key I go the Dash >>> and find all applications. A sighted person can drag an appkication >>> to the launchbar. Shift_F10 is not working to get the sub menu for >>> to find the option to let an application present in the launchbar. >>> Is there a way to do so? Milton >>> >>> >>> >> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- >> Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) >> Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ >> >> iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJPsTxYAAoJEPMEywZ3KXznC9EH/R7fjDocPfTb63XkKScmnq4Y >> cnjosCs9e1rw+AMkjSkZ/hDORYCGylxyYNXjxv5Rfn5J2fgQJ5zHRvwt3BX5yFBQ >> xB46g2ysZIuv7qzmLBerpXRN+HrcJMXzPcIRYrPdfFjtNbjl8okJ1RKdkUtzPyV6 >> e1vbr0IOrsLALoNFV/ivi2kOM2ZctS8XtNystsHRzykFkKCGn80novPBrUkCkmNw >> dN9P3ATnN0AU/8POuhCHSn6ekiFw1ODnYr/urIbxt9EXGXmPbS6qdvaJehTV0Kwd >> BL3ds/3J2gLyFCDHHtqOz1y+gPBXUdz9lTFGrX1Kutl8b0MK0DTMvhjnLkktmsg= >> =sEfU >> -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- >> >> -- >> Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list >> Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com >> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility > > From kalladasunny1 at gmail.com Tue May 15 12:07:38 2012 From: kalladasunny1 at gmail.com (sunny p o) Date: Tue, 15 May 2012 17:37:38 +0530 Subject: Libreoffice calc 3.5 is not good for blinds Message-ID: I have used libre office calc 3.5 in Ubuntu 11.04 and 12.04. But some problems have been seen in this. For example, by pressing f2 key I cannot read the characters with navigation keys. Similarly insert R and insert C are not working in this for hearing the contents of a particular row or column. From krecoun at gmail.com Tue May 15 21:27:05 2012 From: krecoun at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?Vm9qdMSbY2ggUG9sw6HFoWVr?=) Date: Tue, 15 May 2012 23:27:05 +0200 Subject: espeak and libsonic in ubuntu 12.04 Message-ID: <4FB2CA29.80908@gmail.com> Hi, I am using ubuntu 12.04 and I want to use espeak with libsonic, because maximum rate of default espeak is too slow for me. I know, I am spoiled from Vinux, but the higher rate means higher productivity. I compiled the latest speech dispatcher (0.8 dev) from git, with no luck - I even added recommended values to /etc/speech-dispatcher/modules/espeak.conf, no luck. Do I have to recompile espeak as well? Is libsonic support included in epseak package shipping with ubuntu 12.04? Thank you, Vojta From themuso at ubuntu.com Tue May 15 22:55:59 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Wed, 16 May 2012 08:55:59 +1000 Subject: espeak and libsonic in ubuntu 12.04 In-Reply-To: <4FB2CA29.80908@gmail.com> References: <4FB2CA29.80908@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20120515225559.GA4086@acapella> On Wed, May 16, 2012 at 07:27:05AM EST, Vojtěch Polášek wrote: > Is libsonic support included in espeak > package shipping with ubuntu 12.04? Yes, espeak in 12.04 is built against libsonic. Luke From kd7cyu at gmail.com Wed May 16 16:11:23 2012 From: kd7cyu at gmail.com (Tom Masterson) Date: Wed, 16 May 2012 09:11:23 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Strange behavior in unity 2d Message-ID: For reasons unknown my computer locked up to the point of requiring a hard reboot. I have since then done a proper shutdown and brought it back up. Both times after restarting keys in unity like alt-tab and f10 and some others do not work. Any ideas on what is wrong and how to fix it would be greatly appreciated. I do not see any obvious errors in syslog or dmesg. Thanks Tom From vilmar at informal.com.br Wed May 16 16:36:19 2012 From: vilmar at informal.com.br (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jos=E9_Vilmar_Est=E1cio_de_Souza?=) Date: Wed, 16 May 2012 13:36:19 -0300 Subject: Strange behavior in unity 2d In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4FB3D783.3000504@informal.com.br> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Try to remove .gconf/apps/metacity folder, if present. It is resident in your home folder. On 05/16/2012 01:11 PM, Tom Masterson wrote: > For reasons unknown my computer locked up to the point of requiring > a hard reboot. I have since then done a proper shutdown and > brought it back up. Both times after restarting keys in unity like > alt-tab and f10 and some others do not work. > > Any ideas on what is wrong and how to fix it would be greatly > appreciated. I do not see any obvious errors in syslog or dmesg. > > Thanks Tom > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJPs9eDAAoJEPMEywZ3KXznS9oIALd4TdH7EYEf30Z0587vN7j8 eU525Q1p62P84ObOFrQ72lLQNoxIE96EdK6b4KR5h4wY9i0Bu1jbnV+lnnwYklzf aD+LP18qNySwuKV2TPjku1xXZ+iy0zFy9MkyRL5+UuQqwDmmCnXWBqIV0Gj/JWap Xmg7QGomDXKsOGvAwc9wlT8VRR8uRt3EjtHUp6D/LyzZpCBqP+SoRm914APuLBhx ZyKK9sOCEsFgJTYllayfmBKM31BKJ8v6OD1bky+s1FTeXosPSO9FsgFmigX6gnP3 K7MR3OxLdYXvSKn7LCDza/l90q07gtJ7SioFDZET+mCxQUyk3Jrke43iytAm4aA= =Idl2 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From kd7cyu at gmail.com Wed May 16 17:42:01 2012 From: kd7cyu at gmail.com (Tom Masterson) Date: Wed, 16 May 2012 10:42:01 -0700 (PDT) Subject: Strange behavior in unity 2d In-Reply-To: <4FB3D783.3000504@informal.com.br> References: <4FB3D783.3000504@informal.com.br> Message-ID: That appears to have fixed it. Thanks Tom On Wed, 16 May 2012, José Vilmar Estácio de Souza wrote: > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > Hash: SHA1 > > Try to remove .gconf/apps/metacity folder, if present. > It is resident in your home folder. > > > > > > On 05/16/2012 01:11 PM, Tom Masterson wrote: >> For reasons unknown my computer locked up to the point of requiring >> a hard reboot. I have since then done a proper shutdown and >> brought it back up. Both times after restarting keys in unity like >> alt-tab and f10 and some others do not work. >> >> Any ideas on what is wrong and how to fix it would be greatly >> appreciated. I do not see any obvious errors in syslog or dmesg. >> >> Thanks Tom >> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- > Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) > Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ > > iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJPs9eDAAoJEPMEywZ3KXznS9oIALd4TdH7EYEf30Z0587vN7j8 > eU525Q1p62P84ObOFrQ72lLQNoxIE96EdK6b4KR5h4wY9i0Bu1jbnV+lnnwYklzf > aD+LP18qNySwuKV2TPjku1xXZ+iy0zFy9MkyRL5+UuQqwDmmCnXWBqIV0Gj/JWap > Xmg7QGomDXKsOGvAwc9wlT8VRR8uRt3EjtHUp6D/LyzZpCBqP+SoRm914APuLBhx > ZyKK9sOCEsFgJTYllayfmBKM31BKJ8v6OD1bky+s1FTeXosPSO9FsgFmigX6gnP3 > K7MR3OxLdYXvSKn7LCDza/l90q07gtJ7SioFDZET+mCxQUyk3Jrke43iytAm4aA= > =Idl2 > -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- > > -- > Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list > Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com > https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility > From vilmar at informal.com.br Wed May 16 18:48:06 2012 From: vilmar at informal.com.br (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jos=E9_Vilmar_Est=E1cio_de_Souza?