[OT] life in different places; "to work or not to work?"

[Duncan Anderson]

On Monday, 27 March 2006 13:47, Michael Shigorin wrote:
> Thanks, Duncan.
>
> On Sun, Mar 19, 2006 at 07:00:36AM +0200, Duncan Anderson wrote:
> > In my part of rural South Africa, "wasting time" surfing the
> > internet would solve one of the major problems faced by young
> > people: boredom.
>
> What would they eat?
Well, that isn't such a big problem, because it is very easy to grow stuff 
here, and there is a lot of fruit growing wild all over the place, like 
bananas, papayas, mangoes, guavas, etc. 
>
> > If you have nothing to do, and no resources, it is not
> > surprising if you go off to the nearest town and do some crime.
>
> It is.  I've met this "logic" both in Kazakhstan (closer to
> China) -- when "dzhigit" is not up to some work, but still he
> wants to eat.  And usualy has large enough family which he's
> brought with himself from mountains down to Alma-Ata.
>
> So they find it natural to go raping and pillaging, even if they
> have enough land -- and good land -- to prosper *if* they worked.
>
I agree with you that this sort of behaviour is unjustifiable. All I was 
saying is that perhaps if these young people had something to occupy their 
minds they might resist the urge to go and "rape and pillage" as you so 
accurately describe it.
> Is it really impossible to move to a place where agriculture
> is striving and put one's hand to it?  I've quite forgotten even
> those pieces of Africa's geography and economy that was taught
> at school (let alone knowing it is/was accurate) -- but is it?
>
Some parts of Africa are not conducive to agriculture at all, due to lack of 
water. That does not apply to the part I live in, where there is plenty of 
water. (I live in the far south-eastern part of Africa, just south of 
Mocambique, in KwaZulu-Natal Province, in South Africa.)
> Not that I'm thinking African youth is only to plant potatoes
> -- just don't think they're that different from us here, even
> if the land is very different.  So far folks were very the same
> and even the life problems were similar, be it NZ or UK or UA
> or KZ.
I agree with what you are saying there. Everyone has the same basic needs, 
wherever they are.
> One of folks in our yard (living in a flat almost above me) --
> I don't know for sure but seems like he was narcoman several
> years ago -- managed to change that and try and climb out of that
> boredom, he's studying and working.  Seems like "working" is what
> keeps from boredom.  Glad for him.
>
He is to be congratulated. It is very hard to recover from a drug addiction 
and become a productive person.

> > Rip off the rich folks. It certainly relieves the boredom and
> > you may end up with some money to spend on "civilised" items
> > like coca-cola, KFC, etc. My wife's purse was snatched by an
> > "idle youth" and several purchases were made with one of her
> > credit cards, despite us having reported it stolen. The
> > interesting thing is what was bought: KFC and shoes.
>
> Sorry, what is KFC?  Fried chicken like google suggests?
Kentucky Fried Chicken. (Like MacDonalds, a fast food chain)
>
> > A $100 laptop would go a long way in alleviating the main
> > problems of boredom through unemployment and lack of education.
>
> Some folks I know might say that either narcotics or euthanasia
> (depending on "ethics" they tend to proclaim) would be way better
> "social cure" for such an "idle youth"...
>
I also know some people like that, but I don't agree with such fascist views.
> I don't support these but I also can imagine how folks will be
> desiring $1000 laptops and what will follow if those who "helped"
> them this way didn't pay attention to teach them to work *and*
> find joy in what they're doing.
>
You are right. These laptops will be useless without some "mentoring", at 
least in the early days.
> George Soros destroyed quite a few leaders of science olympic
> "games" here (and AFAIH in Russia), maybe even not wanting it:
> the top prize was a computer and those who won it weren't #1
> next time, rather #3 with significant tension.  They've read
> stuff (locally; there was no noticeable internet here ten years
> ago).  They've programmed things.  They've played games.
> But all in all, it has *widely hurt* their study and their
> abilities.
>
> Three friends of mine were #1s there (in chemistry, physics and
> math); last time I was runner-up (7th place after 1 + 2x2 + 3x3
> or so in chemistry).  One of them is dead by now, the other
> worked for a few years as a computer club admin while he was
> absolutely brilliant scientist; third is in Canada.
> We all should have been 27 this year.
>
> > The "wasting of time" referred to by the previous poster would
> > be highly beneficial in terms of giving people a glimpse of the
> > world beyond the narrow confines of their existence, and it
> > would certainly have a hugely educative effect.  My 2c worth.
>
> But what would they do when they want to eat, again?
To eat they need to work. If they can grow food, that's great. If not, they 
need to find jobs. If there are no jobs to be found for unskilled, uneducated 
people, then they have to find ways of becoming educated. It's not a simple 
situation.
> It's kind of recurring item they might even note on
> their notebook calendars.
I think a major difference between this part of Africa and the Ukraine is that 
people from that part of the world have had an excellent grounding in 
science, mathematics, etc. One of the legacies of the Soviet Union is an 
abundance of highly educated people. On the other hand, in South Africa there 
is a severe shortage of scientifically educated people, hence the attraction 
inherent in technological items which may be conducive to self-instruction.
>
> --
>  ---- WBR, Michael Shigorin <mike at altlinux.ru>
>   ------ Linux.Kiev http://www.linux.kiev.ua/

Your observations are very thought-provoking. Thank you, Michael.

regards
Duncan

		
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