=) Date: Wed, 16 May 2012 15:48:06 -0300 Subject: Strange behavior in unity 2d In-Reply-To: References: <4FB3D783.3000504@informal.com.br> Message-ID: <4FB3F666.90802@informal.com.br> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Seems to me that it happens after I run gnome-shell, but I am not sure. On 05/16/2012 02:42 PM, Tom Masterson wrote: > That appears to have fixed it. > > Thanks Tom > > On Wed, 16 May 2012, José Vilmar Estácio de Souza wrote: > > Try to remove .gconf/apps/metacity folder, if present. It is > resident in your home folder. > > > > > > On 05/16/2012 01:11 PM, Tom Masterson wrote: >>>> For reasons unknown my computer locked up to the point of >>>> requiring a hard reboot. I have since then done a proper >>>> shutdown and brought it back up. Both times after restarting >>>> keys in unity like alt-tab and f10 and some others do not >>>> work. >>>> >>>> Any ideas on what is wrong and how to fix it would be >>>> greatly appreciated. I do not see any obvious errors in >>>> syslog or dmesg. >>>> >>>> Thanks Tom >>>> >> >> -- Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list >> Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com >> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility >> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJPs/ZmAAoJEPMEywZ3KXznllsIALAZWyvdR9oASex4EC9DG/Ro XrlDpt+IxPDYJwoytrgOeuVNgrsWScnpRbNo9HrtNM/1vvsfG5VVqB/zFfNsUHt3 xwZcXK1nooozaZxdTXpnzCyM1d8JkvfMQ1cUbRlDsPb4yRJ7HJlORT2r252j6DId Fb3RkIlq1nVkb+V1ICsv0+cs31H9f0EmwexQ4to+AyBZ7F72yoag/K/jqRtY77Bq mJgzxup+ktRGztP8X3Nq4B6moKIQbMIa/ar0w4tRaX6Ubw+lzIC2/tcQNBuWTj9P Xh5nBJkTEqNLb8cFn9N7ymuSQMJykhBA/bvm1V4bXCHQxaPMA/XbiyakGnID50E= =1yhK -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From krecoun at gmail.com Wed May 16 19:04:03 2012 From: krecoun at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?Vm9qdMSbY2ggUG9sw6HFoWVr?=) Date: Wed, 16 May 2012 21:04:03 +0200 Subject: classic menu indicator in unity is working Message-ID: <4FB3FA23.7000709@gmail.com> Hi, I have found a simple way how to get classic menu indicator working in unity. This tip is from ubuntugeek.com. I am sorry, if i am reinventing the wheel. sudo apt-add-repository ppa:diesch/testing sudo apt-get update sudo apt-get install classicmenu-indicator I got it from here: http://www.ubuntugeek.com/how-to-install-classicmenu-indicator-in-ubuntu-12-04precise.html Vojta From krecoun at gmail.com Wed May 16 20:31:46 2012 From: krecoun at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?Vm9qdMSbY2ggUG9sw6HFoWVr?=) Date: Wed, 16 May 2012 22:31:46 +0200 Subject: hud is speaking Message-ID: <4FB40EB2.4030401@gmail.com> Hi, I would like to announce, that HUD is accessible. I don't know which update caused it, but it speaks with latest orca from master, as well as with orca provided in ubuntu repositories. Just type something and press up or down arrow to get to offered options. I don't know if it has any other capabilities. Vojta From alanbell at ubuntu.com Wed May 16 20:43:51 2012 From: alanbell at ubuntu.com (Alan Bell) Date: Wed, 16 May 2012 21:43:51 +0100 Subject: hud is speaking In-Reply-To: <4FB40EB2.4030401@gmail.com> References: <4FB40EB2.4030401@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4FB41187.9010807@ubuntu.com> On 16/05/12 21:31, Vojtěch Polášek wrote: > Hi, > I would like to announce, that HUD is accessible. > I don't know which update caused it, but it speaks with latest orca > from master, as well as with orca provided in ubuntu repositories. > Just type something and press up or down arrow to get to offered options. > I don't know if it has any other capabilities. > Vojta > nice. That is basically what the HUD does, it scoops up everything in the menu of the current application and lets you type stuff and it presents the top 5 matches, if you select one it does the same as navigating to that menu option would have done. There are some concept designs of it doing more stuff in the future (like presenting bits of dialog boxes or other controls) and it has been pointed out to the relevant people that accessibility should be designed into that. Alan. -- I work at http://libertus.co.uk From chaltain at gmail.com Wed May 16 21:32:34 2012 From: chaltain at gmail.com (Christopher Chaltain) Date: Wed, 16 May 2012 16:32:34 -0500 Subject: hud is speaking In-Reply-To: <4FB41187.9010807@ubuntu.com> References: <4FB40EB2.4030401@gmail.com> <4FB41187.9010807@ubuntu.com> Message-ID: <4FB41CF2.8080006@gmail.com> On 16/05/12 15:43, Alan Bell wrote: > On 16/05/12 21:31, Vojtěch Polášek wrote: >> I would like to announce, that HUD is accessible. >> I don't know which update caused it, but it speaks with latest orca >> from master, as well as with orca provided in ubuntu repositories. >> Just type something and press up or down arrow to get to offered options. >> I don't know if it has any other capabilities. >> Vojta > > nice. That is basically what the HUD does, it scoops up everything in > the menu of the current application and lets you type stuff and it > presents the top 5 matches, if you select one it does the same as > navigating to that menu option would have done. There are some concept > designs of it doing more stuff in the future (like presenting bits of > dialog boxes or other controls) and it has been pointed out to the > relevant people that accessibility should be designed into that. > > Alan. I'm not sure exactly what, but I got it mostly working after installing something from the proposed PPA shortly after Precise was released. Initially, it didn't seem to be working completely for me though. For example, I'd be in a message in Thunderbird, I'd type "move", I'd arrow down to one of the options, press enter and nothing would happen except the HUD dialog would go away. I just tried it again though, and it does seem to be working. Pretty cool! -- Christopher (CJ) chaltain at Gmail From simon.eigeldinger at vol.at Wed May 16 22:01:55 2012 From: simon.eigeldinger at vol.at (Simon Eigeldinger) Date: Thu, 17 May 2012 00:01:55 +0200 Subject: classic menu indicator in unity is working In-Reply-To: <4FB3FA23.7000709@gmail.com> References: <4FB3FA23.7000709@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4FB423D3.60904@vol.at> hi, seems not to work here. was also on the posted link to recheck. have you done something else to make it work? greetings, simon Am 16.05.2012 21:04, schrieb Vojtěch Polášek: > Hi, > I have found a simple way how to get classic menu indicator working in > unity. This tip is from ubuntugeek.com. I am sorry, if i am reinventing > the wheel. > sudo apt-add-repository ppa:diesch/testing > sudo apt-get update > sudo apt-get install classicmenu-indicator > I got it from here: > http://www.ubuntugeek.com/how-to-install-classicmenu-indicator-in-ubuntu-12-04precise.html > Vojta > -- Simon Eigeldinger Follow me on Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/domasofan/ E-Mail: simon.eigeldinger at vol.at MSN: simon_eigeldinger at hotmail.com ICQ: 121823966 Jabber: domasofan at livejournal.com From themuso at ubuntu.com Thu May 17 03:30:17 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Thu, 17 May 2012 13:30:17 +1000 Subject: Orca 3.4.2 available for testing in Ubuntu precise proposed. Message-ID: <20120517033017.GA5940@acapella.yelavich.home> Hey folks, Its that time again. I'm putting out a call for testing to help verify that orca 3.4.2 is in a fit state for general release in precise-updates. You can find more information about how to enable the precise-proposed repository in the launchpad bug for this update, https://launchpad.net/bugs/999399. Please follow the instructions given there, adn report back to the bug with your testing results. Thanks in advance. Luke From themuso at ubuntu.com Thu May 17 03:56:10 2012 From: themuso at ubuntu.com (Luke Yelavich) Date: Thu, 17 May 2012 13:56:10 +1000 Subject: at-spi2-core 2.4.2 available for testing in Ubuntu precise proposed. Message-ID: <20120517035610.GB5940@acapella.yelavich.home> Hey folks, As per Orca, at-spi2-core 2.4.2 is available for testing in Ubuntu precise proposed. Instructions on how to enable and test packages from precise-proposed are found in the relevant launchpad bug, https://launchpad.net/bugs/999404. Please test and leave feedback in the bug. Thanks. Luke From krmane at gmail.com Thu May 17 17:33:39 2012 From: krmane at gmail.com (Krishnakant Mane) Date: Thu, 17 May 2012 23:03:39 +0530 Subject: [orca-list] hud is speaking In-Reply-To: <4FB40EB2.4030401@gmail.com> References: <4FB40EB2.4030401@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4FB53673.2070009@gmail.com> I have the same experience. Good to have this working with Orca. This gives me another reason to stick to precise for at least one more year. Happy hacking. Krishnakant. On 05/17/2012 02:01 AM, Vojtěch Polášek wrote: > Hi, > I would like to announce, that HUD is accessible. > I don't know which update caused it, but it speaks with latest orca > from master, as well as with orca provided in ubuntu repositories. > Just type something and press up or down arrow to get to offered options. > I don't know if it has any other capabilities. > Vojta > _______________________________________________ > orca-list mailing list > orca-list at gnome.org > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list > Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. > The manual is at http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html > The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions > Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org > Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp From milton at tomaatnet.nl Fri May 18 17:34:42 2012 From: milton at tomaatnet.nl (Milton) Date: Fri, 18 May 2012 19:34:42 +0200 Subject: Orca refuses speech rate keystroke Message-ID: Hi all, I did a fresh install of Ubuntu Precise and got Orca 3.4.1 running with espeak. I went to the Orca Preferences to set a keystroke for increasing and decreasing the speech rate as I did In Natty. I set Insert_up-arrow and Insert_down-arrow and those keystrokes also appears in the short key list when I double click Insert_h. But nothing happens after when I press Insert_up-arrow or Insert-down-arrow. Can somebody confirm this and how can I solve this? Milton -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From milton at tomaatnet.nl Fri May 18 19:27:30 2012 From: milton at tomaatnet.nl (Milton) Date: Fri, 18 May 2012 21:27:30 +0200 Subject: [orca-list] Orca refuses speech rate keystroke References: <4FB690FF.4050004@igalia.com> Message-ID: <8970D37EA6BF48C5ACA00FE208173B83@milton> Many, many thanks for your quick help, it works now! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Joanmarie Diggs" To: Sent: Friday, May 18, 2012 8:12 PM Subject: Re: [orca-list] Orca refuses speech rate keystroke > Seems the problem only happens when you haven't saved the speech > settings. So I'll fix this bug, but your workaround is to adjust the > rate first by the preferences dialog and save the change. After that the > keybindings should work. > > On 05/18/2012 01:34 PM, Milton wrote: >> Hi all, I did a fresh install of Ubuntu Precise and got Orca 3.4.1 >> running with espeak. I went to the Orca Preferences to set a >> keystroke for increasing and decreasing the speech rate as I did In >> Natty. I set Insert_up-arrow and Insert_down-arrow and those >> keystrokes also appears in the short key list when I double click >> Insert_h. But nothing happens after when I press Insert_up-arrow or >> Insert-down-arrow. Can somebody confirm this and how can I solve >> this? Milton >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ orca-list mailing >> list orca-list at gnome.org >> http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list Visit >> http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. The manual >> is at >> http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html >> The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions Log >> bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org Find out how >> to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp > > _______________________________________________ > orca-list mailing list > orca-list at gnome.org > http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list > Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. > The manual is at > http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html > The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions > Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org > Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp From elle.uca at ubuntu.com Fri May 18 23:34:27 2012 From: elle.uca at ubuntu.com (Luca Ferretti) Date: Sat, 19 May 2012 01:34:27 +0200 Subject: 12.04 -- No beep for sticky, slow, and bounce keys features Message-ID: Hi, it seems there is an odd bug in audio feedback for keyboard a11y features (bug filed against gnome-settings-daemon by now, see [1]), could please someone confirm it? Cheers, Luca [1] https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-settings-daemon/+bug/1001490 From milton at tomaatnet.nl Sat May 19 20:26:24 2012 From: milton at tomaatnet.nl (Milton) Date: Sat, 19 May 2012 22:26:24 +0200 Subject: do Precise has an alternative for remastersys? Message-ID: Hi all, In Natty I used Remastersys with Orca but I could not find this in Precise Unity 2D. Is there an alternative that is accessible with Orca? I notice the application to create a start up disc which is not accissible with Orca. Milton -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From milton at tomaatnet.nl Sun May 20 20:30:55 2012 From: milton at tomaatnet.nl (Milton) Date: Sun, 20 May 2012 22:30:55 +0200 Subject: do Precise has an alternative for remastersys? References: <20120519204658.GB11063@gmail.com> Message-ID: Thanks a lot for helping me out. I found: http://bikramkawan.com.np/how-to-install-remastersys-on-ubuntu-12-04-precise-pangolin/ It works as before with Orca! Milton ----- Original Message ----- From: "bando?ers" To: "Milton" Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2012 10:47 PM Subject: Re: do Precise has an alternative for remastersys? > I'm waiting for the new Vinux based on precise to come out before trying > our new LTS, or at least I'll wait a little while; so I've been learning a > bit about what is and isn't possible from this list and some other > reading. > One of the things that won me over to Ubuntu/Linux in the beginning was > the ease of backing up and making custom bootable USB-pendrives and > live-CD's. > I know that the remastersys dev seems to be less than enthusiastic > regarding this program of late. (of late means more than a year actually) > Why is the question. Is the software fragile, bugs just waiting to pop out > with any changes and updates, or does he just not have the time to give to > proper maintenence, (with out more compensation anyway), or is there some > issue with the latest Debian/Ubuntu releases that complicates things? > Last I heard he was indicating the second, but who knows. > AnywayI hope remastersys dev resumes, &/or some other similarly usable > program is available. Abnd of course we need this program to be > accessible. > I can't believe there's nothing in precise to take remastersys's place. > Have you Googled for this, or checked Precise's release notes, change-log > and similar documentation? > I'm going to do a quick search , but don't have much time right now. I'll > let you know if I find anything I'll let you know, and please do the same > for me. > -- > B.H. > > > On Sat, May 19, 2012 at 10:26:24PM +0200, Milton wrote: >> Hi all, >> In Natty I used Remastersys with Orca but I could not find this in >> Precise Unity 2D. Is there an alternative that is accessible with Orca? I >> notice the application to create a start up disc which is not accissible >> with Orca. >> Milton > >> -- >> Ubuntu-accessibility mailing list >> Ubuntu-accessibility at lists.ubuntu.com >> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility > From alex.midence at gmail.com Fri May 18 15:57:46 2012 From: alex.midence at gmail.com (Alex Midence) Date: Fri, 18 May 2012 10:57:46 -0500 Subject: [orca-list] at-spi2-core 2.4.2 available for testing in Ubuntu precise proposed. In-Reply-To: <20120517035610.GB5940@acapella.yelavich.home> References: <20120517035610.GB5940@acapella.yelavich.home> Message-ID: <015801cd350e$f88bacd0$e9a30670$@gmail.com> Ran updates and installed this yesterday. Thanks. Alex M -----Original Message----- From: orca-list-bounces at gnome.org [mailto:orca-list-bounces at gnome.org] On Behalf Of Luke Yelavich Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 10:56 PM To: orca-list at gnome.org; Ubuntu Accessibility Mailing List Subject: [orca-list] at-spi2-core 2.4.2 available for testing in Ubuntu precise proposed. Hey folks, As per Orca, at-spi2-core 2.4.2 is available for testing in Ubuntu precise proposed. Instructions on how to enable and test packages from precise-proposed are found in the relevant launchpad bug, https://launchpad.net/bugs/999404. Please test and leave feedback in the bug. Thanks. Luke _______________________________________________ orca-list mailing list orca-list at gnome.org http://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. The manual is at http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp From jacky.alcine at thesii.org Mon May 21 15:28:48 2012 From: jacky.alcine at thesii.org (Jacky Alcine) Date: Mon, 21 May 2012 11:28:48 -0400 Subject: Meeting Today Message-ID: As a last minute reminder, we're holding a meeting at 18:15 UTC[1] on Freenode in #sii regarding the Institute and its future. You can get a rundown of the agenda at [2]. Thank you. 1. http://timeanddate.com/worldclock/meetingdetails.html?year=2012&month=5&day=21&hour=18&min=15&sec=0&p1=179&p2=262 2. http://thesii.org/wiki/Meetings/Agenda-20120621 -- ------------------------------ Synthetic Intellect Institute One Vision, One Purpose Trustee at www.thesii.org ------------------------------ From hanksmith at hanksmith.net Wed May 23 03:49:03 2012 From: hanksmith at hanksmith.net (Hank Smith) Date: Tue, 22 May 2012 20:49:03 -0700 Subject: accessing the root directory from unity in ubuntu 12.04? Message-ID: <4FBC5E2F.1060403@hanksmith.net> Hello I am trying to install my voxin tts engin and need to copy it to the main directory of my root in ubuntu 12.04how do I find this using unity? I don't see a my places unity equivolent. Hank -- personal email: hanksmith at hanksmith.net facebook: http://www.facebook.com/hanksmith5 zello: hanksmith5 Klango: hanksmith Skype: hank.smith966 Amateur radio call sign: ke7ief check out my Youtube video of a song I recorded in Nashville Tennessee! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mqut5Bi3e7A also you can find my youtube channel at: http://www.youtube.com/hanksmith2011 From milton at tomaatnet.nl Wed May 23 06:21:15 2012 From: milton at tomaatnet.nl (Milton) Date: Wed, 23 May 2012 08:21:15 +0200 Subject: metacity folder and alt short keystrokes Message-ID: Hi all, I did a fresh install of Ubuntu Precise and got Orca 3.4.1 running in Unity 2D. When Alt_Tab for switching windows, Control_Alt_right-arrow to switch to the next workspace and Control_Super_D for minimizing all windows won't work deleting the .gconf/apps/metacity folder solves the problem after logging out and logging in. Fortunately Control_Alt_T to open a terminal, Alt_F1 to the launcher still doing fine when this problem occurs. The next time I starts up the machine I have the same problem with the Alt_Tab, etc. Do I miss something else to do for this problem to solve? Milton -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hammera at pickup.hu Wed May 23 07:31:10 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Wed, 23 May 2012 09:31:10 +0200 Subject: metacity folder and alt short keystrokes In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4FBC923E.1030107@pickup.hu> Not gsettings-data-convert service generating some time not right converted data during the conversion when converting Metacity related keybindings? Why happening lot of type mismatch this situation with more old metacity keybinding gconf keys? Example output if I run gnome-control-center keyboard command in terminal: GConf Error: Type mismatch: Expected `string' got `list' for key /apps/metacity/window_keybindings/move_to_workspace_left What the proper component to report this issue? Oldest time I reported this issue under Launchpad.net with Metacity related, and now reported in Bugzilla after I readed Milton letter with dconf component with following report: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=676616 Note: In Bugzilla the latest not master version of dconf component is 0.12, but in Ubuntu 12.04 packaged with 0.5.1-2 version. Attila From hammera at pickup.hu Wed May 23 07:42:22 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Wed, 23 May 2012 09:42:22 +0200 Subject: In Nautilus file browser if the user want renaming a file, creating new document and folder the edit box isn't marking editable Message-ID: <4FBC94DE.1030202@pickup.hu> Hy, In Nautilus 3.4 version if an Onboard or Orca user want renaming a file, creating a folder or a new document, the presenting edit box isn't marked editable. Possible writing the new value, but A11y applications doesn't possible detecting the change. In Orca for example the user doesn't possible to get screen reader output when want deleting a character. The problem is following with wrote the original reporter: The AtspiAccessible associated with this widget apparently isn't marked editable, i.e. accessible.state_set doesn't contain ATSPI_STATE_EDITABLE. It would be great if this could be corrected. Other osks may be affected too. This is the original bug report for Onboard: https://bugs.launchpad.net/onboard/+bug/936310 This issue is reported with 2012. March 20th. If GNOME developers not fixing this issue with Nautilus 3.4.3 version, Ubuntu level possible fixing this issue? Accessible rename, folder and document creation is an important function. Upstream report link is following: https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=672498 To happening a possible fix with Ubuntu level if GNOME developers not fixing this issue in Nautilus 3.4.3, need doing a Launchpad.net bugreport? Attila From milton at tomaatnet.nl Thu May 24 06:36:07 2012 From: milton at tomaatnet.nl (Milton) Date: Thu, 24 May 2012 08:36:07 +0200 Subject: workspace switcher is not accissible with Orca Message-ID: Hi all, I did a fresh install of Ubuntu Precise and got Orca 3.4.1 running in Unity 2D. With Control_Alt_arrow-left/right I switch to another workspace. I like to work in 3 or more workspaces. With Alt_F1 and down-arrow I found the workspace switcher but Orca only says pane and nothing else. With the flat review Orca go silent. Can you confirm? It will be very helpfull if the workspace switcher is accessible with Orca. Milton -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From krecoun at gmail.com Thu May 24 12:42:12 2012 From: krecoun at gmail.com (=?UTF-8?B?Vm9qdMSbY2ggUG9sw6HFoWVr?=) Date: Thu, 24 May 2012 14:42:12 +0200 Subject: ability to display icons of mounted volumes on desktop Message-ID: <4FBE2CA4.1010306@gmail.com> Hi, I have stumbled over an interesting tool, called unity-2d-settings. It allows you change just few settings, but displaying icons of mounted volumes is among them. I hope it will help someone. Just run in terminal: /sudo add-apt-repository* ppa:krytarik/tuxgarage*/ sudo apt-get update sudo apt-get install unity-2d-settings Vojta -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From chaltain at gmail.com Thu May 24 14:16:23 2012 From: chaltain at gmail.com (Christopher Chaltain) Date: Thu, 24 May 2012 09:16:23 -0500 Subject: workspace switcher is not accissible with Orca In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <4FBE42B7.2020607@gmail.com> IMHO, I'm not sure how important it is to get the workspace switcher accessible. I can't imagine it's easier to use the workspace switcher than it is to use the hot keys to navigate around your workspaces. Although maybe the workspace switcher has some other features I'm ignorant of. In my vanilla install of Ubuntu Precise with Unity 2D, I start off with four workspaces. They're laid out in a grid, so I can get to them with the four control+alt+arrow-keys. The left and right arrow keys will only take me between two of the workspaces. I have to use the up and down arrow keys to get to the other two. On 24/05/12 01:36, Milton wrote: > Hi all, > I did a fresh install of Ubuntu Precise and got Orca 3.4.1 running in > Unity 2D. > With Control_Alt_arrow-left/right I switch to another workspace. > I like to work in 3 or more workspaces. > With Alt_F1 and down-arrow I found the workspace switcher but Orca only > says pane and nothing else. With the flat review Orca go silent. Can you > confirm? It will be very helpfull if the workspace switcher is > accessible with Orca. > Milton > > -- Christopher (CJ) chaltain at Gmail From ka1cey at gmail.com Thu May 24 14:21:05 2012 From: ka1cey at gmail.com (Dave Hunt) Date: Thu, 24 May 2012 10:21:05 -0400 Subject: workspace switcher is not accissible with Orca In-Reply-To: <4FBE42B7.2020607@gmail.com> References: <4FBE42B7.2020607@gmail.com> Message-ID: <4FBE43D1.8040003@gmail.com> Hi, One could take this even further by setting shortcut keys for moving to workspaces 1 through n, making this a one-keystroke operation. Unless there's something critical in the workspace switcher, that needs accessibility, I'm ok with this being filed as a low-priority, wishlist sort of item in Orca's bug tracker. Cheers, Dave On 05/24/2012 10:16 AM, Christopher Chaltain wrote: > IMHO, I'm not sure how important it is to get the workspace switcher > accessible. I can't imagine it's easier to use the workspace switcher > than it is to use the hot keys to navigate around your workspaces. > Although maybe the workspace switcher has some other features I'm > ignorant of. > > In my vanilla install of Ubuntu Precise with Unity 2D, I start off with > four workspaces. They're laid out in a grid, so I can get to them with > the four control+alt+arrow-keys. The left and right arrow keys will only > take me between two of the workspaces. I have to use the up and down > arrow keys to get to the other two. > > On 24/05/12 01:36, Milton wrote: >> Hi all, >> I did a fresh install of Ubuntu Precise and got Orca 3.4.1 running in >> Unity 2D. >> With Control_Alt_arrow-left/right I switch to another workspace. >> I like to work in 3 or more workspaces. >> With Alt_F1 and down-arrow I found the workspace switcher but Orca only >> says pane and nothing else. With the flat review Orca go silent. Can you >> confirm? It will be very helpfull if the workspace switcher is >> accessible with Orca. >> Milton >> >> > > From alex.midence at gmail.com Thu May 24 13:12:27 2012 From: alex.midence at gmail.com (Alex Midence) Date: Thu, 24 May 2012 08:12:27 -0500 Subject: [orca-list] workspace switcher is not accissible with Orca In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I can confirm. Mine's doing the exact same thing. Alex M On 5/24/12, Milton wrote: > Hi all, > I did a fresh install of Ubuntu Precise and got Orca 3.4.1 running in Unity > 2D. > With Control_Alt_arrow-left/right I switch to another workspace. > I like to work in 3 or more workspaces. > With Alt_F1 and down-arrow I found the workspace switcher but Orca only says > pane and nothing else. With the flat review Orca go silent. Can you confirm? > It will be very helpfull if the workspace switcher is accessible with Orca. > Milton From alex.midence at gmail.com Thu May 24 15:24:03 2012 From: alex.midence at gmail.com (Alex Midence) Date: Thu, 24 May 2012 10:24:03 -0500 Subject: [orca-list] workspace switcher is not accissible with Orca In-Reply-To: <4FBE42B7.2020607@gmail.com> References: <4FBE42B7.2020607@gmail.com> Message-ID: I can see value in it if you have more than 4 workspaces. On my Lucid Vinux installation, I got myself up to 12 workspaces. I stopped using more than about five of them because it was too much of a pain to get to, say workspace 11 or something like that. Gnome and Unity make workspaces a bit hard to mess with. I haven't bothered doing that ever since. KDE, on the other hand, is absolutely fantastic for multiple workspaces incorporating the function keys as hotkeys for jumping to particular ones and making it extremely easy to add or remove how many workspaces you use. I can't wait till all its a11y issues are worked out as I think it more adequately fits my personal pc user style than Gnome does. If I didn't use a screen reader, I'm sure I'd've used it from the beginning. Alex M alex M On 5/24/12, Christopher Chaltain wrote: > IMHO, I'm not sure how important it is to get the workspace switcher > accessible. I can't imagine it's easier to use the workspace switcher > than it is to use the hot keys to navigate around your workspaces. > Although maybe the workspace switcher has some other features I'm > ignorant of. > > In my vanilla install of Ubuntu Precise with Unity 2D, I start off with > four workspaces. They're laid out in a grid, so I can get to them with > the four control+alt+arrow-keys. The left and right arrow keys will only > take me between two of the workspaces. I have to use the up and down > arrow keys to get to the other two. > > On 24/05/12 01:36, Milton wrote: >> Hi all, >> I did a fresh install of Ubuntu Precise and got Orca 3.4.1 running in >> Unity 2D. >> With Control_Alt_arrow-left/right I switch to another workspace. >> I like to work in 3 or more workspaces. >> With Alt_F1 and down-arrow I found the workspace switcher but Orca only >> says pane and nothing else. With the flat review Orca go silent. Can you >> confirm? It will be very helpfull if the workspace switcher is >> accessible with Orca. >> Milton >> >> > > > -- > Christopher (CJ) > chaltain at Gmail > _______________________________________________ > orca-list mailing list > orca-list at gnome.org > https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/orca-list > Visit http://live.gnome.org/Orca for more information on Orca. > The manual is at > http://library.gnome.org/users/gnome-access-guide/nightly/ats-2.html > The FAQ is at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/FrequentlyAskedQuestions > Log bugs and feature requests at http://bugzilla.gnome.org > Find out how to help at http://live.gnome.org/Orca/HowCanIHelp > From gervin at cableone.net Sat May 26 19:44:22 2012 From: gervin at cableone.net (Lenny) Date: Sat, 26 May 2012 14:44:22 -0500 Subject: ready to run Ubuntu 12.04 on a USB drive Message-ID: <8CFCB07FCE0441079E4AE672A511523C@your2c061f0461> Hi, I just installed Ubuntu 12.04 on a thumbdrive, and I haven't booted up yet. I will be using Orca. >From what I read from this list, I take it that most of the Orca users are using Unity-2d. Is this still the case, or have any of you found a way to install Gnome, and how difficult is that, if I go that way? If I recall, I will boot up, and as it goes right into Ubuntu, since it is on a thumb drive, I will need to log out, and do control + S, or should I call up Orca before logging out? Thanks. BTW, I get messages in digest mode, so how do I reply to the list when it is a message that is only in the digest message? Thanks again. Glenn From rkcole72984 at gmail.com Sat May 26 21:02:47 2012 From: rkcole72984 at gmail.com (Robert Cole) Date: Sat, 26 May 2012 14:02:47 -0700 Subject: ready to run Ubuntu 12.04 on a USB drive In-Reply-To: <8CFCB07FCE0441079E4AE672A511523C@your2c061f0461> References: <8CFCB07FCE0441079E4AE672A511523C@your2c061f0461> Message-ID: <4FC144F7.4030506@gmail.com> Hello, Glenn. When you boot up your flash drive into Ubuntu, you *should* eventually hear a drum when the system starts. When you hear this sound, you can press CTRL+S to start Orca up. At this point you can choose to Try Ubuntu or Install Ubuntu. In either case, you shoudl be defaulted to Unity 2D as it still is the most accessible of the two environments. If you decide to install Ubuntu, you can easily install GNOME Shell and GNOME Fallback Session once Ubuntu is installed by the issuing the following commands: For GNOME Shell: sudo apt-get install gnome-shell For GNOME Fallback Session: sudo apt-get install gnome-session-fallback The last I tried it, the login screen seemed quite accessible to Orca. When at the login screen on an installed Ubuntu 12.04 system, you can simply press CTRL+S to get Orca up and running. I just checked it, and it even reads the menu for different desktop environment sessions (e.g. Ubuntu, Ubuntu-2D, GNOME, etc). I hope that this information is helpful to you. Take care. On 05/26/2012 12:44 PM, Lenny wrote: > Hi, > I just installed Ubuntu 12.04 on a thumbdrive, and I haven't booted up yet. > I will be using Orca. > From what I read from this list, I take it that most of the Orca users are > using Unity-2d. > Is this still the case, or have any of you found a way to install Gnome, and > how difficult is that, if I go that way? > If I recall, I will boot up, and as it goes right into Ubuntu, since it is > on a thumb drive, I will need to log out, and do control + S, or should I > call up Orca before logging out? > Thanks. > BTW, I get messages in digest mode, so how do I reply to the list when it is > a message that is only in the digest message? > Thanks again. > Glenn > > From gervin at cableone.net Sat May 26 23:57:13 2012 From: gervin at cableone.net (Lenny) Date: Sat, 26 May 2012 18:57:13 -0500 Subject: help booting to a compaq Message-ID: Hi, I am trying to get this Compaq to boot to the USB drive. It is a Compaq f750 with Vista running on it. I should be able to hole down one of the F-keys on start-up, but trying this, and a number of arrows down on some of the F-keys has yielded no successful boots. Does anyone here know how Compaqs typically offer the temporary boot options? Thanks. Glenn From cjk at teamcharliesangels.com Sun May 27 00:20:42 2012 From: cjk at teamcharliesangels.com (Charlie Kravetz) Date: Sat, 26 May 2012 18:20:42 -0600 Subject: help booting to a compaq In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20120526182042.69d64094@teamcharliesangels.com> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Sat, 26 May 2012 18:57:13 -0500 Lenny wrote: > Hi, > I am trying to get this Compaq to boot to the USB drive. > It is a Compaq f750 with Vista running on it. > I should be able to hole down one of the F-keys on start-up, but trying > this, and a number of arrows down on some of the F-keys has yielded no > successful boots. > Does anyone here know how Compaqs typically offer the temporary boot > options? > Thanks. > > Glenn > > The two Compaqs I have are different. One uses F2, and one uses F8, which are kind of unusual. They are also extremely fast booting, and it is hard to hit right. I have to push and hold the key right after the memory checks, but it seems there is only about two seconds or so to hit it. Sometimes I have to try about 8 or 10 times to get the bios screens. There is always a delay between hitting the key and the bios coming on screen. - -- Charlie Kravetz Linux Registered User Number 425914 [http://counter.li.org/] Never let anyone steal your DREAM. [http://keepingdreams.com] -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.11 (GNU/Linux) iQEcBAEBAgAGBQJPwXNaAAoJEFNEIRz9dxbASJgH/ArPdQj9EaWhOQiGc29xnsDg uVulmm+ilqd35OWpW2hTaSdvT1vnWfXLnE9m1xf0wjk1fcFwsgQkb1hd/Yp7CJw/ AYMOplzsEIxRakfOa5ZjP08YWazjv+50bfYL6eV1ovLR0HYrQaQvZRFidbSjEcgN tYoo/5LtoBhWG3GCJHdX5b0ocVvmkInowXzXAC84++0VMKTYHU0luVA0fSAQ5jKd iM2v2pYf5NapDqhd2Yns4uTng5MglmYVlFoqRg6CWkTkxPzcL4CuLOkU1Ne2jM8m G9k7gLrILLMsSneDjWzde6akmO1k6DUnQE+vRhMmdHrkghFlCOKDwhcUxfJOJKc= =KtB4 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From hammera at pickup.hu Sun May 27 06:23:13 2012 From: hammera at pickup.hu (Hammer Attila) Date: Sun, 27 May 2012 08:23:13 +0200 Subject: metacity folder and alt short keystrokes In-Reply-To: <4FBC923E.1030107@pickup.hu> References: <4FBC923E.1030107@pickup.hu> Message-ID: <4FC1C851.4020508@pickup.hu> Hy, My upstream report Ryan Lortie wrote following comment: "hi Attila, This is not a bug in dconf, but rather in metacity. The bug no longer exists because metacity switched to using GSettings a while ago (which is quite a lot more strict when it comes to checking types vs. the schemas). Ubuntu has been intentionally using an older version of metacity for some time specifically because they needed the GConf support for compatibility with Compiz (which has not yet made the change to GSettings, but will soon). Long story short: this bug is already fixed in GNOME and will soon be fixed in Ubuntu as well (ie: before 12.10 release)." Possible fixing anyway with this type mismatch error in Ubuntu 12.04 too? This type mismatch error difficulting Metacity related keybindings customizations, because we don't known when will be forgot Metacity the customized keystrokes, or when will be happening this bug. Attila From gervin at cableone.net Sun May 27 18:18:42 2012 From: gervin at cableone.net (Lenny) Date: Sun, 27 May 2012 13:18:42 -0500 Subject: problems booting Ubuntu Message-ID: <8CFBA31F22224B70961E24D3356C823B@your2c061f0461> Hi, I used the latest Pendrive Universal USB Installer to install Ubuntu,the i386 desktop version onto a thumbdrive. I have done this with previously versions of Ubuntu, so it is not my first time of doing this. It is strange, on two different drives with 12.04 on them, I boot up to the boot window, and it only beeps. It allows me to go into help, or advanced settings, like repair Ubuntu, but it is expecting a CD drive, not a thumbdrive. so far, I haven't gotten to try booting it up, because I cannot get past that first screen. This is on a Compaq Presario with Vista installed on it, 2GB of RAM. I have booted up to Ubuntu 10.10 on a CD, so it should work. Does Ubuntu have a better USB installer that can be downloaded? Thanks From gervin at cableone.net Sun May 27 23:25:18 2012 From: gervin at cableone.net (Lenny) Date: Sun, 27 May 2012 18:25:18 -0500 Subject: log out to switch to Unity-2D Message-ID: Hi, I downloaded another copy of Ubuntu 12.04, and it booted up. So much for the torrents being more reliable. I have never had a bad download using my browser's download option, but yesterday I downloaded 12.04 with a torrent, and although I got it fast, it must have been corrupt. Anyway, in 12.04, I haven't found a way to log out, the power button does not offer that as an option, and alt + F1 does not give me a menu. I want to log out to try to switch to Unity-2D. Thanks for any help. Glenn From gervin at cableone.net Mon May 28 00:37:09 2012 From: gervin at cableone.net (Lenny) Date: Sun, 27 May 2012 19:37:09 -0500 Subject: logged out but cannot log back in Message-ID: <4A7866CFB0794F7D8B00D0BAB70889F5@your2c061f0461> Hi, Since I could not find a set of menus in Ubuntu 12.04, to log out, I pressed control + alt + del, and that worked. I went into session options, and there was the Ubuntu-2D, so I go into that, but I cannot get back to the desktop, the only other option is password, but I have tried a blank, I have tried typing in ubuntu, and I don't know what else to do. This is a live session on a USB drive. Glenn From chaltain at gmail.com Mon May 28 02:23:36 2012 From: chaltain at gmail.com (Christopher Chaltain) Date: Sun, 27 May 2012 21:23:36 -0500 Subject: logged out but cannot log back in In-Reply-To: <4A7866CFB0794F7D8B00D0BAB70889F5@your2c061f0461> References: <4A7866CFB0794F7D8B00D0BAB70889F5@your2c061f0461> Message-ID: <4FC2E1A8.3050604@gmail.com> I don't think this is what you're asking, but on Ubuntu 12.04 the shutdown option is in the driver pull down. So, from your desktop, hit F10, left arrow to the driver menu option and then arrow down to shutdown. On 27/05/12 19:37, Lenny wrote: > Hi, > Since I could not find a set of menus in Ubuntu 12.04, to log out, I pressed > control + alt + del, and that worked. > I went into session options, and there was the Ubuntu-2D, so I go into that, > but I cannot get back to the desktop, the only other option is password, but > I have tried a blank, I have tried typing in ubuntu, and I don't know what > else to do. > This is a live session on a USB drive. > Glenn > > -- Christopher (CJ) chaltain at Gmail From gervin at cableone.net Mon May 28 03:12:41 2012 From: gervin at cableone.net (Lenny) Date: Sun, 27 May 2012 22:12:41 -0500 Subject: help with Ubuntu 12.04 - keyboard commands? Message-ID: Hi, here are some problems I am having with my live session of Ubuntu. I Googled Ubuntu keyboard commands, but many of them don't work. I cannot bring up the applications panel so I can change some things. Also, when I log out, to try and switch to Unity-2D, I cannot log back in, so I have to do a hard reset to get back in. Also, after installing Orca, and telling it to start automatically, that option left the main Orca page, and it does not start automatically. I did get the latest Voxin installed, so the voice is tolerable. I do have a large persistence file, 4096 MB, on an 8GB drive, so I don't think it's out of storage. Is there a command in terminal for getting to the panels? Thanks. Glenn From jdashiel at shellworld.net Mon May 28 03:14:07 2012 From: jdashiel at shellworld.net (Jude DaShiell) Date: Sun, 27 May 2012 23:14:07 -0400 (EDT) Subject: help with Ubuntu 12.04 - keyboard commands? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Have you tried alt-f1 yet?On Sun, 27 May 2012, Lenny wrote: > Hi, > here are some problems I am having with my live session of Ubuntu. > I Googled Ubuntu keyboard commands, but many of them don't work. > I cannot bring up the applications panel so I can change some things. > Also, when I log out, to try and switch to Unity-2D, I cannot log back in, > so I have to do a hard reset to get back in. > Also, after installing Orca, and telling it to start automatically, that > option left the main Orca page, and it does not start automatically. > I did get the latest Voxin installed, so the voice is tolerable. > I do have a large persistence file, 4096 MB, on an 8GB drive, so I don't > think it's out of storage. > Is there a command in terminal for getting to the panels? > Thanks. > > Glenn > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- Jude From gervin at cableone.net Mon May 28 03:52:01 2012 From: gervin at cableone.net (Lenny) Date: Sun, 27 May 2012 22:52:01 -0500 Subject: help with Ubuntu 12.04 - keyboard commands? References: Message-ID: That was my first attempt, it does nothing that I can tell. Glenn ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jude DaShiell" To: "Lenny" Cc: "Ubuntu List" Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2012 10:14 PM Subject: Re: help with Ubuntu 12.04 - keyboard commands? Have you tried alt-f1 yet?On Sun, 27 May 2012, Lenny wrote: > Hi, > here are some problems I am having with my live session of Ubuntu. > I Googled Ubuntu keyboard commands, but many of them don't work. > I cannot bring up the applications panel so I can change some things. > Also, when I log out, to try and switch to Unity-2D, I cannot log back in, > so I have to do a hard reset to get back in. > Also, after installing Orca, and telling it to start automatically, that > option left the main Orca page, and it does not start automatically. > I did get the latest Voxin installed, so the voice is tolerable. > I do have a large persistence file, 4096 MB, on an 8GB drive, so I don't > think it's out of storage. > Is there a command in terminal for getting to the panels? > Thanks. > > Glenn > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- Jude From jdashiel at shellworld.net Mon May 28 04:11:36 2012 From: jdashiel at shellworld.net (Jude DaShiell) Date: Mon, 28 May 2012 00:11:36 -0400 (EDT) Subject: help with Ubuntu 12.04 - keyboard commands? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: You should have heard orca speak desktop when orca starts up. If you have the orca window coming up, you may find it useful to run orca minimized uncheck show orca window at startup. If you don't hear desktop, try tabbing around and let's find out what you do hear.On Sun, 27 May 2012, Lenny wrote: > That was my first attempt, it does nothing that I can tell. > Glenn > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jude DaShiell" > To: "Lenny" > Cc: "Ubuntu List" > Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2012 10:14 PM > Subject: Re: help with Ubuntu 12.04 - keyboard commands? > > > Have you tried alt-f1 yet?On Sun, 27 May 2012, Lenny wrote: > > > Hi, > > here are some problems I am having with my live session of Ubuntu. > > I Googled Ubuntu keyboard commands, but many of them don't work. > > I cannot bring up the applications panel so I can change some things. > > Also, when I log out, to try and switch to Unity-2D, I cannot log back in, > > so I have to do a hard reset to get back in. > > Also, after installing Orca, and telling it to start automatically, that > > option left the main Orca page, and it does not start automatically. > > I did get the latest Voxin installed, so the voice is tolerable. > > I do have a large persistence file, 4096 MB, on an 8GB drive, so I don't > > think it's out of storage. > > Is there a command in terminal for getting to the panels? > > Thanks. > > > > Glenn > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > Jude > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- Jude From gervin at cableone.net Mon May 28 04:32:51 2012 From: gervin at cableone.net (Lenny) Date: Sun, 27 May 2012 23:32:51 -0500 Subject: help with Ubuntu 12.04 - keyboard commands? References: Message-ID: <12DAC2F2638D4FA7BE8AC16AFD072D50@your2c061f0461> I always turn that off whenever I set up Orca. Keep in mind, that I have been using Ubuntu for a long time, so these problems are unique to 12.04. Thanks. Glenn ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jude DaShiell" To: "Lenny" Cc: "Ubuntu List" Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2012 11:11 PM Subject: Re: help with Ubuntu 12.04 - keyboard commands? You should have heard orca speak desktop when orca starts up. If you have the orca window coming up, you may find it useful to run orca minimized uncheck show orca window at startup. If you don't hear desktop, try tabbing around and let's find out what you do hear.On Sun, 27 May 2012, Lenny wrote: > That was my first attempt, it does nothing that I can tell. > Glenn > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Jude DaShiell" > To: "Lenny" > Cc: "Ubuntu List" > Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2012 10:14 PM > Subject: Re: help with Ubuntu 12.04 - keyboard commands? > > > Have you tried alt-f1 yet?On Sun, 27 May 2012, Lenny wrote: > > > Hi, > > here are some problems I am having with my live session of Ubuntu. > > I Googled Ubuntu keyboard commands, but many of them don't work. > > I cannot bring up the applications panel so I can change some things. > > Also, when I log out, to try and switch to Unity-2D, I cannot log back > > in, > > so I have to do a hard reset to get back in. > > Also, after installing Orca, and telling it to start automatically, that > > option left the main Orca page, and it does not start automatically. > > I did get the latest Voxin installed, so the voice is tolerable. > > I do have a large persistence file, 4096 MB, on an 8GB drive, so I don't > > think it's out of storage. > > Is there a command in terminal for getting to the panels? > > Thanks. > > > > Glenn > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > Jude > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- Jude